Faction Warfare Rountable

(Asia Park) #3

Yep looking forward to this round table. I appreciate Ash and you for doing it!

(mkint) #4

I’m not part of FW, and I won’t be making it to the roundtable, but I only have 1 thing to say about FW anyway… I started EVE with the release of FW, I never joined it because I never wanted to leave my player corp. FW has always had a fluctuating reputation. Turning my back on the social investments spent years building for a novelty form of gameplay never made any sense whatsoever.

(Ermi Kianata) #5

Looking forward to this.

I feel like I’m safe in assuming it but, just in case, this is happening at 21:00 EVE time, correct?

(Jin'taan) #6

Yup, EVE time as always

(Oreb Wing) #7

What is the general opinion on timer roll backs against having dual timers (two separate timers, one offensive, one defensive). The latter is better, imo.

(Naxirian) #8

Well, the obvious one is imposing the same rules for docking at citadels in hostile systems as apply to docking at stations in hostile systems. Citadels took all of the meaning out of FW system control.

(Tristan Valentina) #9

Make it fun again and I would come back. Lets see some smart A.I. involved, lets see some inspace rewards, lets see interesting situations that can lead to combat situations that are not readily available in Null Sec or anywhere else in space.

(Oreb Wing) #10

I don’t know what non-fundamental changes means. If you can please clarify if that means no talk about missions; structures in lowsec; LP changes (taxing, balancing, tier).

A connection from Hallanen to Indregulle would be nice.

ps. Also, will questions be taken in text form and answers in voice? This keeps things orderly. Back and forth usually leads to chaos and a handful of folks that take up the majority of the time without saying anything new.
Cheers to a fellow pipe smoker from US west coast.

(Toxic Yaken) #11

Are there any plans to stream/record this for those who are interested but aren’t able to make the time?

(Max Deveron) #12

I agree with Toxic Yaken,

I myself would be interested in watching/listening in on this roundtable.

(Jin'taan) #13

I’ll record it and throw it up on my YT channel & on CZ

(Ashterothi) #14

I will be recording and streaming it.

We will be on the Cross Faction Discord: https://tinyurl.com/CrossFactionPodcast

(Asia Park) #15

You do know there is such a thing as Alts in Eve?

(Oreb Wing) #16

Link to recording please.

edit: NM, found it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EybCl6S2DKk&feature=youtu.be&t=3m14s

(Oreb Wing) #17

FW Roundtable Breakdown

Overview Issues
*New FW pilots have poor overview options with the default layout. /rebuttal Ability to link Overviews has mostly solved this problem.
*Separate overview settings that currently define Pilot Is In Your Militia or Allied To Your Militia together. Separate them so we can color tag allied factions and distinguish between them.

Plex changes and timer rollbacks.
*Timer begins to roll back after 5 minutes of inactivity within the complex.
*Non-Commitment to plexes. Have them reset to zero on a warp-out. /rebuttal Too heavy a consequence to various conditions which would encourage legitimate pvpers when they avoid a bad match up.
*Dual Timers. Have separate tickers for defensive and offensive timers. /rebuttal Encourages non-committal.
*Timer resets to zero when opposite faction takes control of the beacon. Possibly enlarge 30km radius for timer prerequisite.
*Timer reduced by kills.
*PvE modules affect or activate the complex timer. (Entosis Link was mentioned various times)

Loyalty Point Store
*More cosmetic items
*Navy Destroyers /rebuttal sub-cruiser line up is strong already.
*Galmil LP does not suffer devaluation like other factions. /rebuttal See Missions discussion

Fleet Agression
*Bubbles and AOE modules like smart bombs are causing security status hits against fellow fleet, alliance or militia members. /addition Scram chaining also gives sec hits to non-corp fleet members. /addition Add the option available in the Corporation window to enable Corp-wide friendly-fire to the Fleet menu. /rebuttal Separate fleets of allied pilots will still suffer standing hits from AOE’s of alternate fleets.

