# Utari's Puppies (Formerly Off-Topic Thread) **URL:** \ **Category:** Intergalactic Summit\ **Created:** [June 21, 2017, 6:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128 "2017-06-21T18:18:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 147
**Author:** ![Havohej](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/havohej/32/325132_2.png) [@Havohej](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Havohej)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2019, 12:28am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2968 "2019-02-27T00:28:20Z")
That, Matari Kernher, depends on whose best interests you’re working toward. ---
**Author:** ![Diana\_Kim](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/diana_kim/32/382972_2.png) [@Diana\_Kim](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Diana_Kim)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2019, 1:06am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2969 "2019-02-27T01:06:56Z")
> [@Samira\_Kernher](#): > > And his were committed in what he thought was the best interests of Amarr. > > But ‘best interests’ do not make something evil, good. Partly I agree. But for me, being good means acting in the interests of your society, while acting evil means acting only in your own selfish interests. And by this standard I don’t see Mr. Nauplius as univocally evil. Deluded? Maybe… Criminal? Maybe… Wayward? Heretical? Stubborn? Unwise? Inefficient? Embezzling? Straightforward wrong?.. but not evil. I feel he acts with good intentions, and he has desire to act and do something for the Empire he loves, but he chooses his ways inappropriately, turning himself in the end into a criminal and enemy of the said Empire. ---
**Author:** ![Nauplius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nauplius/32/403015_2.png) [@Nauplius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nauplius)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2019, 2:04am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2970 "2019-02-27T02:04:56Z")
> [@Aria\_Jenneth](#): > > Further stains on my life’s tapestry. Perhaps you, too, should become a _monster_ in defense of the Empire. ---
**Author:** ![Aria\_Jenneth](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aria_jenneth/32/469792_2.png) [@Aria\_Jenneth](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aria_Jenneth)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2019, 4:06am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2971 "2019-02-27T04:06:09Z")
Haha … ah, Mr. Nauplius. For someone with such an interest in my titles, you don’t watch very closely. ---
**Author:** ![Nauplius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nauplius/32/403015_2.png) [@Nauplius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nauplius)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2019, 2:02pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2972 "2019-02-27T14:02:11Z")
I suppose that I do not; your titles at this writing have no obvious connection to being a _monster_ in defense of the Empire. ---
**Author:** ![Diana\_Kim](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/diana_kim/32/382972_2.png) [@Diana\_Kim](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Diana_Kim)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2019, 2:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2973 "2019-02-27T14:09:21Z")
I believe that being a “monster” is indifferent to defense of the Empire, the State or anything else. If you want to dedicate yourself to protection of what is dear to you, you shall become not a monster, but a professional and EFFICIENT soldier. Only then you can guarantee defense. Monsters just bring more chaos instead of protecting the order. ---
**Author:** ![Deitra\_Vess](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/deitra_vess/32/249726_2.png) [@Deitra\_Vess](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Deitra_Vess)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2019, 2:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2974 "2019-02-27T14:16:39Z")
Your only a monster to those you oppose. ---
**Author:** ![Diana\_Kim](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/diana_kim/32/382972_2.png) [@Diana\_Kim](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Diana_Kim)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2019, 2:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2975 "2019-02-27T14:18:35Z")
I guess that is acceptable. ---
**Author:** ![Aria\_Jenneth](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aria_jenneth/32/469792_2.png) [@Aria\_Jenneth](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aria_Jenneth)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2019, 2:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2976 "2019-02-27T14:53:56Z")
As Ms. Kim and Ms. Vess suggest, there’s nothing special about the word, “monster,” Mr. Nauplius, even if you italicize it. Those titles reflect deeds done in the Directrix’s service: ships destroyed, lives taken. A hawk is monstrous to a rabbit, but to the one who holds her tether she’s an ally in the hunt, perhaps even a friend. I have killed for your Empire because I trust the one who carries me on her wrist. I have no need to be more monstrous than I am. ---
