Not from the forums, at least.
Yes. Your specific issue is that you donât own your space, the cloaky campers and the BlOps team does.
Sovereignty does not equate to ownership. Iâve seen losec groups totally own their claimed space with zero actual sovereignty, and nullsec groups hold sovereignty without exercising a whit of actual control over their space.
Working as intended.
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And they apparently own your alliance as well, since you canât get their spies out of your fleet and organize anything without them immediately knowing about it.
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Seems to me you have an issue with players at their computer, actually playing and watching, ready to strike at a moments notice. Also your main issue is that you have spyâs in your corp.
Non of which is AFK Cloaking???
Not entirely sure what you are asking for here, as you didnât mention any suggested changes in your post. Probably just a âremove cloaks from game because someone else uses cloaks to really kick the crap out of my corpâ
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You should have learned by now thereâs a few bot like defenders of the cloaking status quo in this thread. Best to just ignore them, they add nothing to the discussion.
In regrad to your notion that a degree of counter-play should exist when it comes to cloaking, the amount of general reworks and other changes necessary to actually balance that out in the game is staggering⌠not that CCP seems all that focused on balance.
But in the event they are, the only solution Iâve managed to arrive at is letting cloaking do itâs thing, until it canât. Effectively: Cloaking for extended periods of time would generate heat, which would damage mods and could lead to the ship having itâs cloaking device damaged. This makes sense in a realistic manner, as the ship is internalizing some if not all of the signatures that other ships could use to find it. It allows the cloaked ship to be cloaked for abit, but not forever. If you want to keep an eye on a location, drop a structure, not a cloaked alt.
On another note, itâs refreshing to see the same few people stuck in their hole and spending valuable time arguing the same copy pasted points over and over again when they could be doing anything else, but here we threaten their identify and way of life by merely suggestion cloaking is too safe.
Anything to help bring your heart rate up. Make sure to talk a walk after any of the few of you cloaky defense crew expectedly reply with an expected reply.
Here we go with ârealismâ in a computer game.
I would counter that many modules in the game should then be required to track wear and tear and eventual failure if not dealt with.
Guns and Launchers⌠cycling for extended periods of time ratting, eventually without cleaning/maintenance will jam and possibly explode resulting in that module being damaged.
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If you want realism, then my Vagabond moving at 13 km/s should instantly vaporize an exhumer when I slam into itâŚ
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Yep. Funny how you donât criticize yourself for being âbot likeâ despite always posting the same terrible complaints.
Effectively: Cloaking for extended periods of time would generate heat, which would damage mods and could lead to the ship having itâs cloaking device damaged.
Effectively: buff RMT botters and bot-like players by making local a more effective means of avoiding PvP.
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Okay⌠so Iâm going to give you a short story, and it comes with some advice that will make it so you donât have to give a rats butt about cloaky campers and all that crap.
When I started out, I moved to Providence (yeah I know itâs the butt end of space, but it still is a good place to start in null if you stick your fingers in ears and scream lalalala at any âadviceâ those dinguses giveâŚ)
Providence is where people go to get easy kills. Mainly cause theyâre easy to get. Lots of nerds not paying attention, carrier ratting while AFK, probably a few bots in the TSOE pocket, etc.
So basically itâs gank city. I went down there, and krabbed up to an Apoc without much issue, got into a corp down there (Hey Eddie!) got access to intel, and then this happened:
Basically a roaming gank fleet in bombers came and grabbed me. For a while I whinged that it was CVAâs crappy intel channels (theyâre likely still crap) since no-one had reported it. But then I got a convo later from one of the guys that ganked me and he enlightened me about what I did wrong.
First off, I relied on intel channels. While intel is nice as a heads-up, it should never be relied on to keep you safe. People sleep, go AFK, etc. The best way to keep safe is to fly properly. The easiest way to do that is to always have several alignment points that you can align to while you krab.
If youâre aligned, you can press warp and youâre gone. Youâre now safe and can warp to a citadel and anchor up and wait it out or dock up and pull out a defence fleet.
After that I joined SOUND. They were still Provi nerds, but they were pretty damned competent Provi nerds. If you were online, you were on comms. If you were in corp, you had combat ships ready to go. Keep in mind that SOUND back then had a MAX SP cap of 15M for recruitment. So most of the people in there had crappy fitting skills, generally crappy ships overall. Most of us could barely get into a battleship, and certainly not for PvP (Providence rats/ore are horrid for making ISK).
We mined, krabbed, and generally did whatever we wanted, even with âredsâ camped in our system. They rarely even attempted to jump anyone because we didnât make easy targets. Our miners flew Procurers or Skiffs, and every ship was a bait ship. We tanked everything just a bit more, and almost always had a point or scram on our krabbing ships. Yeah, it hurt efficiency a little, but we didnât get attacked often because the people that came through there generally knew SOUND defended our little alleyway with every pitchfork and torch we could muster. If anything, most people came through our pipe cause they knew no matter the day or time we were always ready for a fight.
If you want to be able to krab and mine and otherwise run your stuff and have fun, then by all means do it. Get your corp to get its crap together and hold your space. Either that, or bend the knee to someone else in a bloc alliance and pay for protection. Either way, the easiest way to krab and mine without a care in the world is to A) be active, and B) always rememberâŚ
Also for PvE ships, a hint - you can anchor while staying aligned easier if you use a Higgs rig⌠slows you right down to stay in range of that rat or rock.
edit:
I just realized youâre in BNI. If you guys are having problems with cloaky campers you have enough people to hold and defend with. own your damned space. And your leadership should be ashamed. BNI used to be pretty competent, fun people to get in fights with, granted they tended to be even more noob than SOUND was back then (those talwar fleets!), but you still brought it. You should have some competent people by now that should be teaching you and other newbros to corp how to defend your space and avoid being ganked.
