Player Retention Through PvP Level Rooms

I only just resubbed a month ago, after being away for 8 years, and the game has changed a lot. In some ways better, in others it’s peculiar and makes me think that some of these changes were done specifically to make Alpha players have more power than they used to in order to attract these players into remaining in eve. This feeling was born out by CCP’s change to allow T2 medium weapons to Alpha players.

I don’t know where new players go when they reach the limits of their abilities, but I suspect they generally remain in hisec and play the various roles there, because most of those new players get a awfully hard and painful lesson on PvP when doing a venture into losec and I suspect most either then go on to null and find a newbie friendly alliance looking for members or remain in hisec. The big problem with learning PvP is that apart from the game skill levels and fits, the real learning comes through experience which involves losing many ships and pods, more often than not to larger numbers and far more experienced players. And that is very frustrating and, I suspect, results in many players leaving and not coming back.

I therefore suggest that CCP implement hisec PvP rooms that are similar to FW plexes in the restriction of ship types, but additionally restrict the number of ships and the players skill levels, the same as missions range from level 1 to 4. The actual balancing of player SP levels will, of course need to be adjusted over time. This would be an improvement over the duel feature as that is seriously unbalanced and vulnerable to abuse.

The rooms could have, for example, two gates where the opposing players gather before the gate is unlocked. Concord, of course would not interfere there.

It might well get more players interested in learning PvP and staying in eve.

How would you restrict player “Skill Levels”?

Based purely on SP. The game can check on that, obviously. The PvP rooms would really be meant for newer players, so the SP restriction would max out at the current alpha limit of 5 million sp. There’s a big difference in SP between a 5 million SP player and a new player three weeks old, so there would be, say the 4 levels mentioned above which would divide the SP restrictions into ranges.

So I have a friend who has done nothing but mine for like 3 years. He’s recently gotten bored of mining and wants to try PvP for the first time, but he has 80m SP in to mining and reprocessing skills. Your system means that he’s going to paired up against other people with 80m SP but all of that in combat skills?

If you read my second post, you’d see I said the maximum SP allowed in would be the current alpha limit of 5.5 million SP. It’s meant to be new player friendly. I suppose the system could limit the SP limit to just combat oriented skills, so that even an older player with high SP like your friend, could enter if his combat skills were low.

Alternatively, just create an alt to do it, or an alpha account.

Ok, that didn’t really answer my question, but sure, let’s go with that.

Now you have the problem with people making smurfs and alt accounts that have low-in game SP but the players have very high out-of-game experience. They know things like how to scram kite, how to maintain transversal, how to fit their combat ships properly, etc. How would you system stop that or would you just let all those new players be preyed upon by high experience alts?

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How about we do not do that? This removes aspects of EVE that make EVE EVE.

You gain experience through success and failure. You already have areas in low sec where you can only use a very limited selection of ships: Novice faction warfare complexes.

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As I said, just create an alt or an alpha account then. Is that what you meant?

As for inexperienced players being preyed upon by nameless alts of very experienced players, yes, I’m sure that would happen, but it would remove their ability to do it in vastly superior ships. It is about learning PvP after all.

Wait, so your entire issue is just about the ships?
So farming newbros is fine, as long as they’re not in “vastly superior ships”?

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8 years ago I would have even argued that FW plexes are bad for the game, as they introduce un-sandbox like areas etc. But the game was radically different then. There were no T3 or command destroyers that cost the same as an AF yet were vastly more powerful. There was far more free form combat in the form of small gangs and often enough BS shootouts as well. That activity has dropped off.

The main reason I proposed this, is for player retention. Eve is slowly bleeding customers, and has been for a long time. They would not have introduced free to play alpha accounts if that were not the case.

CCP has made some really bad decisions over the years, but I think, and hope, that things are looking up.

I’m not sure what your problem with the idea is. PvP will always be unequal, but this proposal would level the game where a newbie could at least learn.

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Can you show some evidence that suggests your change specifically would increase player retention?

I don’t see how this would increase player retention when all I can see are newbros getting farmed by players who are more skilled and have more experience.

If you die in a fight to someone who has a bigger ship than you, I can understand that the player would understand the justification for losing. But when the player fights someone else in the same ship class and constantly loses over and over again, the level of frustration would be even worse.


How do you know the newbie would “learn”?

Most players who are unfamiliar with PvP will die and be at a loss as to why they died. How does this help them “learn”?

Hi OP, your desire for equal fights (more or less) is totally fine, and there are actually some groups that do this in the form of dueling in 1.0 security space. You’re pretty much 99% safe- except from your opponent. If someone is above your skill level, or above your ship class, you can simply not accept the fight. If you’re interested in learning more, let me know (I know of one group in particular, but I’d have to find the link first)

I would hope that it would help them learn by levelling the odds somewhat, especially compare to the current situation where a new player stands absolutely no chance in losec.

I might of course be absolutely wrong. Maybe it’s a terrible idea.

Are the duelling mechanics different in 1.0 systems?

My idea wasn’t for me. I used to pew pew in FW all the time and plan on going back when I’ve finished skilling up some alts. I just sort of thought about helping newer players overcome their fear of losing ships and pods in pvp.

Dueling mechanics are the same- but CONCORDs near instant response time in 1.0 means that anybody coming to ruin your fun will be dealt with very quickly.

You seem to have a fundamental misunderstanding of EVE PvP.
If a new players stands no chance in lowsec, then they’re also going to stand no chance in this system.

They are still going to be out-fitted and out-piloted by the people they fight against. I don’t see why your system is any different than two people just meeting in lowsec. The only main difference is now the experienced player can just queue up to fight in these PvP rooms instead of going out and looking for new players to farm.

Ok, so maybe an easier idea would be to include duels with the player career agents? I have no idea how that could be done, i.e. finding another newer player, but I suppose the system could match up players doing the career agents.

As I said, maybe it’s a terrible idea.