*Make standing requirement FDU specific and not faction wide.
*Keep standings penalty high to prevent AWOXing /addition Standings keep RP relevant and encourage long lasting commitment to one side.
*Standing loss for shooting neutrals within the warzone. /addition neutral should become suspect when entering a FW complex. /addition CCP has stated that they were looking into this. /addition Doesn’t make sense to eventually be shot by your own faction by defending FW specific content. /TEXT addition Suspect flag on entering plex must occur on entering the 30km radius of the plex and not on activiation. /addition A new flag timer for FW neutral aggression /rebuttal Major changes to crimewatch, or FW special flags, are not realistic change requests. /addition Logistics through highsec is negatively influenced by standings hits but there are 3rd party options available and alts. Sec tags for LP. /addition Sec tags exist currently with Clone Soldier tags inside lowsec. /rebutal Make it easier for FW to bump sec status up. /addition Have LP augment sec tag effectiveness. Going to Concord for tag turn in is arduous. /addition Too many items required for faction modules, NPC tags specifically. /addition No source for NPC tags with complex changes. /rebuttal NPC’s in missions still drop tags, but it is too dangerous to farm these tags.


*Citadels are being updated. New structures could replace the current ones and Citadels as they are should be SOV structures. Citadel could be a FW structure that melds with Ihub and becomes vulnerable by the same means. No need for vulnerability window nonsense. /rebuttal Too big of a change to request. /addition Citadels are being nerfed in the future. NDA on specifics, but they will be easier to deal with and make it easier to clear Citadels that are not fueled.
*Citadels offer station level services that have changed the landscape of FW. /rebuttal Citadels must be adapted to and any changes are too severe and drastic for what is already here to stay. We can’t go back to the old system without consideration to the investment currently in place with Citadels.
*Citadels are too cheap to deploy for the amount of utility they offer.
*Citadels could offer rewards for control of the system.
*Citadels bypass docking restrictions which were working during the height of FW activity.
*QoL request, Citadel access rights need to include militia options. /addition CCP has already announced access rights improvements.
*Citadels should interact with FW occupancy. Discourage alt anchoring options which bypass restrictions or give Citadels which grant enemies access a penalty for doing so.

System Bonuses
*Not very compelling system bonuses currently. /Text addition PI bonuses /addition Bonuses should be locked to faction possessing occupancy. /addition Penalties could apply to hostile structures, while bonuses are applied to occupying faction structures. /addition Heavily discourage neutral structures within FW systems. Structures anchored within the WZ should be linked to FW occupancy and should be endangered when system is flipped. /rebuttal Neutrals are a great source of content, we don’t want to lock all those pilots and content out of FW. /addition FW entities join the militia fully aware of restrictions and penalties in place, where as neutrals suffer none of the penalties but enjoy all the benefits. /addition Bonuses should apply to benefit or penalize FW entities, but not discourage or penalize non-FW entities. /addition Bonuses to refineries or reprocessing yields or cost of jobs.

FW System Contest Changes
*Encourage large scale battles. Planetside-style system conflict was proposed that only adjacent systems are opened or qualified as contestable, concentrating the activity in FW to specific areas. /addition See TikkTokk’s reddit post.
*Too much lowsec space designated to FW space. We should leave room for neutrals. /rebuttal Why should we worry about neutrals when we are liable to suffer all the repercussions? /rebuttal Too much power given to FW can adversely affect all entities that must travel through also. The unrealized concept of system-wide cyno jammers was noted. /addition FW offers a large portion of content to pirates/neutrals as well. /addition There should be a balance to changes that affect all those present inside FW space. /addition Large areas of Non-FW space are lowly populated. Any restrictions might encourage these systems to become populated. /addition FW has a big role in keeping lowsec alive.

LP Devaluation and Self-Nerfing VNI
*Mission running LP faucet is the largest factor of tier manipulation and devaluation. Accessibility to missions varies heavily between the factions, explaining the cause of galmil LP maintaining its profitability long-term.

