# War decs should cost 10m additional isk for each outgoing war **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [March 14, 2020, 1:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763 "2020-03-14T13:29:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/104 "2020-03-14T17:11:05Z")
And I shall come to the aid of the Rex Shire when its darkest times o7 ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/105 "2020-03-14T17:11:41Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > Ramona’s narrative. My “narrative” is how Ive avoided leaving the game due to wardecs since 2009 ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/106 "2020-03-14T17:12:04Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > > [@Namtis](#): > > > > It would also be counter productive to their goal of mass killing of targets who they’ve generally massively stacked the odds against, if they killed all their war target structures. > > Sure, thats probably part of it, too. > > But you have to remember, these people wardec nullsec coalitions, too, like Goonswarm and PL. If Goonswarm came into hisec and wanted to fight back, these wardec corps wouldnt stand a chance. They would have to be docked up, for as long as Goonswarm wanted them to. > > Its always up to the people being wardecced. All in all, the odds are never stacked against you, if you dont want it to, and if you put in effort. > > Most corps dont, so they stay docked. > > Take a look at @Sabus_Narian for example. He was the head of a THOUSAND MAN CORPORATION. Clearly, this wasnt a small corporation. When his corp was wardecced, what did he do? > > ![war](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/e/2/e2e716a1cde6f33b9be8db166cf1b6d95565e176.jpeg) Most people won’t put in the effort. The evidence is they leave and don’t return. That’s probably because games are meant to be fun. As a newish player, being attacked by veteran pvpers, especially an alliance sized number of them, isn’t fun. ---
**Author:** ![Salt\_Foambreaker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salt_foambreaker/32/280119_2.png) [@Salt\_Foambreaker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salt_Foambreaker)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/107 "2020-03-14T17:14:19Z")
And that was when they nerfed war dec. Guess what, all those bears quit the next time they died anyway, if not war then gank, either way they quit. CCP learned their lesson. Now be a good care bear and leave. Also WTF is 10 million? What kind of peasant are you anyway? ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:15pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/108 "2020-03-14T17:15:20Z")
> [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > > [@Namtis](#): > > > > Ramona’s narrative. > > My “narrative” is how Ive avoided leaving the game due to wardecs since 2009 That’s good for you. Doesn’t help the situation for all those who did leave due to wardecs since 2009 (and earlier). ---
**Author:** ![Kezrai\_Charzai](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kezrai_charzai/32/394578_2.png) [@Kezrai\_Charzai](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kezrai_Charzai)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/109 "2020-03-14T17:16:03Z")
I think people tend to focus on the wrong issues and the wrong metrics with the last set of WarDec changes. Things like “player numbers didn’t increase”, “destruction didn’t increase”, “war corps just merged” etc. CCP responds to _CCP_ issues, not so much to player issues. Review the quote again: _CCP employee CCP Larrikin, a data scientist working on EVE Online, disclosed a shocking piece of data to the CSM regarding player-run corporations that find themselves as the target of a war. These corporations show a massive decline in player activity almost immediately, that does not regenerate once the war is finished._ What was shocking here for CCP was “decline in activity that does not return when the war is over”. Keep in mind that in late 2018, Pearl Abyss bought CCP for @ $250 million up front and @ $200 million in ‘performance incentives and goals’. It’s extremely likely that one of those goals was ‘keeping player numbers up’. It’s been pretty clear that CCP has pulled every low-effort trick they can to boost player numbers since then. Changing wardecs wasn’t to _fix_ them, or to improve the destruction stats, or to help new players. It was done purely (IMO) to stop the additional bleed of “massive declines in activity that do not regenerate”. I can’t recall ATM how the ‘additional performance incentives’ were said to have been structured. Probably over a 2-year period or something. So around October of this year, you can probably expect to see Hilmar cash in his chips and stop pretending he cares about the players of EVE, gather in his RL ISK(kr), and get the fiction department to write him a moving farewell to the world of CCP and EVE. Or, I dunno, maybe that’s me just being cynical today due to lack of sleep. YOU BE THE JUDGE! ---
**Author:** ![Ugren\_Okaski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ugren_okaski/32/181459_2.png) [@Ugren\_Okaski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ugren_Okaski)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/110 "2020-03-14T17:16:42Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > The evidence is they leave and don’t return. They don’t return to the same corporation. There is no evidence they actually leave the game. ---
**Author:** ![Salt\_Foambreaker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salt_foambreaker/32/280119_2.png) [@Salt\_Foambreaker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salt_Foambreaker)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/111 "2020-03-14T17:17:18Z")
Also they leave anyway because they are afraid of pixel death. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/112 "2020-03-14T17:17:56Z")
What do you suggest would? Ignoring my advice as to how to literally avoid wardecs but retain corp and structure use and ask CCP for yet another change that will do nothing to stop blanket deccing? ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/113 "2020-03-14T17:18:41Z")
> [@Monstah\_Khaos](#): > > Is why I left back in 2016-17. Returned to game back then and within a week had been war decd so many times I couldn’t mine, mission run, etc. I ate the cost of my sub and never looked back… To me, it destroyed the enjoyment of the game. EVE: The griefer’s paradise… will always remember someone telling me that when I started back in 2008 or so ![2020.03.14.17.15.24](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/3/0/30d0f48a545d3e5940b2cb5e85393b0dbe7bad3a.jpeg) You had 1 war that lasted a single week. > **[Retriever | WolfPain Zero | Killmail](https://zkillboard.com/kill/55000130/)** > > WolfPain Zero (ElevenBravo) lost their Retriever in Abagawa (The Forge). Final Blow by Liek DarZ (New Order Logistics) flying in a Catalyst. Total Value: 56,651,121.79 ISK > **[Retriever | Monstah Khaos | Killmail](https://zkillboard.com/kill/54600602/)** > > Monstah Khaos (ElevenBravo) lost their Retriever in Abagawa (The Forge). Final Blow by Liek DarZ (New Order Logistics) flying in a Catalyst. Total Value: 36,242,611.44 ISK > **[Badger | Cranial Rectidus | Killmail](https://zkillboard.com/kill/54270983/)** > > Cranial Rectidus (ElevenBravo) lost their Badger in Poinen (The Forge) Total Value: 33,648,784.41 ISK Looks like it has more to do with dying to CODE than it does with wardecs. Im gonna have to say DOUBT to your claims. ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/114 "2020-03-14T17:18:45Z")
