# The Rise and Fall in Bitcoin Value **URL:** \ **Category:** Out Of Pod Experience\ **Created:** [January 18, 2022, 1:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290 "2022-01-18T13:41:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 88
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2022, 2:35am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1751 "2022-11-17T02:35:42Z")
Rich people don’t go to prison. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2022, 11:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1752 "2022-11-17T11:32:20Z")
> **[10 Richest People Currently In Prison Right Now (& What Crime They...](https://www.thetalko.com/richest-people-prison-crime-committed/)** > > Many people have respect for the wealthy, but no one respects these rich convicts. These people are currently in prison for various reasons. It depends on the crime and weather the victims want to press charges or not, many times I have heard of victims not turning up to court to testify due to receiving a large sum of money from the perpetrator. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2022, 11:41am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1753 "2022-11-17T11:41:28Z")
> **[El Salvador's President Nayib Bukele and Tron's Justin Sun to Buy One Bitcoin...](https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2022/11/17/el-salvadors-president-nayib-bukele-and-trons-justin-sun-to-buy-one-bitcoin-every-day/)** > > Bukele and Sun commit to buy one BTC every day, starting from Thursday amid fears that crypto exchange FTX's recent collapse would prolong the ongoing crypto winter. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 12:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1754 "2022-11-18T12:55:28Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > These irritating people never quit with their idiotic business ideas, because these idiots have family within the government they thought they were invincible, hopefully a prison sentence will help them to realise they can’t trick and lie their way through life. Most people (like you) seem to not mind investing in a ponzi. It’s a clear signal they should do their own. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 1:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1755 "2022-11-18T13:01:46Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > Most people (like you) seem to not mind investing in a ponzi. It’s a clear signal they should do their own. Think what you like buddy. Yes, companies like FTX are much like a ponzi scheme, Bitcoin on it’s own isn’t though. It would be like saying cash is a ponzi scheme just because it is the tender used for a ponzi scheme. A digital coin (BTC) will have value because it enables secure/private (and cheap) transactions and money transfer features. I can send money abroad for pennies, please feel free to show me another way of sending money abroad for pennies if you can’t then you might have to accept BTC has value in that respect. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 1:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1756 "2022-11-18T13:10:23Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > Bitcoin on it’s own isn’t though. It can’t work without people investing in it to pay for the miners. People investing in it can’t get a return unless other people are also investing in it, which is the definition of a ponzi. Therefore, the whole BTC is a ponzi. It’s not about what I like or not ; it’s about facts. And your inability to notice this simple fact, and the way you hide your head and keep promoting a ponzi, is what made those people(FTX) able to harvest trust and money out of people who did not even know that BTC exists. > [@Aaron](#): > > A digital coin (BTC) will have value because it enables secure/private (and cheap) transactions and money transfer features. Non sequitur. ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 1:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1757 "2022-11-18T13:35:05Z")
Relax you two. Everything is a Ponzi scheme. It isn’t even descriptive as an insult anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 2:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1758 "2022-11-18T14:30:56Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > It can’t work without people investing in it to pay for the miners. As I’ve said many times, I buy say £50.00 worth of BTC and then I use it to purchase items from a web retailer. Essentially all I am doing is exchanging money to a different tender in order to comply with what a retailer wants… there is no investment in BTC on my part…it’s similar to exchanging your currency to a local one when visiting another country. Millions of people use BTC as I’ve explained above, the problem is you ignore things like this and refuse to understand it, so by default you think BTC is ONLY an investment or scam or ponzi when it’s not. > [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > People investing in it can’t get a return unless other people are also investing in it, which is the definition of a ponzi. Again, if it’s only used as a currency this is not investment. The example I gave above is a perfectly valid way to use BTC without investing in it. Even if BTC was worth less say £5,000 each my example above would still apply, I would still be able to buy £50 worth of BTC and use it at a web retailer to receive goods. > [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > And your inability to notice this simple fact, and the way you hide your head and keep promoting a ponzi, is what made those people(FTX) able to harvest trust and money out of people who did not even know that BTC exists. Hmmm, Your inability to accept BTC is not just an investment is where the issue is. BTC has multiple uses and investing in it happens to be one of them. > [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > Non sequitur. Ignorance, A cheap money transfer system is what BTC is weather you like it or not. Many people will have a use for it if they are aware of it. and in this day and age I’m very sure that lots of people world wide would welcome saving money on worldwide money transfers. But hey you go ahead and keep ignoring all of this, it won’t make any difference to anyone. The issue is you listen to the wrong people regarding BTC, Stop listening to these silly people who think they can hold onto other peoples crypto and earn themselves and the owner money, it’s never going to happen like how people think it will. **You’ve been told what the truth is** , either you ignore it or take this as gospel and revise your opinion. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 6:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1759 "2022-11-18T18:23:01Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > there is no investment in BTC on my part… Using a technology for your own needs is fine. But as I said, you are not the one paying the miners : if you buy 20 worth of BTC, it’s to use those to acquire the same value you would, without using BTC. Those who pay the miners, are those investing in BTC. And those are lured by a ponzi. Therefore, the whole BTC is only working because it’s a ponzi. That’s why it’s fundamentally a ponzi. That’s why, when promoting BTC, you are actually promoting a ponzi. > [@Aaron](#): > > The issue is you listen to the wrong people regarding BTC The issue is, you listen to people instead of using logic. > [@Aaron](#): > > **You’ve been told what the truth is** , either you ignore it or take this as gospel and revise your opinion. I have not. I know how to use logic, which is different. And I know better than taking what people claim at face value. > [@Xeux](#): > > Everything is a Ponzi scheme. Every investment for which the benefit returned is made by next investers is a ponzi, indeed that’s the definition. A “greater fool” scheme. ---
**Author:** ![Total\_Bedlam](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/total_bedlam/32/341964_2.png) [@Total\_Bedlam](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Total_Bedlam)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 6:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1760 "2022-11-18T18:41:20Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > lol, they trusted this group of young people with billions. They’ll trust any hussler with the right jive thinking he/she would be the next Elon Musk. Look at this fraud of a woman who defrauded investors and patients with her bs talk, madame miracles… ![Elizabeth-Holmes-Theranos-Inc-company-laboratory-testing-2003](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/5/e/4/5e4f2019ad7fe370e5b545dd5d4fc926c3196f4a.jpeg) How many more of her are there? How many Madofs? … sorry I need to go barf now ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 6:43pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1761 "2022-11-18T18:43:34Z")
The difference between her and Elon Musk is not much. ---
**Author:** ![Total\_Bedlam](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/total_bedlam/32/341964_2.png) [@Total\_Bedlam](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Total_Bedlam)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 6:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1762 "2022-11-18T18:46:56Z")
@Xeux True enough, except Musk’s rockets do work and can send satellites into orbit and crew to the space station. His electric cars do work too. But her bs didn’t even work and she committed fraud to make it look like it worked. I think there’s a bigger chasm between the two individuals. ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 6:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1763 "2022-11-18T18:56:06Z")
Elon picked a technology that could work, so he didn’t need fraud. Holmes picked a technology that ended up being impossible. That is just bad luck. ---
**Author:** ![Total\_Bedlam](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/total_bedlam/32/341964_2.png) [@Total\_Bedlam](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Total_Bedlam)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 6:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1764 "2022-11-18T18:57:41Z")
> [@Xeux](#): > > Holmes picked a technology that ended up being impossible She _knew_ it’d never work. > [@Xeux](#): > > That is just bad luck. No. It’s fraud. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 6:58pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1765 "2022-11-18T18:58:41Z")
Elon also tried the same with superloop. “It’s not that hard”. Turns out, it’s actually impossible, so yes not hard. ---
**Author:** ![Total\_Bedlam](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/total_bedlam/32/341964_2.png) [@Total\_Bedlam](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Total_Bedlam)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 7:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1766 "2022-11-18T19:01:16Z")
@stefnia_Freir Yeah, he’s a little gung-ho about his projects, he dares to dream big and sometimes they’re just dreams. That’s very different from committing fraud on medical patients. ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 7:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1767 "2022-11-18T19:03:10Z")
Yes, well, at the very end she may have used poor judgment, but in the beginning it was just good business. ---
**Author:** ![Total\_Bedlam](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/total_bedlam/32/341964_2.png) [@Total\_Bedlam](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Total_Bedlam)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 7:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1768 "2022-11-18T19:07:41Z")
> [@Xeux](#): > > but in the beginning it was just good business. I’m sure it was good for her until the gravy train derailed. ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 7:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1769 "2022-11-18T19:09:54Z")
That is exactly the problem. If she had let the train derail, she would have been totally fine. Super-wealthy-for-life, even. Her mistake was keeping the train on the rails as long as she did. Big mistake, I think. ---
**Author:** ![Total\_Bedlam](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/total_bedlam/32/341964_2.png) [@Total\_Bedlam](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Total_Bedlam)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2022, 7:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/1770 "2022-11-18T19:12:16Z")
> [@Xeux](#): > > Her mistake was keeping the train on the rails as long as she did. Big mistake, I think. Greed got the better of her. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290.md?page=87) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290.md?page=89)