Farmers and their affect on the warzone
*Blueballing. Farmers that have no intention of engaging or fighting. Plex farmers should be committed or be penalized some way for avoidance. Risk should be rewarded. /rebuttal New pilots depend on this too. It should not be nerfed.
*Warpcore Stabs should be looked at as a module. Module penalties should be applied to capacitor and warp requirements and stack accordingly to severely impact multiple stabs fitted.
*Farmers are used as a tool to maintain tier and exploited by dumping LP into systems to achieve an appealing tier level. Eliminate snowballing by balancing missions.
*Change the nature of the farmer. /change the requirements of clearing a plex. /addition Make AI smarter and more pvp like. /rebuttal Making burner style AI will introduce too much of a hindrance to pvp if it occurs during an attempt to clear the rat. /answer Make them a weaker version of burner but make them clearable quickly. /rebuttal Most farmers are defensive plexers. /addition Changes to rats has evolved over time to how they are currently because complaints about NPC’s interfering with subsequent fights. /addition Change defensive plexing by making the ‘button’ destructible to begin defensive timer. /addition A lot of offensive plexing is done by farmers with throw away destroyers and high dps cruisers that also avoid pvp. /TEXT addition The only fight that matters should be between players. /addition No matter what changes you make to modules or mechanics, there will be some pilots that will farm and find a way to avoid fights, while adapting to any changes, such as flying a venture. Penalties must be put in place for abandoning a plex. /addition Over design can become too complex or too arduous to make it fun.

Normalizing Rewards
*Different size complexes all having the same VP(victory point) value when completed. It was suggested that VP should be the following: 25% Novices; 50% smalls; 100% mediums (of current values); 200% for Large.
*Rewards are very easy to obtain, should encourage larger ships. /rebuttal Frigate content is good and should be encouraged, but it does appeal as easy Isk to farmers. /answer Once again, there should be penalties to non-committal.

*There should be minimal interference with player vs player content. /rebuttal There should be some level of interaction to minimize boredom.
*Bringing a system to vulnerable. Complex control should be over once the system is in a vulnerable state. All focus should be on the Ihub and there should be a damage cap that must be met in a window of time. /rebuttal Overplexing currently exists that can offer a buffer of 4 complexes to give sufficient time for Ihub bashing. /rebuttal There should be no need for that after it’s done. Focus should be on the hub. /rebuttal Conflict in multiple areas of a system adds good content and complexity to bashing.
*Missions. Changes have been made to missions. No change made has decreased the efficiency to how they are farmed. Add restriction to mission complexes that denies access to t2 and t3 ships to encourage more activity in plexes and possibly make missions a group activity.
*Alpha clones should be forced to join player corporations. /addition There is no taxing on LP. Maybe a tax on LP within the NPC corp would encourage alphas to join corporations.
*Better new player experience that introduces alphas in a better way to FW that reduces the chance of them becoming farmers.
*pvp arena deployables for 1v1
*120k duals in the warzones combined since November. That’s a bunch of ******* nerds right there. Everything was good and normal but the introduction of Citadels has fundamentally changed FW. Please change this and make things normal again.
*People have a habit of switching/jumping militias. 4way war could make lopsided or losing factions have a fighting chance. Many FW entities do not care for LP in the warzone but primarily and solely pvp.
*The solution is probably a collection of smaller changes that can offer us what we want.
*CSM elections coming up. FW representation.

(Please add anything I missed)

How to unbork FW megathread
(de Obliviator Preon) #18

I feel like we suddenly started supporting Nazis.


(Oreb Wing) #19

This round table discussion involved only players, a few of which were able to let us know things were being worked on but were still NDA at the time.

(Jin'taan) #20

Quick note before I hop on the plane back to England, this is probably the most stacked CSM in terms of FW ‘casual PvP’ players ever, with me Rhiload, Suit and Steve all having experience and participating in it. Still, I would ABSOLUTELY push you guys to converge on a candidate as just having everyone get in a room and talk about the topics w/ CSM candidates and getting these issues in the public dialogue is very important, even if a candidate doesn’t make it on board. If there’s anything I can do to help there let me know :slight_smile:

Going to sit down and write out my own notes on subjects to detail my PoV on why some of the larger issues are ‘larger’ in scope than it may seem, but all of your concerns and the recording itself will be going to CCP. Thank you once again for your time and energy, if you think of anything else my Discord/Slack/Twitter/Ingame mail/RL email are always open to people who want to talk about their corner of the game and what we can do to make it better!

(Oreb Wing) #21

I’m currently working on a brief explanation on how I think missions affect the warzone as a whole. The differences between the missions of each faction and a few thoughts on ideas I feel received much more wind in the sails than they should. I was able, with a high degree of accuracy, to predict the outcome of some of these bigger changes long ago by just seeing stats. I hope to also paint the missions problem in a truthful light. If the way is open, I should compete it, if not tomorrow, soon. Thank you for your time and giving us a voice, even if we have such differing views and ideas.

(system) #22

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