> [@Ugren\_Okaski](#): > > > [@Namtis](#): > > > > The evidence is they leave and don’t return. > > They don’t return to the same corporation. There is no evidence they actually leave the game. That’s not what is implied in the article. It said they stop logging in and don’t return to the game. ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/115 "2020-03-14T17:22:03Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > Most people won’t put in the effort. The evidence is they leave and don’t return. That’s probably because games are meant to be fun. As a newish player, being attacked by veteran pvpers, especially an alliance sized number of them, isn’t fun. Actually, it can be, if your CEO mobilizes you as a group and you all go out and hunt and kill and die, as a group. But thats on the CEO. If your CEO sucks, and just tells everyone “Im not going to put in the effort or waste my own isk helping you guys, even though ive raked in hundreds of millions, even billions in taxes that i spend on myself, so just dock up till the war is over”, then yeah, everyone will have a shitty time, because no one is helping or assisting anyone else. ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/116 "2020-03-14T17:24:51Z")
> [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > What do you suggest would? > > Ignoring my advice as to how to literally avoid wardecs but retain corp and structure use and ask CCP for yet another change that will do nothing to stop blanket deccing? Without removing war decs entirely, there was never going to be a single magic change to fix the issue. Increasing the costs for blanket war decs is the next logical step. There needs to be an incremental increase in the cost for each additional active war. That gives incentive not to waste decs on corps that don’t seem like they’ll be worth attacking, such as low player numbers or isk poor players who won’t yield worthwhile ship kills. It will have an impact on blanket war decs, and that’s what’s important. If they have 100 active wars it will cost them a billion isk per war. More fool on them if they’re willing to pay a billion isk to target low value corps where all they kill is a T1 mining barge, or nothing at all. Cost could also be set to +15m per additional active war. Though I think 10m will be enough. ---
**Author:** ![Ugren\_Okaski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ugren_okaski/32/181459_2.png) [@Ugren\_Okaski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ugren_Okaski)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/117 "2020-03-14T17:25:31Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > It said they stop logging in and don’t return to the game. > These corporations show a massive decline in player activity almost immediately, that does not regenerate once the war is finished. The article clearly says about player activity in this corporation. ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/118 "2020-03-14T17:25:51Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > Increasing the costs for blanket war decs is the next logical step. There needs to be an incremental increase in the cost for each additional active war. That gives incentive not to waste decs on corps that don’t seem like they’ll be worth attacking, such as low player numbers or isk poor players who won’t yield worthwhile ship kills. And if it doesnt? What then? ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/119 "2020-03-14T17:26:49Z")
> [@Ugren\_Okaski](#): > > > [@Namtis](#): > > > > It said they stop logging in and don’t return to the game. > > > These corporations show a massive decline in player activity almost immediately, that does not regenerate once the war is finished. > > The article clearly says about player activity in this corporation. So how do you know that means the player is simply leaving the corp but not the game? If that is the case, why did CCP make such a big fuss about it and immediately change the war system? ---
**Author:** ![Namtis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namtis/32/191261_2.png) [@Namtis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namtis)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/120 "2020-03-14T17:28:05Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > > [@Namtis](#): > > > > Increasing the costs for blanket war decs is the next logical step. There needs to be an incremental increase in the cost for each additional active war. That gives incentive not to waste decs on corps that don’t seem like they’ll be worth attacking, such as low player numbers or isk poor players who won’t yield worthwhile ship kills. > > And if it doesnt? What then? As I said, there was never going to be a single fix. Rather than bulldoze the system out of existence, you make changes as required and then judge the result. Preferably getting closer to your goal as you go. ---
**Author:** ![Salt\_Foambreaker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salt_foambreaker/32/280119_2.png) [@Salt\_Foambreaker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salt_Foambreaker)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/121 "2020-03-14T17:29:00Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > Without removing war decs entirely, there was never going to be a single magic change to fix the issue. The “issue” is _players who are afraid of pixel death leave a PvP game_ The only people who care are the whiners who quit. ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/122 "2020-03-14T17:31:18Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > As I said, there was never going to be a single fix. Rather than bulldoze the system out of existence, you make changes as required and then judge the result. Preferably getting closer to your goal as you go. So in other words, youll be asking for one more nerf™ if it doesnt work. And its always going to be one more, until youve essentially removed wardecs. Do you see why this is a problem? ---
**Author:** ![Ugren\_Okaski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ugren_okaski/32/181459_2.png) [@Ugren\_Okaski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ugren_Okaski)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2020, 5:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763/123 "2020-03-14T17:31:43Z")
> [@Namtis](#): > > So how do you know that means the player is simply leaving the corp but not the game? And how do you know it is actually the reverse? > [@Namtis](#): > > If that is the case, why did CCP make such a big fuss about it and immediately change the war system? Because, in my opinion, the report was heavily influenced by the opinion of a person who created it, so the data was interpreted in such a way that wardecs should be removed from the game. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763.md?page=5) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/war-decs-should-cost-10m-additional-isk-for-each-outgoing-war/225763.md?page=7)