# When hope dies: my fears on the development direction of the game **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [May 13, 2021, 12:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067 "2021-05-13T00:12:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/184 "2021-05-14T22:29:05Z")
> [@Nascent3ch0](#): > > Now it will only take two in a row How so? ---
**Author:** ![Wombat\_4\_Combat](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wombat_4_combat/32/273063_2.png) [@Wombat\_4\_Combat](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wombat_4_Combat)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/185 "2021-05-14T22:30:57Z")
There is a cooldown to the WCS active module it does not autorepeat. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/186 "2021-05-14T22:31:19Z")
And why would this matter? ---
**Author:** ![Wombat\_4\_Combat](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wombat_4_combat/32/273063_2.png) [@Wombat\_4\_Combat](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wombat_4_Combat)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/187 "2021-05-14T22:32:35Z")
its like a couple of minutes i think. they are talking about going through one camp and busting with wcs and having the inability to fire it off so soon if they hit another one OR you crash back from one side to hit another group on the other side. There is alot of whining about it on reddit 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Ronin\_Gabe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ronin_gabe/32/455535_2.png) [@Ronin\_Gabe](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ronin_Gabe)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/188 "2021-05-14T22:33:37Z")
And once again, there are things in this game other than ‘properly organized’. I didn’t say the Occator couldn’t be wrecked under the right circumstances. Any ship can die. Only that I increase my chances of surviving being jumped, and since I detest nullsec, that will always only ever mean low-sec. And a ‘cycled’ WCS only makes something already weak against an organized camp that much weaker. So again, it’s another nod to nullsec and pvp in general. If all of you want to be pigeon-holed into a particular and specific style of game play, I guess that’s OK with me. I don’t need to check with anyone to see if it’s OK to observe that the change is probably going to be bad for indy. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:34pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/189 "2021-05-14T22:34:05Z")
Maybe my perspective here is a bit different because I’ve been a PvPer my entire time in EVE, but can anyone explain to me why you wouldn’t warp to a celestial and cloak after breaking the first camp? ---
**Author:** ![Wombat\_4\_Combat](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wombat_4_combat/32/273063_2.png) [@Wombat\_4\_Combat](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wombat_4_Combat)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/190 "2021-05-14T22:35:31Z")
lol because the whiners dont do that. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Ronin\_Gabe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ronin_gabe/32/455535_2.png) [@Ronin\_Gabe](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ronin_Gabe)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/191 "2021-05-14T22:35:40Z")
Just what the game needs, another way to make it more of a time sink…lol ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/192 "2021-05-14T22:36:14Z")
The WCS becomes a cool down module with a ‘long’ cool down. Ships previously immune to non-targeted point now only get bonuses reducing but not eliminating that cooldown. Setting aside the lost lowslot, as a result if you hit a camp on one gate, use the module, and jump to the next system the same exact camp…even if it’s only one dude, can stop you with impunity. You would have to dock up or warp around the system for the length of the cool down to replicate a current travel fit. It reduces the manpower and skill needed to prevent escape whilst eliminating one of the few defensive tactics the escapee had. In effect it makes every poorly set up gate camp as effective as an expertly set up one. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/193 "2021-05-14T22:36:44Z")
> [@Ronin\_Gabe](#): > > Just what the game needs, another way to make it more of a time sink…lol So your complaint about this new mechanic proposal is _literally_ that it’s making it take longer for you to get to your destination to sell your Tritanium and watch your wallet figure go up? No other _practical_ reasons? > [@Nascent3ch0](#): > > use the module, and jump to the next system the same exact camp Once again, _why would anyone do this_? ---
**Author:** ![Ronin\_Gabe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ronin_gabe/32/455535_2.png) [@Ronin\_Gabe](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ronin_Gabe)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/194 "2021-05-14T22:37:37Z")
What he said. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/195 "2021-05-14T22:38:11Z")
The cloak is no defense to a gate camp that knows what it’s doing. The WCS is no defense against a pair of camps that doesn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Wombat\_4\_Combat](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wombat_4_combat/32/273063_2.png) [@Wombat\_4\_Combat](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wombat_4_Combat)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/196 "2021-05-14T22:38:48Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > Once again, _why would anyone do this_? FailBears. ---
