A Modest Proposal

I could support that…

1 Like

Me too.

Tons of experienced and knowledgable (freighter) gankers in here, who all are fully able to make a good call about this, because they’d be the one impacted by this. Maybe PvPers should make more mission related suggestions, which they’d believe to be good ideas.

1 Like

I never liked the old self-destruct…

Many fights, death comes slow. Should not be able to avoid loss mail and deny loot just because you are dying slowly. This simply restricts viable/profitable targets for players like pirates.

I’d definitely prefer:

  • The self-destruct to be immediate
  • No salvage at all
  • No “kill mail” or any other benefit, tangible or intangible, to any of the attackers

Some gankers just want risk-free farming of loot or kills. IMO they’re no different from miners (actually they risk even less), and deserve no support from the game for their playstyle.
Their playstyle doesn’t deserve to be banned either of course … but IMO they need to participate in the risk of PvP, and gankers (by definition) do not.

BTW - if I was to do an analysis and write a serious suggestion for this, one of the things I’d consider is the possibility of the self-destruct being powerful enough to take smaller ships with it - imagine turning an antimatter powered ship into a bomb (just release whatever separates the antimatter from normal matter): the explosion would be proportional the the size of the ships engine and/or cap.

I’d happily pay another 50% “negative insurance” for that (i.e, lose the value of the ship + contents plus that much ISK in cash) for this.


Alexandria, is that you??


Is that directed at me? If so, no. I’ve never had an account or a character with “Alex” anywhere in its name.

You may conclude that I have enjoy PvP no respect for people who gank newish, ISK-poor players though.
I won’t buy ISK via PLEX for normal play. but I wouldn’t hesitate to buy a few hundred USD worth of PLEX from CCP just to deny any benefit to anyone who ganked me while I was still trying to get set up in EVE so I could “fly only what I can afford to lose” :slight_smile:

I’m starting to sense some rage/tears attached to this “modest proposal”

just me?

edit: …

Xuxw Xu

I used to be a professional economist. The principles of the EVE economy are clear to me, but not the finer details.

For example, AFAIK entry of ISK into the economy is completely artificial, controlled by CCP. I.e. I don’t think players can manufacture ISK, just move it around (sometimes destroying it by e.g. spending it with NPCs . It’s not impossible there are exceptions to this though - it’s up to CCP. I can’t know from game experience, and I CBA checking the details.

If you’re referring to the people in the “CCO income” thread who didn’t’ pick up that increasing CCP income implies increasing the RL price of the number of “player months” sold - surely it was obvious from the title? Instead several people stared “forum screaming” at me.
What followed was just the natural response pattern in a forum: “tit for tat” in politeness and clarity (with, in my case, a 20% discount to help it converge towards relative calm).

The trolls were the people who didn’t consider starting by asking “control questions” or making polite comments, and then didn’t recover as the “temperature” started falling.

What about a lowslot module that nullifies resistances and halves shield armour and hull but destroys all cargo and the wreck? Of course only bought with 500 plex in the NES

The last time I was ganked due to ignorance rather than taking a calculated risk, or otherwise accepting what was going on was 12 to 15 years ago. I don’t know the date exactly, but in terms of EVE history:

  • EVE was already a mature game
  • BoB were active, and were the “EVE elite” of the day
  • Goons were active and very visible (led by “The Mittani”), and held some Sov (Delve maybe) but there wasn’t really a hot war between them and BoB
  • Something had happened (with Goons involved) that gave EVE a burst of visibility in the gaming press, possibly for the first time, and I was one of rather a lot of rookies in EVE at the time.

If you’d asked I would have explained the specific context of my suggestion (it’s connected to an interesting communication problem between different kinds of PvPers).

That’s not happening.

Can’t have everyone carrying this thing around denying all loot and killmails.


Actually has been proposed before. One version was a cargo containment that exploded on ship loss destroying everything in it, no loot. Another was a simple module that took the whole ship with it when it went.

Denial of loot is an interesting aspect but there needs to be a give and take. Giving up cargo space or a low slot, something like that.


I agree in principle, but in practice you are always better off fitting something that will reduce the chances of you getting exploded or make you more ISK. Loot denial doesn’t help you, at best it provides some benefit for the herd, so on a game theory level it isn’t an optimal choice, or even a rational one. Better to squeeze on another yield module to eek out more profit or some tank to reduce the chance of attack then some loot denial module that costs you something to use but provides no benefit.

I think uptake of such a module would be near zero. Spite sounds good to people like the OP, but not many people are going to pay for it when shown the cost. And if there isn’t a significant cost, it will just undermine piracy as a major incentive to attack other players. It probably isn’t worth the dev time.

Instant would be game breaking, I’m thinking 1 minute like a docking timer

I appreciate the reference to “A Modest Proposal”, one of the only famous literate works I’ve read that recommends killing and eating children.

I’m not sure if you present your “Modest Proposal” in the same spirit as your more famous namesake…

1 Like

Absolutely fair, I’ve never been one to gank (with a couple small exceptions that included a quantity of grandstanding for noobs that CODE would not have approved of…

You like new players better than others.
Most others just yell and scream about the children,
but they’re all phonies, fakes and hypocrites.

We really need to find some time to play together.

1 Like

I’m just saying… I’ve successfully done maybe 3 ganks ever. And never in a really expensive ship.

But I’d approximate my average viewership (in the belt, watching for the big event) was in the neighborhood of 20 for each.

You’ve got to advertise in local if you want to be a star.

Noobs love ■■■■ like that. I also have a POS killmail… where me and the guys were flying kestrels.

Viewership wasn’t really that great for that one.

Akiainavas used to be so much fun.

I think (and I am not sure) that the theory might be that if there is no profit to be had some gankers might not make the kill. Loss with no hope of benefits as a deterrent.