# War decs should cost 10m additional isk for each outgoing war **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [March 14, 2020, 1:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763 "2020-03-14T13:29:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jonah_gravenstein/32/386819_2.png) [@Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jonah_Gravenstein)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/204 "2020-03-14T22:01:33Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > So newer players are not allowed small structures in hisec? Less they want legion of wolves upon them. Nobody is saying that except you, newer players are free to have hisec structures, but they have to be prepared to defend both it and themselves, because part of the cost of having a structure is that it makes them open to wardecs. If you don’t want to defend what you own, you don’t deserve it, and you will lose it. ~ Tippia ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/205 "2020-03-14T22:01:44Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > So newer players are not allowed small structures in hisec? Less they want legion of wolves upon them. Earlier you told me I didn’t read the thread because it wasn’t about structures. You even said: > [@Namtis](#): > > Pirat does not usually war dec for structure bashing. Now it is about structures? Ok, then I go back to my earlier post on how to avoid being at risk while using structures. This post: > [@War decs should cost 10m additional isk for each outgoing war](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-extra-war-you-declare/225763/149): > > You didn’t read the last paragraph clearly. And early on you were very much bleating on about new player corps and access to toys, and all of the post is relevant to that - being decced because you have war eligible members flying where PIRAT play, or you have structures easily found and in their face. Don’t do those things. You can’t get better than complete war immunity and it’s easy to do. Then you don’t even need to worry at all about wars for anyone in the corp. It’s as simple as this, … There’s even a diagram for easy reference. ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:02pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/206 "2020-03-14T22:02:11Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > So newer players are not allowed small structures in hisec? Less they want legion of wolves upon them. {citation needed} I know several people who have structures in HS (and already defended some and lost others) . They just put every structure in a holder corporation, and choose which one they defend or not. Of course against pirat it’s nope. But at least they decide when they engage or not. A holder corp is cheap : you need one alpha account, that create its own corp, and set its default structure ACL to a shared ACL he is set into as admin. The longest part is to find him when you create him (long cache ingame about toons), so the best is, create alpha, send mail to a toon, then connec to toon to send 100M back to alpha and add alpha to ACL admin, reco alpha, buy corporation management, train it, accept structures for corp, set default access all for structures in default access for ACL, deco, transfer structure, one day later add alpha ESI key to manage your structures safely (need one day for ESI to accept corporation change). ---
**Author:** ![QuakeGod](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/quakegod/32/480339_2.png) [@QuakeGod](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/QuakeGod)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/207 "2020-03-14T22:07:18Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > So newer players are not allowed small structures in hisec? Less they want legion of wolves upon them. Then don’t place your structures where the wolves are… ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/208 "2020-03-14T22:09:18Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > Here’s an idea, to prevent them all leaving the corp and cycling alts to circumvent the player count portion of the war fee, it works like this: The calculation is based on the average number of players in their corp or alliance over the past 30 days. All players dropping corp to dish out the war decs on the cheap will be a wasted effort. > [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > > [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > > > There are two paths that Namtis can take. > > [False dilemma - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma) > > > [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > > > I dont mind if people point out that my opinions are rubbish, as that’s just a subjective opinion. > > Literally, in the case we are talking about, it’s factual, not opinion : You claim a definition, that you use for morale judgement, from nowhere. You try to force arbitrary morale on people, because they fit your point. Which is the opposite of morale, that is rubbish. > > Therefore if you don’t mind that your opinion is rubbish, then it means your opinion in general is worth nothing : since you don’t care about its value, it can be considered as having literally zero value. > > > [@Namtis](#): > > > > They could do it, but it would not be efficient. > > Please make correct quotes. I can’t answer someone whose quote are so general. They could do WHAT ? > > > [@Namtis](#): > > > > So yeah they could try to jump through all of those hoops. But it would barely be worth the effort and they still pay a fortune for blanket decs > > No. Just, no. This proposal is literally a stupid request to abusing. I gave you an example, and told you that the only way to prevent abuse is to literally prevent corps/alliances in a wardec from accepting people. Otherwise it won’t work. > > > [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > > > Yeah, why do you hate that they can group up, but insist that you should be able to? > > That is rubbish. He did not complain that they can group up, AFAIK. > > > [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > > > Just don’t be eligible for wars in the first place and you have no issue to face. It’s pretty simple. > > And it pretty simply is completely irrelevant to the issue. I found a solution to circumvention of the mechanic through dropping alts. To prevent them all leaving the corp and cycling alts to circumvent the player count portion of the war fee, it works like this: The calculation is based on the average number of players in their corp or alliance over the past 30 days. All players dropping corp to dish out the war decs on the cheap will be a wasted effort. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/209 "2020-03-14T22:11:48Z")
> [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > And it pretty simply is completely irrelevant to the issue. It isn’t irrelevant. The OP has claimed that PIRAT declare war, not to go after structures, but to go after players in ships, as they did before. Players do not have to be war eligible at all. Don’t be war eligible and the issue of PIRAT going after them goes away, and wars even for PIRAT simply then become about structures. There’s nothing irrelevant about that, and it is an approach that large highsec corps and alliances use. It’s exactly the approach to take. ---
**Author:** ![QuakeGod](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/quakegod/32/480339_2.png) [@QuakeGod](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/QuakeGod)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/210 "2020-03-14T22:12:44Z")
I had a citadel in high sec that got nuked by structure bashers. Do you see me crying about it on the forum? Nope. I took a break, it ran out of fuel, it got nuked because I wasn’t there to defend it. Simple as that… ---
**Author:** ![QuakeGod](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/quakegod/32/480339_2.png) [@QuakeGod](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/QuakeGod)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:15pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/211 "2020-03-14T22:15:19Z")
And the fact that I anchored it at a star and made it public in a well-traveled system made it that much more of a target. Not smart on my part, but I know better now… ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/212 "2020-03-14T22:16:43Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > > [@Namtis](#): > > > > So newer players are not allowed small structures in hisec? Less they want legion of wolves upon them. > > Earlier you told me I didn’t read the thread because it wasn’t about structures. You even said: > > > [@Namtis](#): > > > > Pirat does not usually war dec for structure bashing. > > Now it is about structures? > > Ok, then I go back to my earlier post on how to avoid being at risk while using structures. > > This post: > > [War decs should cost 10m additional isk for each outgoing war - #149 by Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-extra-war-you-declare/225763/149) > > There’s even a diagram for easy reference. You said if they want a structure they need to accept being war decced. Well, players don’t like being shut out of the content of the game that should be accessible to everyone. It’s not like these people are putting up a major nullsec structure. Many just want a small place to call their own in hisec space. Apparently they’re not allowed such basic toys and are stupid if they dare place such basic structures in hisec without being able to field hundreds of seasoned pvpers against the mega hisec wardec coalition. ---
**Author:** ![QuakeGod](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/quakegod/32/480339_2.png) [@QuakeGod](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/QuakeGod)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/213 "2020-03-14T22:17:50Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > Well, players don’t like being shut out of the content of the game that should be accessible to everyone. Are miners shut out of mining asteroids and ice because gankers can kill them any time they want? No, they (well, most of them) accept the inherent risks and mine anyway… ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/214 "2020-03-14T22:18:36Z")
See, I figured this was just another call for a “I can never lose” option ---
**Author:** ![QuakeGod](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/quakegod/32/480339_2.png) [@QuakeGod](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/QuakeGod)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/215 "2020-03-14T22:19:24Z")
Exactly. The further the thread goes along, their real motives come into view… ---
**Author:** ![Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jonah_gravenstein/32/386819_2.png) [@Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jonah_Gravenstein)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/216 "2020-03-14T22:19:48Z")
> [@QuakeGod](#): > > Not smart on my part, but I know better now… Lesson learned, working as intended 😛 It’s the people that don’t learn from their mistakes that are the problem; they’re generally the ones calling for wardecs and other activites that cause people to explode, to be nerfed, again. Despite hisec being mechanically safer than it has ever been; the calls for further nerfs to explody activities in hisec continue ad infinitum. ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:20pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/217 "2020-03-14T22:20:36Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > It isn’t irrelevant. It is. The question is not how to not be wardeccable. The question is, how to avoid being jumped by a 100-ppl corporation when you just start your first structure, that took you time to set up with friends. So far nothing in the game says that “the moment you have a structure you are no more a small corp”, that’s just complete BS from you, refusing to acknowledge the issue. You just are making strawmen. Stop the BS already - sorry I forgot you don’t care. Well keep BS but that’s just very low value. > [@QuakeGod](#): > > I took a break, it ran out of fuel, it got nuked because I wasn’t there to defend it. Simple as that… BS. I know people who lost structures that had been fueled for \>1years. People are bashing structures in HS because they can, and because it’s free. > [@QuakeGod](#): > > No, they (well, most of them) accept the inherent risks and mine anyway… No, they learn to not be easy target and then gankers come crying on the forum that “AFK ORCA ARE UNKILLABLE”. Lol. ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:21pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/218 "2020-03-14T22:21:48Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > > [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > > > And it pretty simply is completely irrelevant to the issue. > > It isn’t irrelevant. The OP has claimed that PIRAT declare war, not to go after structures, but to go after players in ships, as they did before. > > Players do not have to be war eligible at all. Don’t be war eligible and the issue of PIRAT going after them goes away, and wars even for PIRAT simply then become about structures. > > There’s nothing irrelevant about that, and it is an approach that large highsec corps and alliances use. It’s exactly the approach to take. What’s your point? That’s what the mega hisec war dec coalition generally does. Not always, but mostly. Players also don’t have to play the game at all. If mega alliances of seasoned pvpers can stomp all over small corps who dare place a small hisec structure, they don’t have to hang about. And knowing how people tend to think, they’ll quit in disgust and spite and never look back. (Seriously, how dare they think themselves so highly that they are allowed to use basic features of the game without having the wrath of the mega hisec wardec coalition set upon them). ---
**Author:** ![Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jonah_gravenstein/32/386819_2.png) [@Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jonah_Gravenstein)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/219 "2020-03-14T22:23:02Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > basic features Structures are not basic features, they are luxury features that come with a cost. ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/220 "2020-03-14T22:24:06Z")
> [@Jonah\_Gravenstein](#): > > they are luxury features [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/a/f/5/af5a6f8b9fe62ff1510f77f23c1d6a7754a8a4e5.jpeg "J Jonah Jameson Laughing - Spider-Man 2 (Bluray version)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6M1OF_E0IA) A fitted raitaru costs less than a naked barghest. Source : I needed 4 barhgests today. ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/221 "2020-03-14T22:24:07Z")
> [@Jonah\_Gravenstein](#): > > > [@Namtis](#): > > > > basic features > > Structures are not basic features, they are luxury features that come with a cost. I’m fairly sure CCP intended for structures to be for everyone. The most expensive structures are for alliances, the mid sized ones are for small to medium corps and the smallest structures are for everyone. ---
**Author:** ![Zirconium\_Solkaze](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zirconium_solkaze/32/173693_2.png) [@Zirconium\_Solkaze](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zirconium_Solkaze)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/222 "2020-03-14T22:24:13Z")
People really ought to act collectively against them. They are a minority. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 10:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/223 "2020-03-14T22:25:23Z")
> [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > The question is, how to avoid being jumped by a 100-ppl corporation when you just start your first structure, that took you time to set up with friends. Citation needed, because the OP has been clear that: > [@Namtis](#): > > Pirat does not usually war dec for structure bashing. The thread is based on the premise in the OP that: > [@Namtis](#): > > Why? Because the reason that wars were made to require structures before was because hisec wars are driving players from the game. Since that change, the aforementioned 4 or 5 merc groups who initiate the bulk of hisec wars have merged into a single alliance, where they continue as they were before. It isn’t about structures from the OP. It’s about PIRAT becoming bigger and continuing as before. People should be consistent in their arguments. If it’s about structures then that’s one thing. But if it’s about a claim of megacorps continuing to blanket dec for targets, then not being a target is the best approach. When I raised the issue with the OP of structures, I was straight up told I didn’t understand the issue and hadn’t read the thread (which I had): > [@Namtis](#): > > Completely misses the point of the thread and clearly did not read. Pirat does not usually war dec for structure bashing. It’s only to get targets to kill most of the time. So I’ll call BS Anderson. Based on the OP’s arguments, this isn’t about your question, it’s about the above, and not being a target at all is very relevant, and used by Corps and Alliances in highsec now. At least have some consistency, otherwise trying to discuss is pointless. Is it about structures, or about PIRAT going after ships? [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763.md?page=10) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763.md?page=12)