**Author:** ![Constantin\_Baracca](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/constantin_baracca/32/170074_2.png) [@Constantin\_Baracca](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Constantin_Baracca)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2019, 3:20pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2977 "2019-02-27T15:20:16Z")
And, more than anything, what separates us monsters and from dogs on the leash is that a dog never contemplates its prey’s young, or whether it could hunt its prey into extinction. What is monstrous is not always the actions themselves, but the disassociation from the fellowship of our brothers and sisters. If we must kill, it must be for very good purpose and its costs must be weighed. We must be prepared to accept the responsibility of its consequences, no matter how inconsequential they may seem. Even the extermination of the most deserving enemy does not happen in a vacuum (metaphorically speaking, anyway). ---
**Author:** ![Diana\_Kim](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/diana_kim/32/382972_2.png) [@Diana\_Kim](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Diana_Kim)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2019, 4:07am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2978 "2019-03-03T04:07:55Z")
> [@Do You Enjoy Combat?](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-enjoy-combat/143491/6): > > Yes. > I doubt anyone would understand, and I am not skilled enough to convey it. > As far as how I feel? Combat is about as far from God’s desire as we can get. On the scale of “what does God want from us?” I put combat on the end with apostasy, blaspheme, heresy, murder, lies, and the like. So, I try to reconcile the fact that I absolutely love war with the fact that it’s pretty horrible. So, ■■■■■■ if I know. If God doesn’t want you to fight, why He forged enemies that attack you? It’s a test! The life itself is a battle. It is a struggle for survival. Those who give up and stop fighting, just die unworthy. If you want to die worthy, you shall die fighting! ---
**Author:** ![Alizabeth\_Vea](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/alizabeth_vea/32/122884_2.png) [@Alizabeth\_Vea](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Alizabeth_Vea)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2019, 4:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2979 "2019-03-03T04:12:04Z")
Why would God deliberately create evil? ---
**Author:** ![Arsia\_Elkin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arsia_elkin/32/388703_2.png) [@Arsia\_Elkin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arsia_Elkin)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2019, 4:24am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2980 "2019-03-03T04:24:44Z")
He didn’t. He gave people free will. We all have the capacity to be good or evil. And well… some people happen to be evil. ---
**Author:** ![Diana\_Kim](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/diana_kim/32/382972_2.png) [@Diana\_Kim](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Diana_Kim)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2019, 4:33am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2981 "2019-03-03T04:33:41Z")
> [@Alizabeth\_Vea](#): > > Why would God deliberately create evil? To test you, obviously! Besides… have you thought, that if there would be no evil, we wouldn’t know what is good. Would you know what is a light if it didn’t cast shadows and there would be no dark? Would you know what is a Life if you didn’t know Death? To value something humans shall see what happens when they lose it. And if you’re fighting evil, it means you value good. ---
**Author:** ![Alizabeth\_Vea](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/alizabeth_vea/32/122884_2.png) [@Alizabeth\_Vea](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Alizabeth_Vea)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2019, 4:54am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2982 "2019-03-03T04:54:25Z")
I get that. However Kim insinuated that God made enemies for me to fight. I reject that notion. My enemies made themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Diana\_Kim](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/diana_kim/32/382972_2.png) [@Diana\_Kim](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Diana_Kim)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2019, 5:31am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2983 "2019-03-03T05:31:49Z")
Oh, it’s a philosophical question. For example, do gallente choose to be selfish pricks and freedom-obsessed fanatics by their own WILL, or they were MADE this way? Do they just WANT to be terrible people and torture others, hurt them, or is simply encoded in their DNA and if they don’t act like that - it’s just anomaly and not a norm? I don’t think we have strict and proper research that could give answers to these questions. Maybe, somewhere in the future?.. According to some interpretations of our religious (or, more likely, mythico-philosophical) beliefs they were made to test us, test our strength, our resilience. I don’t know Amarr Faith very well, but I believe I’ve heard the name _‘The Deciever’_ Isn’t it the entity like Gallente for us? Like one who tries to _Corrupt_ faithful into ways of evil, into ways of indecency, lewd behavior, dishonorable behavior, or heretic behavior, or something like that? ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2019, 6:23am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2984 "2019-03-03T06:23:07Z")
