# War decs should cost 10m additional isk for each outgoing war **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [March 14, 2020, 1:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763 "2020-03-14T13:29:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/184 "2020-03-14T21:32:38Z")
Well, I was kind of humouring this insanity by thinking, why make a whole new mechanic? CCP dont do that, they co-opt existing ones. Just tie it into fuel cost. No fuel, no dec. You dont need fuel to defend, either, to ease wiping low power stations off the map ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/185 "2020-03-14T21:32:44Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > Actually it was: No, it was not. The post you linked is not related to your post being called rubbish. > [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > I’m fine with my opinion being rubbish as long as Well that’s your issue. If you are fine with being rubbish, it’s good enough to not care about your opinion, that other people are rubbish or not. Since yo don’t mind if THAT opinion is rubbish. > [@Jonah\_Gravenstein](#): > > I doubt people will quit whining about them until wardecs are no longer possible due to crippling costs and game mechanics. Which will be, when CCP removes citadels form HS. > [@Namtis](#): > > I’m not sure that’s going to work very well. They’d have to cycle every one at the same time, issue all the decs they want, then issue no more decs for a week before repeating. Just seems hard for them to do well or efficiently. Not really. One date to do the three in succession every week : remove everybody, declare 50 wardecs, accept everybody. Just because you would not do that, does not mean that nobody would. And once it’s done correctly, you can even create several group chat for the three groups to invite. If it’s possible, someone will do it. That’s the basic of IT security. Just because YOU would not abuse it this way, does not mean that nobody would. ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/186 "2020-03-14T21:32:58Z")
> [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > They wouldnt need to spend the additional war fee to have 50 wars though, right? If they’ve split into 50 corps they’ll need to war dec each corp 50 times if they wish to achieve the same result as their mega alliance of war deccers. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/187 "2020-03-14T21:33:39Z")
I have come to understand that, yes ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/188 "2020-03-14T21:37:47Z")
> [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > Just tie it into fuel cost. No fuel, no dec. You dont need fuel to defend, either, to ease wiping low power stations off the map As someone who fuels our structures, you are making me cry (yes…tears in the forum…unthinkable). It’s kind of boring play. I think I’d rather see a module introduced that could be installed as a service and then offered out to other corps at a cost (like services are now). A corp would still need a structure to be able to declare war, but then could pay for a different structure to be the War HQ. That way, you could have a heap of unfueled structures across the smaller corps, with centralised HQ services. If any of the other structures die, that corp would become war ineligible and the war would end within 24-hours like now, but the refueling needs would be lower. I don’t know. Probably plenty of downsides to that too, but seems like a HQ service would provide lots of incentive for defenders to ally to each other and/or just coordinate attacking so they can end all of the wars. ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/189 "2020-03-14T21:37:48Z")
> [@Jonah\_Gravenstein](#): > > I’m just going to point out that the cost of a basic wardec is 2400% higher that it was in 2012, in short it has far outstripped any inflation or deflation and already represents a significant investment on the part of wardec groups running multiple wardecs. > > (It looks like my figures are a little out of date, according to Eve Uni the base cost is now 100M not the 50M I remember, which makes it a 4900% increase in cost; if someone will be so kind as to confirm this.) > > Not only that, but potential wardec targets have been significantly reduced to the point where corps essentially have to opt in to becoming a target. > > But hey ho, the wheels on the nerf bus go round and round. I doubt people will quit whining about them until wardecs are no longer possible due to crippling costs and game mechanics. Can you explain how a 50m isk cost becoming 100m equates to a 4900% increase? 100m is 200% of 50m, not 4900% ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/190 "2020-03-14T21:39:18Z")
Hmm some sort of CONCORD bribery outlet? With hats and keyrings for sale And fudge ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/191 "2020-03-14T21:39:20Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > Can you explain how a 50m isk cost becoming 100m equates to a 4900% increase? Prior to the changes in 2012, wars weren’t 50 million base cost. ---
**Author:** ![Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jonah_gravenstein/32/386819_2.png) [@Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jonah_Gravenstein)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/192 "2020-03-14T21:40:38Z")
Read again, my initial figure is from 2012, when wardecs cost 2M isk. 50M is a 2400% increase when compared to the initial 2M, 100M is a 4900% increase over that initial figure. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:43pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/193 "2020-03-14T21:43:02Z")
I distinctly remember the chances of being decced were signifigantly higher back then, of course. I mean, thats why Ive no rear fear of them nowadays. Edit: was going to correct that typo but ■■■■ it, it works ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/194 "2020-03-14T21:44:52Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > As someone who fuels our structures, you are making me cry (yes…tears in the forum…unthinkable). It’s kind of boring play. Use ESI and you can easily be warned of upcoming fuel, reinforcement, wars. You can even deduce how much fuel you need to remain, get warned if your fit is not optimal for a loss (that is, reprocess service + 1d of fuel). That’s pretty neet, and you just need a station in system to make that 700M structure kill worthless, and don’t need to connect your holder toon unless specifically said so. ---
**Author:** ![Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jonah_gravenstein/32/386819_2.png) [@Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jonah_Gravenstein)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/195 "2020-03-14T21:47:56Z")
> [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > I distinctly remember the chances of being decced were signifigantly higher back then, of course. Indeed they were, and those of us that dealt with it thrived regardless. ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/196 "2020-03-14T21:48:27Z")
> [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > No, it was not. > The post you linked is not related to your post being called rubbish. Yes, it was. It was a continued discussion between us. There are two paths that Namtis can take. Either he can accept his own argument was rubbish opinion and be thanked for being a pot calling the kettle black, and accept defeat, Or. He can accept the understanding that if he considers his argument as being more than rubbish opinion, then hello pot, meet kettle, who is also black, and my argument isnt rubbish opinion either. > [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > If you are fine with being rubbish, it’s good enough to not care about your opinion, that other people are rubbish or not. Since yo don’t mind if THAT opinion is rubbish. Of course not, I dont mind if people point out that my opinions are rubbish, as that’s just a subjective opinion. But I do have a problem with hypocrisy, and will call that out whenever I can. ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/197 "2020-03-14T21:48:54Z")
