# The Rise and Fall in Bitcoin Value **URL:** \ **Category:** Out Of Pod Experience\ **Created:** [January 18, 2022, 1:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290 "2022-01-18T13:41:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 77
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2022, 6:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1527 "2022-08-21T18:42:52Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > So you think an app the entire country has access to would only benefit one man? No, the 20% are affected. And all their money is halved, kinda like a reverse Jita scam. But keep denying it. > [@Aaron](#): > > This is ignorance at a very high level. Yes, you keep denying those who converted to BTC wallet had their money halved. > [@Aaron](#): > > Thanks god for BTC it stops folks like you promoting some backwards way of doing things. Okay, good, I’ll NOT steal half of their money. Not that I would ever try and steal half of the money from 20% of El Salvadorians. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2022, 6:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1528 "2022-08-21T18:46:52Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > Yes, you keep denying those who converted to BTC wallet had their money halved. My income was affected too, I’m not immune from the effect of BTC price changes. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2022, 6:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1529 "2022-08-21T18:52:10Z")
Imagine if you had 1 BTC when it got legal tender in El Salvador. Imagine because they probably didn’t have that much. Jun 08, 2020 31,792.55 TODAY 21,484.00 Wow, no (or very low) transaction fees… just a divident of -10,308 ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2022, 6:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1530 "2022-08-21T18:56:02Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > My income was affected too, I’m not immune from the effect of BTC price changes. I feel sorry for you but I hope you can get out with some kind of profit, you did a lot of effort and enterpreneurship to get to your crypto farm. But I see that business as highly volatile and with all those involved, I am afraid it’s some kind of scam. Anything built upon it is and that’s why it’s extremely difficult to find out as it’s like an onion with layers and my eyes burn frequently when I read about what BTC does to certain people. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2022, 6:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1531 "2022-08-21T18:57:35Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > I feel sorry for you but I hope you can get out with some kind of profit, I wasn’t looking for pity and I am still very happy. I have no plans to stop mining. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2022, 6:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1532 "2022-08-21T18:59:04Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > I wasn’t looking for pity and I am still very happy. I have no plans to stop mining. Somehow you are making a profit either in the short or long term and that’s good, but I will keep on voicing my disagreement of the BTC and generally the crypto industry. Crypto coin that is. 🙂 I do use encryption, without hurting people, I hope. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2022, 7:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1533 "2022-08-21T19:07:25Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > Somehow you are making a profit either in the short or long term and that’s good, but I will keep on voicing my disagreement of the BTC and generally the crypto industry. You have to have a good understanding of it in order to do that. otherwise you’ll look silly. I’m unable to be so vocal about something I don’t have a full understanding of. I tend to follow a set process where I seek to understand first before any judgement. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > I am afraid it’s some kind of scam. Governments and millions of people around the world won’t agree. Many intelligent people have invested billions in hardware used to mine Bitcoin, no one on the planet would ever invest that much in a scam. ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2022, 8:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1534 "2022-08-21T20:41:57Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > we should probably stop you from using that energy and mine Bitcoin instead, as it literally ads more value. Creating more numbers on someones drive is not creating any real value for society, energy is wasted while money change hands. That is not how it should be. They should rather construct a big hamster wheel for you, so you can mine it off grid and not use the grid instead, if you are so eager to think its cool to mine btc. Dont use grid because people will need it more than your temporary hype induced virtual gains. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2022, 9:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1535 "2022-08-21T21:24:22Z")