> [@Arsia\_Elkin](#): > > He didn’t. He gave people free will. We all have the capacity to be good or evil. If your god exists, and has the capabilities you believe he does, then there is no free will, and he absolutely created evil. Condition 1: your god is omniscient/has perfect predictive capabilities. Your god sends prophets. One of the hallmarks of a ‘divine prophecy’ (ie: not just some crackpot) is that it’s true. God’s prophecies cannot be incorrect. In order for this to be the case, your god needs the ability to perfectly predict all things, ie: the effective ability to see the future, unerringly. Condition 2: your god is omnipotent; specifically, he created the universe and had or continues to have the ability (even if he claims to not wield it) to alter it. If these conditions are true, then _prior_ to the act of creating the universe, your god was faced with a decision: _how_ to make it? What _precise_ starting conditions would exist, down to the last most minute position of potential quarks and energy states? In making the decision, Condition 1 comes into play: god knows how every possible starting configuration _will_ play out. Not ‘may’ play out, mind, but _will_… because if there is any aspect of the development of the universe which god is not aware of, god cannot give perfectly predictive prophecy. If there’s something he’s not aware of, that _something_ could prevent his prophecy from being true. God’s prophecies _must_ be true, therefore, god _must_ have perfect predictive capability. Therefore, before the act of creating everything, god _knew_, already, what your decisions would be at each and every point of decision in your life. There is no real ‘choice’, because you were always _going_ to decide that thing. After all, if you can make a choice god isn’t expecting… _his predictions can be wrong_. More, by knowing exactly how, in the most minute detail, existence unfolds for every possible starting configuration, then god, by _choosing_ a starting configuration, chooses which of those possible paths of unfolding existence will take. It’s inescapable: if god can send inerrant prophecy, then god, in the act of determining the starting conditions of the universe, chose every decision everyone will ever make. God decided on an existence where the Federation attempts to claim the Caldari corporate colonies. God decided on an existence where the Drifters destroy _TES Seraph_. God decided that Nauplius would be Nauplius and Mizhara would be Mizhara. The only way to escape that is to say that god doesn’t have perfect predictive power… which means prophecy becomes ‘educated guesses’ that he’s really good at, and maybe there’s a lot of genuine prophets the Theology Council decided were crackpots… and crackpots they declared prophets. It throws the whole concept of infallibility out the window, because even your deity… isn’t. So unless your deity isn’t infallible… then he deliberately created evil, and there is no free will. ---
**Author:** ![Alizabeth\_Vea](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/alizabeth_vea/32/122884_2.png) [@Alizabeth\_Vea](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Alizabeth_Vea)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2019, 6:27am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2985 "2019-03-03T06:27:30Z")
No. (Apparently, there is a 5 character minimum.) ---
**Author:** ![Diana\_Kim](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/diana_kim/32/382972_2.png) [@Diana\_Kim](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Diana_Kim)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2019, 6:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2986 "2019-03-03T06:34:58Z")
> [@Do You Enjoy Combat?](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-enjoy-combat/143491/10): > > B) Because I’m terrible at it. > > Yes, there’s a period of learning and growth involved. I know that, and that’s not the difficult part. There’s just something disheartening about always being the one blown up or the one running away. It feels like there’s an insurmountable climb between me and everyone in space who’s been doing this longer and is so much better at it. It makes me feel very, very small. As they say, appetite comes with eating. From my own experience - although I remember it quite barely - my first solo capsuleer kill was about two weeks of me being in a capsule. Nobody was born to be good at combat. I was dying left and right when I was starting. And I didn’t care about climb between me and others. What I did care about - is what I need to kill opponent. At first it were t2 rockets for me. Then it was thermodynamics. Then… bombers. I don’t know, it may sound silly, but I did manage to get solo kill (or maybe even more than one) with a bomber - back then they were with cruise missiles, not torps, that helped with the damage projection. I joined the war and started joining fleets of other Caldari pilots. I was learning, I was fighting, and I never was surrendering. Even if I had just a kestrel with these t2 rockets, if I had just a raven with t1 drones and t1 missiles… every ship is a combat ship, take what you have and do what you can with it. Whenever I need to fight someone, I never think who they are and who am I, are they big or small, am I big or small. I see a problem and I try to come with a solution, and I don’t feel myself in that equation. I view myself only as skills that I have - and how I shall use them to achieve the goal. Look at the situation from my point of view and stop thinking about yourself. Don’t ask yourself if you’re the person who can solve the problem. Ask yourself HOW can you solve the problem. And do it, try it. Try it again. And solve it. Because every problem in the end must be solved, path walked and objectives reached. You cannot fail, if you won’t try, but you can’t succeed either. Grip your will into a fist, don’t wait for anything or anyone, toss your doubts away and just ACT. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2019, 7:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128/2987 "2019-03-03T07:12:18Z")
Yes. There is, indeed, a 5-character minimum. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128.md?page=146) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/utaris-puppies-formerly-off-topic-thread/5128.md?page=148)