> [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > > [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > > > Actually it was: > > No, it was not. > The post you linked is not related to your post being called rubbish. > > > [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > > > I’m fine with my opinion being rubbish as long as > > Well that’s your issue. > > If you are fine with being rubbish, it’s good enough to not care about your opinion, that other people are rubbish or not. Since yo don’t mind if THAT opinion is rubbish. > > > [@Jonah\_Gravenstein](#): > > > > I doubt people will quit whining about them until wardecs are no longer possible due to crippling costs and game mechanics. > > Which will be, when CCP removes citadels form HS. > > > [@Namtis](#): > > > > I’m not sure that’s going to work very well. They’d have to cycle every one at the same time, issue all the decs they want, then issue no more decs for a week before repeating. Just seems hard for them to do well or efficiently. > > Not really. One date to do the three in succession every week : remove everybody, declare 50 wardecs, accept everybody. > > Just because you would not do that, does not mean that nobody would. And once it’s done correctly, you can even create several group chat for the three groups to invite. > > If it’s possible, someone will do it. That’s the basic of IT security. Just because YOU would not abuse it this way, does not mean that nobody would. They could do it, but it would not be efficient. They’d have one day every 7 days where their wars are down for at least 24 hours. It would mess with structure bashing. They would have to have 3 sets of pvp characters each and this gets far worse if they use alts, which they do. And for all this, they’d still pay an increased fee for wars, at a billion per war once they have 100 wars because doing this does not shield them from that mechanic. So yeah they could try to jump through all of those hoops. But it would barely be worth the effort and they still pay a fortune for blanket decs CCP could also say you’re not meant to circumvent the war fee mechanic in this way. This could be prevented entirely by instead of making the war dec fee increase with the number of players, they simply increase the fee for issuing war decs to 25m per additional war. Starts at 100m for first war. By time you’re at 100 wars the fee is 2.6 bill per war. Think I prefer the first system because it encourages people not to group into mega sized war dec alliances. Just need to have a mechanic that prevents abuse to circumvent the player count part of the fee. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/198 "2020-03-14T21:51:32Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > Think I stll prefer the first system because it encourages people not to group into mega sized war dec alliances Just don’t be war eligible and it doesn’t matter if they want to group up. Why do you hate people being social? ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/199 "2020-03-14T21:53:05Z")
You mean the hisec pvp crowd who all group together for the most easy and efficient killing of as many prey as possible? ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/200 "2020-03-14T21:54:36Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > You mean the hisec pvp crowd who all group together for the most easy and efficient killing of as many prey as possible? Yeah, why do you hate that they can group up, but insist that you should be able to? Just don’t be eligible for wars in the first place and you have no issue to face. It’s pretty simple. They could form a 10,000 person alliance and they could not touch you with a war if you are not eligible for them. ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/201 "2020-03-14T21:57:19Z")
Here’s an idea, to prevent them all leaving the corp and cycling alts to circumvent the player count portion of the war fee, it works like this: The calculation is based on the average number of players in their corp or alliance over the past 30 days. All players dropping corp to dish out the war decs on the cheap will be a wasted effort. ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 9:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/202 "2020-03-14T21:59:10Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > > [@Namtis](#): > > > > You mean the hisec pvp crowd who all group together for the most easy and efficient killing of as many prey as possible? > > Yeah, why do you hate that they can group up, but insist that you should be able to? > > Just don’t be eligible for wars in the first place and you have no issue to face. It’s pretty simple. > > They could form a 10,000 person alliance and they could not touch you with a war if you are not eligible for them. So newer players are not allowed small structures in hisec? Less they want legion of wolves upon them. ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/203 "2020-03-14T22:01:09Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > There are two paths that Namtis can take. > **[False dilemma](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma)** > > A false dilemma, also referred to as false dichotomy or false binary, is an informal fallacy based on a premise that erroneously limits what options are available. The source of the fallacy lies not in an invalid form of inference but in a false premise. This premise has the form of a disjunctive claim: it asserts that one among a number of alternatives must be true. This disjunction is problematic because it oversimplifies the choice by excluding viable alternatives, presenting the viewer with o... > [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > I dont mind if people point out that my opinions are rubbish, as that’s just a subjective opinion. Literally, in the case we are talking about, it’s factual, not opinion : You claim a definition, that you use for morale judgement, from nowhere. You try to force arbitrary morale on people, because they fit your point. Which is the opposite of morale, that is rubbish. Therefore if you don’t mind that your opinion is rubbish, then it means your opinion in general is worth nothing : since you don’t care about its value, it can be considered as having literally zero value. > [@Namtis](#): > > They could do it, but it would not be efficient. Please make correct quotes. I can’t answer someone whose quote are so general. They could do WHAT ? > [@Namtis](#): > > So yeah they could try to jump through all of those hoops. But it would barely be worth the effort and they still pay a fortune for blanket decs No. Just, no. This proposal is literally a stupid request to abusing. I gave you an example, and told you that the only way to prevent abuse is to literally prevent corps/alliances in a wardec from accepting people. Otherwise it won’t work. > [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > Yeah, why do you hate that they can group up, but insist that you should be able to? That is rubbish. He did not complain that they can group up, AFAIK. > [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > Just don’t be eligible for wars in the first place and you have no issue to face. It’s pretty simple. And it pretty simply is completely irrelevant to the issue. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763.md?page=9) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763.md?page=11)