Get the whip crackinâ at your leadership, they know better than this crap, and if they donât, find someone who does. BNI dudes are the last ones I expect to see on here complaining about cloaky campers.
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Hiiiii! Long time no see! *waves frantically* 
I think itâs not even funny, when some random idiot believes that people, who defend afk cloaking, which hurts botters, are defending botters. Thatâs literally the single most stupid thing Iâve read this year, by a far margin. It reeks of desperation. He has literally no argument left so he just invents something so absolutely out of this world, he might as well be a trump supporter.
Congratulations for being the single most intellectually piss poor moron in this thread.
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So what? You only need to do so as a counter to local being way too effective as a tool for avoiding PvP. Remove local and people will just log off instead of staying cloaked forever.
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Yest it would. The ONLY reason to stay cloaked for long periods of time is to mitigate local as an intel tool. If local doesnât exist then you just log off when youâre inactive. Remove local and you solve the problem entirely, no further balancing required. But as long as local remains in its current state any nerf to long-term cloaking is unacceptable.
Because thereâs no point anymore. If you arenât actively at your PC playing the game then what benefit is there to being logged in and cloaked compared to logging off until you come back? The only reason to stay logged in is so that local doesnât give away your AFK/active status.
Now, you would certainly still see active camping, but thatâs an entirely different situation and one that all these proposed cloak nerfs do nothing to change.
And this is the key point: it makes the whole thing more tedious but it doesnât add any meaningful risk of failure or create interesting player interactions. It just forces cloaked players to keep a hauler alt full of fuel nearby. It makes about as much sense as removing auto-repeat from modules and forcing players to manually fire each shot.
Ok, sure. Warp disruptors, shield extenders, etc, do not require ammo. Should we now impose a fuel requirement on shield extenders so that you canât have passive HP for too long before needing to refuel?
What I really want is bursts and bubbles that can decloak a player ship, intelligence structures that can help give an approximate locale of where cloaked ships are present to go hunting for them.
Thatâs all nice to speculate about but none of it can happen until local is removed entirely. Otherwise you just buff RMT botting and bot-like players while adding zero additional player interaction (because nobody will stay idle while cloaked if they can be found).
100% wrong. Cloaks either require significant fitting and impose crippling penalties or only go on ships that have been balanced with cloaking in mind. A cloak may only cost 1 PG and 1 CPU on a covert ops frigate but thatâs only because the base stats of the ship (including PG/CPU) have been designed with the assumption that a cloak is fitted.
Needs to be turned on once to use indefinitely.
A shield extender doesnât even need that much. You equip it to your ship, you get additional HP forever.
Might make them aware of a cloaked ship but unless they go out and find it and destroy it, it is no different than seeing a player in local is cloaked and then they just never undock anyways.
Except youâre missing the point here. There wonât be any ship to find in the first place because nobody is going to go AFK while cloaked if they can be hunted down and destroyed while AFK. Even the most pathetic nullbear trash is capable of engaging and destroying an AFK ship that just passively sits there waiting to die. Therefore you would be able to guarantee with near 100% accuracy that if you see a name in local it is an active player and itâs time to dock.
Again, covert ops cloaks impose penalties too. They just do it in the form of inherent stat reductions to the ship, not high fitting on the module. Instead of, say, having the cloak give -50% EHP the ship stats have 50% less EHP than comparable non-covert ships. You see this repeated with other modules too, when it is only used by a single class of ship CCP sets the fitting requirement to zero and balances the base ship stats with the assumption that you are using it.
And of course non-covert cloaks have fitting costs and massive penalties just for having them equipped, so your argument fails there too.
The ship itself is just a tool for using the cloak, the whole point is to observe the enemy so you know whether to bring other ships to perform other roles therefore the penalty is irrelevant because you donât need that ship for any other purpose than to use a cloak.
Now think about what youâre saying here. That covert ops cloak has such a huge penalty that the only thing the ship can do is cloak! You need another ship to do anything else!
I understand now that you want to be able to AFK cloaky camp
No I donât. I want local to be gone so I donât have to. AFK cloaking is just the least-bad solution in a world where, in the absence of AFK cloaking, local provides immediate and 100% accurate notification that a threat has appeared and then immediate and 100% accurate notification that the threat has left and it is safe to undock. Remove the ability to use local as a 100% effective tool for RMT botters and bot-like players to avoid PvP and there will be no further AFK cloaking.
Again, think about what you are saying: the cloaking ship pays such a high price for its cloak that you canât take it into combat at all and need to bring in other ships to do the actual fighting.
they just placed pods as observation points to spot incoming ships, they didnât need to know a player was in local because as soon as the pod spotted a gate flash they already knew a player had entered system.
This is missing the point. Watching for gate flashes is useful, but it doesnât allow you to spot threats coming in via wormhole or threats that log off in the system and may come back at some future point. But because local no longer gives away those threats there is no further need for AFK cloaking, if youâre going to go AFK you just log off and log back in when youâre active again.
Nobody claimed that anyone is unable to mine or rat at all. Iâve stated numerous times that activity is reduced. Stop relying on straw man arguments.
Why donât you stop trying to be the cool guy who argues and think about it for a second. Do you seriously not see the problem? Such a stupid question casts doubt on anything youâve said previously.