# Trying to understand why the massive nerf to the Venture?! **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [November 19, 2021, 7:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849 "2021-11-19T19:25:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Bobby\_Blue\_Bland](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bobby_blue_bland/32/342812_2.png) [@Bobby\_Blue\_Bland](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bobby_Blue_Bland)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2021, 1:13am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/22 "2021-11-29T01:13:44Z")
??? …crawl back in your troll hole. ---
**Author:** ![Bobby\_Blue\_Bland](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bobby_blue_bland/32/342812_2.png) [@Bobby\_Blue\_Bland](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bobby_Blue_Bland)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2021, 1:15am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/23 "2021-11-29T01:15:30Z")
Really? There are dozens of vids and articles on the net and the forums about using Ventures to farm for isk in Wormholes as a newbro. But I guess you know more. Thanks for the input. ---
**Author:** ![Bobby\_Blue\_Bland](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bobby_blue_bland/32/342812_2.png) [@Bobby\_Blue\_Bland](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bobby_Blue_Bland)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2021, 1:18am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/24 "2021-11-29T01:18:34Z")
And it was. Thanks for the input and foresight! ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2021, 1:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/25 "2021-11-29T01:34:47Z")
![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/c/2/6/c263753ed57875f6770aa09a79d82d1ff0ed75f4.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Cilla\_Cybin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cilla_cybin/32/292206_2.png) [@Cilla\_Cybin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cilla_Cybin)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 7:24am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/26 "2021-11-30T07:24:26Z")
> [@Bobby\_Blue\_Bland](#): > > My concern, perhaps misplaced, is that new players without deep pockets won’t have a potential source of income with which to build on in the first six months or so. You can have a billion ISK for just £10 or so. I make that £1.66 a month over those 6 months. Even my hamster’s pockets can manage that. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 8:25am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/27 "2021-11-30T08:25:16Z")
A titan costs like a thousand bucks though. ---
**Author:** ![Emira\_Sultana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/emira_sultana/32/298445_2.png) [@Emira\_Sultana](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Emira_Sultana)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 9:14am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/28 "2021-11-30T09:14:08Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > A titan costs like a thousand bucks though What would I do with a Titan? Even if I was a 10yr vet involved in a war I wouldn’t buy a Titan. On a side note: Are Titans like big SUV’s? Trying to compensate for something? 😁 ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 9:54am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/29 "2021-11-30T09:54:39Z")
> [@Emira\_Sultana](#): > > What would I do with a Titan? One of my CEOs told me that it would be used to kill griefers after we raised enough funds to help him buy one. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 10:00am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/30 "2021-11-30T10:00:58Z")
> [@Emira\_Sultana](#): > > What would I do with a Titan? Even if I was a 10yr vet involved in a war I wouldn’t buy a Titan. > On a side note: Are Titans like big SUV’s? Trying to compensate for something? Apart from showing off on the undock of your corporation’s home station like a rare epic mount on your mailbox in WoW, titans (and supers) also have a rather large ship maintenance bay of 5 million m3 which is really useful when you want to move your ships around in null sec. For that ship carrying capability and the ability to help your allies by giving them jump bridges, I wouldn’t mind buying a Titan. If I ever had that sort of money ingame. And yes, ‘Compensation’ is a rather good name for a titan. ---
**Author:** ![Moko\_Musana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/moko_musana/32/373694_2.png) [@Moko\_Musana](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Moko_Musana)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 10:11am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/31 "2021-11-30T10:11:33Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > One of my CEOs told me that it would be used to kill griefers after we raised enough funds to help him buy one. Isn’t the current age usage of Titans to make a new toon, skill inject it into titan, jump it to your space and safelog it there, only to relog it a few years later and go roam with the titan once your corporation no longer lives in that space? Most alliances disallow the usage or even ownership of titans w/o explicit authorization from alliance leadership, and for that reason