> [@Nana\_Skalski](#): > > Dont use grid because people will need it more than your temporary hype induced virtual gains. The grid operators are in some cases even working together with the miners to stabilize the grid. Poor Nana, no one is listening to you. You should shut down that AC and stop watching youtube though, it’s completely wasted energy that adds no value. > [@Aaron](#): > > Did you conveniently forget to read the part where El Salvadorians don’t have to travel all day just to pay one bill? He is literally just reading and understanding the parts he want to see and that confirm his already made up opinion. We tried to explain it for months and all we get is that he now comes with cheap accusations of profiteering and supporting criminals. I’m done explaining anything again to him. He can steam on his own about how bad Bitcoin is, no one cares. lol ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2022, 9:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1536 "2022-08-21T21:26:56Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > You have to have a good understanding of it in order to do that. otherwise you’ll look silly. I’m unable to be so vocal about something I don’t have a full understanding of. I tend to follow a set process where I seek to understand first before any judgement. I understand, but I rather err on the side of caution than have entire groups of people in financial debt. Some countries are now taking better action against phone scams, which most countries didn’t even has a task force about. Those doing it literally think they are doing a job like everyone else and probably don’t understand that they are actually scamming people. And they also use “intermediate tokens”, but generally they stick with Apple Store / itunes gift cards and the Google Store gift cards. Only one investigator said they exchange those cards (the numbers on it) for crypto to add another layer of anonymity. But then again the average reporter can find them all the way in India… Then again, BTC is very complex and it’s interactions also so yeah, I’ll keep digging around. [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/6/a/4/6a451686d27b9e959dcaa6e1c74941c128634a7e.jpeg ""No, no, Dig up stupid!!"") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b97zJxKEqAk) > [@Aaron](#): > > Governments and millions of people around the world won’t agree. Many intelligent people have invested billions in hardware used to mine Bitcoin, no one on the planet would ever invest that much in a scam. I would press X to doubt that. 😛 > **[U.S. solar power plant backed by over $700 million in government loans goes...](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-solar-bankruptcy-idUSKCN24V3C4/)** > > The owner of a big Nevada solar-thermal power plant that received $737 million in loans from the U.S. Department of Energy filed for bankruptcy on Thursday, according to a court filing, potentially leaving U.S. taxpayers with a whopping bill. Scams come in many forms and sizes. I didn’t even expect that solar array to go bankrupt, if it would service locally it should work, even if it’s low yield, at least it’s not pumping pollution in the air. 🧐 ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2022, 10:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1538 "2022-08-21T22:04:50Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > you’ll get people to believe something is a scam when it’s blatantly not. A report from the [Inspector General’s Office](http://energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2015/08/f26/11-0078-I.pdf), which after more than four years of investigation, concluded that Solyndra officials used inaccurate information to mislead the Department of Energy in its application for a $535 million loan guarantee. The report also found that there were shortcomings with the DOE’s process of managing and approving the loan guarantee to Solyndra. “Solyndra provided the Department with statements, assertions, and certifications that were inaccurate and misleading, misrepresented known facts, and, in some instances, omitted information that was highly relevant to key decisions in the process to award and execute the $535 million loan guarantee. In our view, the investigative record suggests that the actions of certain Solyndra officials were, at best, reckless and irresponsible or, at worst, **an** **orchestrated effort to knowingly and intentionally deceive and mislead the Department.** ” Sounds like a scam to me and the US Department of Energy. I guess you call it business as usual? EDIT: Look, Karak liked how you try to claim a scam is not a scam. You two are quite the pair of ‘truthers’. 😃 The evil governments and me are conspiring to make you look like idiots online whill all the long you were just here to save everyone from the debt slavery… aw man, I feel sorry for how you guys valiant efforts of world freedom are stifled. Good to hear at least Aaron has his tinfoil hat on, that way we can’t read his mind… 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2022, 3:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1539 "2022-08-22T03:08:47Z")
Just use the excess energy to mine bitcoin, then use the bitcoin to buy coal to burn later, when there is an energy deficit. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2022, 4:25am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1540 "2022-08-22T04:25:04Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > Sounds like a scam to me and the US Department of Energy. I guess you call it business as usual? It sounds like the people who run the company are doing something untoward and misleading people to get a loan which is wrong. I can’t see where BTC on it’s own has done anything like this. Yes the investment companies who hold other peoples BTC may seem a bit dodgy but this is based on their unrealistic expectations ( 20% profit on investments). BTC is like an open book everyone can access, surely if it was a scam or if the inventor designed it to be a scam why would the ledger be public? Also why are many countries making laws to support and regulate BTC so that anyone providing BTC or BTC investments have to do it in a specific way? Are you saying