**Author:** ![Ronin\_Gabe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ronin_gabe/32/455535_2.png) [@Ronin\_Gabe](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ronin_Gabe)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/197 "2021-05-14T22:38:59Z")
Do I NEED another practical reason? Am I not supposed to be looking for ways to be the most efficient with my time as I can? ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/198 "2021-05-14T22:39:05Z")
Current pipes are usually blocked in one or two systems. All it takes now to make that pipe completely impassible is splitting the camp into n+1 groups. (DID I USE THE LINGO RIGHT?!?) ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/199 "2021-05-14T22:39:53Z")
You guys are _nuts_. It’s no wonder you’re dying to gate camps. You all have no idea how to address them from a tactical perspective. Do I really have to lay out the element of uncertainty you create for the campers when they can no longer be sure of your next destination, your intent to use it any time soon, your ability to use neutral traffic as a distraction, etc. etc.? > [@Ronin\_Gabe](#): > > Do I NEED another practical reason? Am I not supposed to be looking for ways to be the most efficient with my time as I can? This is literally the only justification your side has against this change, and it’s such a selfish and pathetic one that I’m actually in favor of CCP pushing this through just to spite you, even though _to me_ the modification to WCS mechanics has no practical changes in effects. ---
**Author:** ![Ronin\_Gabe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ronin_gabe/32/455535_2.png) [@Ronin\_Gabe](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ronin_Gabe)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:43pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/200 "2021-05-14T22:43:13Z")
Who said we’re dying to gate camps? Your ability to place words in someone else’s mouth is impressive. I don’t typically die in camps, but the way I utilize WCS’s in their current form on my haulers is one of the reasons WHY I don’t. Sorry if my being unhappy about changes to that doesn’t live up to your expectations. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/201 "2021-05-14T22:45:26Z")
We’re not nuts, we’re just pointing out a huge hole in your argument and you’re bias against seeing it. What we’re saying makes perfect sense if you consider how good gate camps and bad gate camps are set up. > [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > Do I really have to lay out the element of uncertainty you create for the campers when they can no longer be sure of your next destination, your intent to use it any time soon, your ability to use neutral traffic as a distraction, etc. etc.? This is a dishonest argument because most systems only have a handful of exists and most pipes only have 1 in and 1 out. It doesn’t take six people to cover each gate in the new system. 6 people can split up and cover multiple gates in sequence in more then one direction. The camp doesnt NEED to be set up well anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/202 "2021-05-14T22:47:43Z")
I usually use the cloak, and that usually works but doesn’t always…especially if the campers took the time to place cans and if they’re staffed with enough pilots. I’m afraid the cloak is next. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 10:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067/203 "2021-05-14T22:49:32Z")
> [@Ronin\_Gabe](#): > > Who said we’re dying to gate camps? Your ability to place words in someone else’s mouth is impressive. I don’t typically die in camps, but the way I utilize WCS’s in their current form on my haulers is one of the reasons WHY I don’t. Sorry if my being unhappy about changes to that doesn’t live up to your expectations. Then the proposed changes would have no impact on your survivability. They will only have an impact on your ISK/hour (a very minor one), which you’ve just admitted to anyway. Unless you, _out of principle_, continue to press the same buttons in the same sequence as you always have. > [@Nascent3ch0](#): > > We’re not nuts, we’re just pointing out a huge hole in your argument and you’re bias against seeing it. If you’re not nuts, then you’re genuinely bad at the game. > [@Nascent3ch0](#): > > This is a dishonest argument because most systems only have a handful of exists and most pipes only have 1 in and 1 out. It doesn’t take six people to cover each gate in the new system. 6 people can split up and cover multiple gates in sequence in more then one direction. The camp doesnt NEED to be set up well anymore. And if they do this, why would you have any more of a hard time making it past this (now diluted) camp by waiting out the timer between each jump? Holy crap, you carebears are genuinely bad at this. And I’ve _seen_ bad by sitting in your corporations and observing you, but the way you try to convince experienced fighters that they’re wrong about their knowledge of survival strategy is _astonishing_. Stick to the “muh ISK/hour” argument. At least that one can be respected by virtue of its sheer honesty. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067.md?page=9) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/when-hope-dies-my-fears-on-the-development-direction-of-the-game/311067.md?page=11)