Change to war dec mechanics

The lack of whom? CCP?

You have no idea what you’re talking about :rofl:

Only the non-hackers we don’t really want. That would be like buying Call of Duty and not leaving the initial spawn point because you’ve heard there are brown people out there who want you dead. We can do without the people who want EvE to be something it’s not, in favour of the people who support what EvE already is. A harsh sandbox where you must fight for everything you have.

Everybody. Those who want it to remain the same shout it down rather than discuss it. People get tired of being shouted at rather than hold discussion and leave. CCP ignores the issue because nobody talks about it without yelling.

How many people posting in these threads want it to remain the same though?

Pretty much everyone, from what most of these threads show, would like changes to wardecs, not for them to remain the same.

The differences don’t seem to be whether change is needed, but what the change should be and I can’t see one side shouting anymore than another.

The problem?

As it is people already say we don’t need change. Do Little also listed the current methods of avoiding war. Not good ideas, nor bad ideas, but merely status quo ideas. Change can make wars better, or worse, or not important at all. People still spout status quo as a defense rather than discuss things. So we’re left with status quo. We’re left with war being not important at all.

With everything that is making war so easily unimportant what’s the point in making any change of any format to make war actually a situation where people engage in combat? A reason for the defenders to fight back? A point for attackers to gain? They don’t exist. You have no reason to fight as a defender because you can never end a war that way without the attacker’s consent. Attackers don’t have to do anything at all to go to war. There is no risk.

Which people, and where are they shouting down change?

Even in the quote you’ve used, Do Little lists a reason for change. That doesn’t seem like saying change isn’t needed.

He’s also rejecting every other possible format for it being changed. Read it twice.

We all have views, but sure, let’s put Do Little in the “wants it to stay the same and shouts it down group”.

Who else?

Not saying you are wrong, it just isn;t my experience in these threads (in what I read there is broad agreement that change is needed), and it’s too easy to invent facts that support an argument (it happens all the time, without actually being supportable).

I could go on for days listing things really. But here’s one from this thread also.

Which is weird to be saying “lets ignore” while responding in a player features and ideas section.

I could scroll up more. I do not feel need to.

None of those give any idea that those 3 people don’t see a need for change; and if that is what shouting is, then we clearly have very different views on what constitutes shouting.

In these 3 cases:

QuakeGod: is tired of reading these types of threads, but no indication that change isn’t needed (and I agree with your reply, that if someone is tired of the endless topic coming up over and over and over, then just don’t read them). What’s the shouting down bit?

Solecist: Makes a comment about how much this thread (especially as it’s a daily topic) will achieve. No indication that change isn’t needed (actually I’m pretty sure Solecist agress with the need for change, based on discussion in the discord) and where’s the shouting? Is that really shouting down others?

Salt: Clearly doesn’t like this specific change (structure based war idea), which he sees as too much like sov mechanics, so gives it a -1. No indication either way whether he thinks wars should remain the same and shouting? Is that a shouting post?

I’m just not seeing what you are claiming. How is any of this shouting down others?

Ah. So you want the exact definition. Very well.

Browse a few of the threads on war itself. We’ll see a bunch of the same people saying no every single time to any suggestion for all of it.

I’ve browsed every one of them (taken part in most). Ultimately, it’s not my claim. I’m just questioning it and clearly you don’t actually have the evidence to support your claim, otherwise it would be easy to post it, rather than the common “go find the evidence yourself” argument.

No loss. You aren’t doing anything many others don’t also do - write something that seems to support your own argument, without actually validating it. Happens all the time.

You received multiple statements in this thread and then decided they were not what they said.


What possible reason would I have in providing more when you’ll just change what you want to be rather than what is?

Actually, they are clearly what they said. It would be crazy to argue otherwise, and I’m not doing that.

They aren’t what you said.

There’s a difference.

  1. There is no room for proper discussion.
  2. There are no enforced standards. We only have rules.

You require at least these to have proper discussions.

Then how about we discard any and all statements about what needs to change and collect up the views of people on the thread about what is good, bad, and ugly about the way war currently acts. Or we can ignore everything again.

Put your opinion in, or don’t. Your choice.

My opinion is already in, across several threads going back the last 2-3 years.

I’m not a chef, yet I know what food I like and don’t like. I’m not a game designer, yet I know what game design suggestions I like and don’t like.

As a “not a game designer” I definitely don’t think my ideas are ever any good themselves, and me adding in crap ideas to the growing list of crap ideas, won’t add anything of value. All I would be doing (as evidenced in the suggestions I have made in other threads) is polishing a turd, not actually throwing it away and replacing it with something that actually works.

So personally, while it isn’t required to be a game designer to critique suggestions that are made, I personally see it as better effort on my part to just continue to highlight that wars do need changing, and hopefully the real game designers, based on the weight of the community continually communicating a need, will actually design something good.

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Then tell us what you think is good.
Tell us what you think is bad.
Tell us what you think is ugly.

Or keep using if by wiskey.

My thoughts on all these things are already over a tonne of threads.

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Where? When?