you simply keep the titan toon in a npc corporation: You can log it in whenever you want, and use it for whatever you want, whether alliance likes it or not. And not only that, but since there’s a neutral in a Titan?!! in your SOV, you naturally react by deploying all your super carriers and the other stuff you would normally need permission for, too, and as long as one little killmail, even a corvette, shows there was a nonfriendly titan in your space, your alliance will probably forgive you having dropped supercaps w/o prior authorization. If only you had prioritized the neutral Titan over the 50 flashing red subcaps in your system, and it wouldn’t have gotten away while your super drop and the subcap fleet were clapping each other, it’d had been such a glorious killmail… ---
**Author:** ![Emira\_Sultana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/emira_sultana/32/298445_2.png) [@Emira\_Sultana](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Emira_Sultana)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 10:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/32 "2021-11-30T10:51:35Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > titans (and supers) also have a rather large ship maintenance bay of 5 million m3 which is really useful when you want to move your ships around in null sec. > > For that ship carrying capability and the ability to help your allies by giving them jump bridges, I wouldn’t mind buying a Titan. If I ever had that sort of money ingame I see. So it’s rather a good tool for fleet commanders, admirals and such. Indeed, nothing having to do with me lowly self. > [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > And yes, ‘Compensation’ is a rather good name for a titan. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Emira\_Sultana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/emira_sultana/32/298445_2.png) [@Emira\_Sultana](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Emira_Sultana)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 10:53am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/33 "2021-11-30T10:53:51Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > One of my CEOs told me that it would be used to kill griefers after we raised enough funds to help him buy one “Used to kill griefers” 🤣 Did you fall for it? ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 10:58am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/34 "2021-11-30T10:58:17Z")
No, we got wardecced by some “random guy” and then he and most other members stopped playing shortly afterwards. ---
**Author:** ![Moko\_Musana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/moko_musana/32/373694_2.png) [@Moko\_Musana](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Moko_Musana)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 11:00am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/35 "2021-11-30T11:00:14Z")
> [@Bobby\_Blue\_Bland](#): > > It is my understanding from watching a couple of vids on the subject that the Venture is to receive a massive nerf bat by losing ALL bonuses. It will take much longer and be much riskier if possible at all on a practical level. I just don’t understand how doing so will improve the game for new players. If the issue is experienced multi boxes can make too much in Ventures…limit multi boxers. Other game developers have done so. CCP lives on the multi “boxers”. The reason ninja mining works so well is that in wormhole space, you have a few super-alliances, and everything else is basically corporations with 15 members that are in fact 1-2 players with their alts. For that reason, you see there’s a citadel in the wormhole but no player. Not because he’s cloaked or in a force recon, but because the single player is simply busy with his out-of-eve live and signed off, rendering the whole corporation offline. If it really was 15 players each playing one toon, they would cover most timezones, and ninja huffing attempts would much more frequently result in dictor warp-ins and dead ventures. The other group that also heavily multiboxes are the nullseccers, especially the industrialists, because industry scales alot harder then any kind of npc or player combatting activity. If one of the heavy multiboxers jumps into a wormhole to ninja huff there, he’ll not bring a venture on one toon, but a dozen toons each in a venture, and another toon in a Porpoise, because … why not? When huffing one of the large gas sites with 10 ventures, the Porpoise’s foreman will provide so much additional gas by the time the rats warp in that doing a single site successfully already accounts for losing the Porpoise. Now, the multi-account user can huff an order of magnitude more gas then you can, he also brings his attention magnet to boost his - and your - yield even further. However, when it comes down to scanning the signature, while the multi-account player probably has an alt that has maxed out scanning skills and flies with a nice covops frigate, the interactive-ness of the scanning progress will give him by far less advantages over you then the mining power of the many accounts do. The way you can make good money out of this is by you scanning the WH and then telling him what you found, because if he comes, you get a forement for +60% yield. Further, you can also try “selling” the site, i.e. inverting the moon goo tax game, by providing him with all bookmarks, warp ins, scouting the connecting j-spaces for player activity and additional sites, saving the multi-accounter a lot of time, in return for 10% (?) of the stuff he huffs. The most expensive of the gas sites has 1.5B isk in it, and with 20 porpoised ventures, it can be ninja-ed. I know some people who have 20 mining alts that can use t2 ventures, but are too lazy to scan wormholes. 