that all of these countries can’t tell if BTC is a scam? I’m afraid it’s already been confirmed BTC is not a scam. Analysts who are very smart have approved it. What is an issue is these big companies endorsing that BTC is only an investment when it can also be used as a normal currency. If anything what you’re doing is a scam. You conveniently forget or ignore the benefits of BTC (like El salvadorians no longer needing to travel for a whole day to pay one bill) this is 100% real and I am sure people appreciate this very much. The problem with you is that you know full well this would benefit lots of people. Also normal people can now hold their own cache of value which only they can access. Again if BTC was a scam wouldn’t there be a person or other people able to access your BTC? Doesn’t the fact only you can access it tell you anything!? Fully ignore it if you like but the 100% fact is “The Bank of Aedaxus” is a reality which must be accepted. The issue is Aedaxus is that other people won’t ignore these points that you have and in many cases they will use it to move themselves forward. You had no response for the young Texans who have harnessed waste gas to mine BTC, without them the gas would have just been floating into the air causing problems, This is dismissive, you’re prepared to ignore facts to promote your narrative, what you don’t realise is that many people don’t ignore facts and actually consider them which will create an opinion which is vastly different from yours. The only way to be taken seriously on these matters is if you stop ignoring facts otherwise you could end up being ignored. The world has faced unprecedented borrowing due to covid and we are now feeling the effect of that borrowing. If people think BTC is only an investment then of course they will sell it when the economy is bad. Because there is more BTC available to buy crypto exchanges set the price lower, BTC working as intended. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2022, 7:07am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1541 "2022-08-22T07:07:29Z")
> [@Xeux](#): > > Just use the excess energy to mine bitcoin, then use the bitcoin to buy coal to burn later, when there is an energy deficit. Exactly, they will always produce extra so everyone is covered if there is a sudden spike in usage, there is now a use for that excess which earns money and it can adapt by stopping mining when social use is high. It’s unrealistic when people think there is no wastage, You’d be shocked to know how much supermarkets waste, this is an issue because customer satisfaction must be maintained. In many industries they always have to create more or make more available so that they don’t miss any demand sales as this would result in poor customer satisfaction. Imagine that, you try to buy bread and the supermarket tells you they’re out of stock because they matched the supply with the sales exactly but today was different because Mrs Smith had to buy 2 more loaves of bread. In reality they will make 10 or 15% more bread than the demand so that when Mrs Smith has surprise guests and buys 2 more loaves it wont be a problem. The similar applies to many industries. ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2022, 8:21am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1542 "2022-08-22T08:21:47Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > You should shut down that AC and stop watching youtube though, it’s completely wasted energy that adds no value. Better buy that hamster wheel to mine BTC and make transactions, to assure you will always be able to pay with it. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2022, 2:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1543 "2022-08-22T14:48:44Z")
I know how generators work. I could probably build one if I needed to. I can then hook it up to Gorge Orwell’s corps which will start to rotate when I feed him posts from @Aedaxus, where he talks about how much he desires totalitarian surveillance to be built into money to feel a little bit more safe. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2022, 5:15pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1544 "2022-08-22T17:15:36Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > what you’re doing is a scam. Please contact the authorities. You are telling me I am committing crimes. > **[Scamming People Online Is A Crime | Justice Can Be Just A Click Away](https://www.stuartmillersolicitors.co.uk/scamming-online-uk/)** > > Discover the consequences of online scamming in the UK and the potential jail time that scammers may face. Free Initial consultation. @CCP_Swift please check out who is in the wrong. Apparently I am now accused falsely of a criminal action. A false accusation is also wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2022, 5:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1545 "2022-08-22T17:18:46Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > I can then hook it up to Gorge Orwell’s corps which will start to rotate when I feed him posts from @Aedaxus, where he talks about how much he desires totalitarian surveillance to be built into money to feel a little bit more safe. I think we found a way to make clean energy! Not sure if I supported the BTC surveillance money that loudly, I think that was you mostly? I told you governments will use CBDC if necessary, but I think it’s not useful as the use of BTC is mostly to do things which governments do not approve of. