# The scarcity move hurt PVP availability. Time to change that **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [July 14, 2022, 2:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082 "2022-07-14T14:09:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![ResonanceOfWar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/resonanceofwar/32/408654_2.png) [@ResonanceOfWar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ResonanceOfWar)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 12:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/21 "2022-07-15T12:53:12Z")
Because more people are using them in things like wormholes and high sec mission running, wh groups hunt the ratting ones and high sec gankers go and purposely look for them in high sec now. Marauders are broken and op so yea its bound to get more people to use them until CCP adds t3 desi like modes to them to balance them again in maybe a year and a half. ---
**Author:** ![Inxentas\_Ultramar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/inxentas_ultramar/32/385922_2.png) [@Inxentas\_Ultramar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Inxentas_Ultramar)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 2:27pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/22 "2022-07-15T14:27:05Z")
> [@Kezrai\_Charzai](#): > > In that case, unless the process is crazy fun and the losses easily recouped, players will avoid PvP in general. And clearly, the EVE PvP process isn’t that much fun, on average, and takes much too long, on average. And again, on average, 10 minutes of actual PvP costs you hours or more of PvE grinding to recoup, and probably took you 30-40 minutes to arrange. This is the reason I quit Eve. I never cared much for PVE and always regarded it as a way to fund PVP. I was never a great tactician, but I managed to have some succes either solo or as FC. Enough to make it a fun experience that lasted long enough to warrant some PVE. I guess many people back then didn’t think much of losing a ship, as it could be replaced in a certain amount of time spent in PVE. That was your penalty for losing. And I am fine with that in principe, but I’m not going to suffer twice the penalties because of “Rorquals” or some other nullsense I don’t care about. Especially not in a game that already had an aweful PVE ROI. Especially not in a game where people can outright buy power. Especially not in a game that has been sold to one of these “mmo accumulator” companies. Sometimes I see these guys in YouTube that have some sort of channel, and people give them ships to welp. It makes me regret I’m not talkative enough to run a channel like that. At this point a sponsorship is the only thing that would get me back. I’d pay for my sub, but I don’t want to do any PVE anymore, ever. And I know that the players would all say “you get what you worked for” and such, and in a way that is fair, but I am a West European millennial. And thus very much used to being negatively impacted by what is “fair” 😋 ---
**Author:** ![ResonanceOfWar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/resonanceofwar/32/408654_2.png) [@ResonanceOfWar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ResonanceOfWar)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 4:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/23 "2022-07-15T16:52:09Z")
If you want good pvp to pve ratio join Faction Warfare, it will get even better when the patch comes out near the end of the year. ---
**Author:** ![Moko\_Musana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/moko_musana/32/373694_2.png) [@Moko\_Musana](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Moko_Musana)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 5:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/24 "2022-07-15T17:08:57Z")
> [@Vokan\_Narkar](#): > > Permanently delete 10% of nullsec sectors. It wouldn’t hurt to permanently delete at least few highsec areas as well (I would start with blind end sectors like Gererique or Akmoh in Kador etc.). You can’t create content by removing content. CCP was more ambitious then you, and removed 90% of the ore in the game arguing that it would cause the miners to start fighting over the remaining 10%, but they were wrong, the 10% remaining wouldn’t get fought over and the mining alts that used to crab on the 90% that were removed were unsubscribed instead. If you want ratters to run around with blingy marauders, introduce some sites worthy of using blingy marauders. Almost all of the sites that are told to “need” a carrier to be run can in fact be soloed with an assault frigate. Bring some “real” marauder pve content, and some “real” capital content, and then you’ll see marauders and capitals again. > [@Altara\_Zemara](#): > > Can anyone explain to me why Paladin losses are currently almost 6 times what they were in 2020. There’s a sudden increase in both kills and losses around March 2021. Marauders are the ESS meta. Bring a few of those into an ESS bubble, and you’ll obliterate whatever was there. Marauders are also the Secure Key Storage Facility meta. They also provide more general purpose usefulness then HAW dreads, while being a lot less expensive. ---
**Author:** ![tutucox\_Khamsi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tutucox_khamsi/32/430743_2.png) [@tutucox\_Khamsi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/tutucox_Khamsi)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 5:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/25 "2022-07-15T17:18:17Z")
> [@Moko\_Musana](#): > > HAW dreads HAW dreads was the reason i trained for dreads them CCP nerfed haw dreads BAD CCP is BAD ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 5:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/26 "2022-07-15T17:41:06Z")
> [@Inxentas\_Ultramar](#): > > I never cared much for PVE and always regarded it as a way to fund PVP. I was never a great tactician, but I managed to have some succes either solo or as FC. Enough to make it a fun experience that lasted long enough to warrant some PVE. I guess many people back then didn’t think much of losing a ship, as it could be replaced in a certain amount of time spent in PVE. That was your penalty for losing. And I am fine with that in principe, but I’m not going to suffer twice the penalties because of “Rorquals” or some other nullsense I don’t care about. Your PvP can be entirely self-sustaining, and even _profitable._ All you have to do is redefine what PvP means to you. Once your understanding of what EVE PvP is moves beyond “two groups of T2-fit battlecruisers having an honorable, consensual confrontation at a null-sec gate with GFs thrown all around,” many doors will open up for you that you never even knew existed before. ---
**Author:** ![tutucox\_Khamsi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tutucox_khamsi/32/430743_2.png) [@tutucox\_Khamsi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/tutucox_Khamsi)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 6:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/27 "2022-07-15T18:06:04Z")
yea @Destiny_Corrupted showed me a thing that i never ever knew existed before it was nice and soft and cozy anyway… ---