10% of 1.5B is nice money, you still keep the stuff in your own venture, too, which is more then you would solo huff due to the foreman. For the multi-accounter, jumping a few gates, warping to your bookmark(s) and getting 1.3B at the risk of 200~300M of ships is pretty nice money, too, so he’ll probably do it… not to mention if there’s multiple gas sites. The lesser gas sites can also be multi-player-ed for more income, and for someone who is less hardcore of a multi-accounter, might not even be that much inferior to the big ones. ---
**Author:** ![Emira\_Sultana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/emira_sultana/32/298445_2.png) [@Emira\_Sultana](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Emira_Sultana)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 11:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/36 "2021-11-30T11:01:39Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > No, we got wardecced by some “random guy” and then he and most other members stopped playing shortly afterwards. I smell a ripoff in that story. Could the “random guy” have been the very same CEO under an alt? He got his Titan and split… (?) ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 11:05am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/37 "2021-11-30T11:05:33Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > **One of my** CEOs > [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > No, we got wardecced by some **“random guy”** WINK WINK Anyway, there was never a titan. I think they managed to raise like 6 or 7 billion ISK. I, uh, “mined” to contribute a portion of that. ---
**Author:** ![Emira\_Sultana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/emira_sultana/32/298445_2.png) [@Emira\_Sultana](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Emira_Sultana)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 11:17am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/38 "2021-11-30T11:17:12Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > I, uh, “mined” to contribute a portion of that. Why do I have the feeling that you didn’t really mine? Your posts are so nebulous, double speak ( can’t find the correct word ) I have a hard time following what you actually mean… but I like your foruming style. > [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > I think they managed to raise like 6 or 7 billion ISK Do you think 6 or 7 billion isk was worth the scam? ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 11:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/39 "2021-11-30T11:22:27Z")
There was no scam—the CEO was for real. Nor did I intend to scam them myself. Anyway, I realized that someone else was going to get to that money before I did if I didn’t act quickly, so I war-decced them (prematurely). Didn’t end up getting anything, though. They all permanently quit within a few days, aside from a select few people who weren’t that chump-ish and went elsewhere because they had enough attraction to EVE to be long-term players. ---
**Author:** ![Emira\_Sultana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/emira_sultana/32/298445_2.png) [@Emira\_Sultana](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Emira_Sultana)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 11:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/40 "2021-11-30T11:51:36Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > There was no scam—the CEO was for real. Nor did I intend to scam them myself. Boy was I completely off base 🤭 > [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > Anyway, I realized that someone else was going to get to that money before I did if I didn’t act quickly, so I war-decced them (prematurely). I have so many questions about that, lol. But this thread isn’t the place. I will contact you in-game if you don’t mind. I feel you can teach me a lot. > [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > Didn’t end up getting anything, though. They all permanently quit within a few days, aside from a select few people who weren’t that chump-ish and went elsewhere because they had enough attraction to EVE to be long-term players Bummer. Can’t count on anyone to stick to anything nowadays… Chumps. I bet you have so many wierd stories. I’d love to read them. Maybe you could use the Fiction Portal and tell tales. ---
**Author:** ![Rocket\_Hellfire](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rocket_hellfire/32/396905_2.png) [@Rocket\_Hellfire](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rocket_Hellfire)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2021, 4:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849/41 "2021-11-30T16:42:21Z")
CCP wants you to buy skill points, duh! You’re supposed to not want to play in a Venture. YAY! Emergent gameplay. YAY!! [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/trying-to-understand-why-the-massive-nerf-to-the-venture/337849.md?page=3)