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2022, 5:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1546 "2022-08-22T17:40:07Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > but I think it’s not useful as the use of BTC is mostly to do things which governments do not approve of. It’s funny how you act all outraged because Aaron said you are probably the scammer, and call for the mods. But you have no problem constantly implying that we are criminals or support all sorts of stupid political ■■■■■■■■ you dig up from somewhere. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > I told you governments will use CBDC if necessary They want to use it to better control you. And the way you argue you are clearly in favor of such controls and total surveillance. I’m pretty sure I already provided arguments in this thread why this is bad and I’m also pretty sure that you as always ignored them and just posted some random stuff from the internet instead. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2022, 5:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1547 "2022-08-22T17:40:20Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > It sounds like the people who run the company are doing something untoward and misleading people to get a loan which is wrong. Yes, they mislead people to gain money from it, it’s called fraud or scamming. > [@Aaron](#): > > I can’t see where BTC on it’s own has done anything like this. Yes the investment companies who hold other peoples BTC may seem a bit dodgy but this is based on their unrealistic expectations ( 20% profit on investments). BTC is like an open book everyone can access, surely if it was a scam or if the inventor designed it to be a scam why would the ledger be public? > [@Aaron](#): > > Also why are many countries making laws to support and regulate BTC so that anyone providing BTC or BTC investments have to do it in a specific way? Are you saying that all of these countries can’t tell if BTC is a scam? To be able to use it as a penny stock in most cases and to be able to sue if anyone uses the BTC ‘stocks’ and to be able to see it as an asset so it can be taken by a court of law. Many reasons for laws to be passed. I did not check every law on the entire world though. > [@Aaron](#): > > I’m afraid it’s already been confirmed BTC is not a scam. Analysts who are very smart have approved it. Link maybe? Proof? Nah, just randomly claim stuff, lol. Here is the founder of Paypal in 2018 telling it’s a pump and dump scheme. > **[Bitcoin is the greatest scam in history](https://www.vox.com/2018/4/24/17275202/bitcoin-scam-cryptocurrency-mining-pump-dump-fraud-ico-value)** > > It’s a colossal pump-and-dump scheme, the likes of which the world has never seen. > [@Aaron](#): > > What is an issue is these big companies endorsing that BTC is only an investment when it can also be used as a normal currency. It’s an asset in most countries due to the laws that were made so it’s more used to invest sell and buy as a stock. It’s not in general used as a currency. As people do not need to secretly buy a hat or an umbrella. “Traced money” works just fine for that. > [@Aaron](#): > > If anything what you’re doing is a scam. You conveniently forget or ignore the benefits of BTC (like El salvadorians no longer needing to travel for a whole day to pay one bill) this is 100% real and I am sure people appreciate this very much. The problem with you is that you know full well this would benefit lots of people. No, I am not scamming, I do not gain money, you do not loose money by anything I said above. However you did accuse me of crime, I do hope your lawyer has proof of this. I contacted CCP so they can investigate the accusation you made about fraud committed on their official forum > [@Aaron](#): > > Also normal people can now hold their own cache of value which only they can access. Again if BTC was a scam wouldn’t there be a person or other people able to access your BTC? Doesn’t the fact only you can access it tell you anything!? Fully ignore it if you like but the 100% fact is “The Bank of Aedaxus” is a reality which must be accepted. The issue is Aedaxus is that other people won’t ignore these points that you have and in many cases they will use it to move themselves forward. ‘Normal’ people? Preppers have a lot of resources too and they are normal people too. Please elaborate about the “abnormal people” and their “cache of value”… Not nessesarely, pump and dump for example changes the value. BTC fell from 60k to 25k… Not even sure what the rest of your paragraph is about but hey, I don’t own a bank. > [@Aaron](#): > > You had no response for the young Texans who have harnessed waste gas to mine BTC, without them the gas would have just been floating into the air causing problems, This is dismissive, you’re prepared to ignore facts to promote your narrative, what you don’t realise is that many people don’t ignore facts and actually consider them which will create an opinion which is vastly different from yours. The only way to be taken seriously on these matters is if you stop ignoring facts otherwise you could end up being ignored. I think I liked the post? Not sure, I am sure I supported it but there are so many posts I’ll trust you on how I got defeated by some guys running some business? > [@Aaron](#): > > The world has faced unprecedented borrowing due to covid and we are now feeling the effect of that borrowing. If people think BTC is only an investment then of course they will sell it when the economy is bad. Because there is more BTC available to buy crypto exchanges set the price lower, BTC working as intended. If only we had BTC it would have been better? I doubt it. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290.md?page=76) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290.md?page=78)