**Author:** ![ResonanceOfWar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/resonanceofwar/32/408654_2.png) [@ResonanceOfWar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ResonanceOfWar)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 8:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/28 "2022-07-15T20:04:14Z")
> [@tutucox\_Khamsi](#): > > and soft > and cozy > anyway… A hospital bed? Haha sorry bro you made that way too easy for me xD ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 8:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/29 "2022-07-15T20:25:06Z")
> [@ResonanceOfWar](#): > > A hospital bed? No… ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/0/4/7/047789d02cf823e371d62ad21ad7162691d4c78e.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![tutucox\_Khamsi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tutucox_khamsi/32/430743_2.png) [@tutucox\_Khamsi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/tutucox_Khamsi)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 8:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/30 "2022-07-15T20:26:14Z")
![96778c81-76b7-4168-bdce-84931f6d3991.CR278,220,1788,1106_PT0_SX970_V1_](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/a/f/1/af1fce7d8db4b9cdd4e9725b2367938b29d45f4d.jpeg) you pervs ---
**Author:** ![ResonanceOfWar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/resonanceofwar/32/408654_2.png) [@ResonanceOfWar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ResonanceOfWar)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 8:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/31 "2022-07-15T20:36:44Z")
I’m curious is it only me trying to see what he is reading would be kinda funny if its some hardcore accounting book xD Also freezing my ass off atm if that bunny suit was near me I would 98% wear it … looks warm as hell. ---
**Author:** ![Boags](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/boags/32/382554_2.png) [@Boags](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Boags)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 8:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/32 "2022-07-15T20:56:57Z")
Haw dreads are pretty much useless ---
**Author:** ![tutucox\_Khamsi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tutucox_khamsi/32/430743_2.png) [@tutucox\_Khamsi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/tutucox_Khamsi)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 9:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/33 "2022-07-15T21:09:29Z")
> [@Boags](#): > > Haw dreads are pretty much useless because they nerfed tracking , they were a LOL streamer vs low sec thing back them , some dudes had 50 ish kills before dead i had one on the capital of amarr FW … but i sold it there was a cool trick , microwarpdrive them siege and slide … improve tracking a lot by moving fast and them pew to death (besides kinda countering kiting battleships ) , cap charges eventually go out , but i saw one guy killing LOTS and getting away it was a fun , cool thing , dont know why ccp changed ---
**Author:** ![ResonanceOfWar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/resonanceofwar/32/408654_2.png) [@ResonanceOfWar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ResonanceOfWar)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 9:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/34 "2022-07-15T21:38:57Z")
Because it was broken lol same for maruaders now to a much lesser extent. Nothing stops you from flying a dread now with a friend in a Vindi 😃 at least the enemies can kill the Vindi to remove the tracking adv as a counter play thou. I remember being on the test server and I flew a harpy and tried to get under the guns of the haw dread and it was killing me no problem at all, very very broken. ---
**Author:** ![MB\_ThePhotographer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mb_thephotographer/32/373722_2.png) [@MB\_ThePhotographer](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/MB_ThePhotographer)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 10:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/35 "2022-07-15T22:24:00Z")
> [@Altara\_Zemara](#): > > There’s a sudden increase in both kills and losses around March 2021. That was just me getting rid of some extra isk! 😜 > [@ResonanceOfWar](#): > > it will get even better when the patch comes out near the end of the year. This I will have to see to believe. CCP’s ideas of “fixing things” does not seem to have panned out over the years. ---
**Author:** ![ResonanceOfWar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/resonanceofwar/32/408654_2.png) [@ResonanceOfWar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ResonanceOfWar)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 10:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/36 "2022-07-15T22:25:27Z")
> [@MB\_ThePhotographer](#): > > does not seem to have panned out over the years. They never really said fixing thou we always make our own interpretations. ---
**Author:** ![Skyla\_Amarr](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/skyla_amarr/32/392813_2.png) [@Skyla\_Amarr](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Skyla_Amarr)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 10:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/37 "2022-07-15T22:30:43Z")
Marauders aren’t broken. It’s just that people aren’t used to a BS actually being able to hit a barn and actually being an actual BS and not just a larger pinata. Like actually actual. ---
**Author:** ![ResonanceOfWar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/resonanceofwar/32/408654_2.png) [@ResonanceOfWar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ResonanceOfWar)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 10:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/38 "2022-07-15T22:35:35Z")
Why are they so cheap then, 1b for a hull is nothing compared to their power. Also ships are healthy when they have soft counters, but they cant really be neuted out or e-wared effectively atm maybe if they droped the e-war resi from 50% to 25%. ---
**Author:** ![Skyla\_Amarr](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/skyla_amarr/32/392813_2.png) [@Skyla\_Amarr](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Skyla_Amarr)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 10:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/39 "2022-07-15T22:51:25Z")
I can buy a few dreads and trash them and i wouldn’t even blink. That doesn’t make them cheap. You are just mad that it actually functions as a BS and not just a big pinata for you to troll. ---
**Author:** ![ResonanceOfWar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/resonanceofwar/32/408654_2.png) [@ResonanceOfWar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ResonanceOfWar)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 10:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082/40 "2022-07-15T22:52:16Z")
What are you even talking about, I’m not mad im sad when we go out in a small gang of 5 ships we see a vargur and its a big nope to any fight what so ever. Its a big BS called content denial. You just want a I win button to compensate for lack of skill. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-scarcity-move-hurt-pvp-availability-time-to-change-that/370082.md?page=3)