A Request to relook at resource allocation's


(Makshima Shogo) #1

Back in the good days belt ratting/anom’s where pretty good, when Plex price was 350/400mil per month sub. Isk has been spiraling out of control it is now worth 4x less than it did back then, but rat bounties have not changed 1 bit to compensate. I understand that ratting carriers would then become too strong if rat bounties on belts and anoms would all of a sudden rise, so to counter this I request that unrated sites have much higher rat bounties and that the sites are gated so that carriers cannot access them, and that the bounties on the sites increased with the site difficulty, maybe including DED’s into this equation as they are very difficult sites to run with often 0 drops at the end to make up for the hours spent.

The hopeful effect would be that more high sec pilots and low sec pilots venture into 0.0 more often to ninja run these sites or become more lured out. I feel atm incursions offer so much isk / no risk (except for suicide gankers but that can be avoided by flying ships that arent super blinged.) and this solution will balance null sec income a bit better vs the high sec income without a nerf to incursions (which would make a lot of players rage on here lol).

If players are averse to increasing null sec income (Not including anom’s as those are broken atm with supers ratting them) then I would suggest shifting incursions to LP heavy focus (3x or 4x more) with little to no isk so that isk doesn’t become less valuable over time. (Beware the incoming rage lol)

Let me know your thoughts :].


(mkint) #2

Take a look at the MER. I think some of your assumptions aren’t holding true to what’s actually happening there. Incursion isk represents almost nothing on the big scale.

I do agree with you, the MER indicates something needs to be fixed with bounties. The game is on a clear route to economic collapse.


(Makshima Shogo) #3

Yea, I’m only talking from experience where would I find the MER? It will help clarify things a bit thanks.


(mkint) #4

Dev posts button on the forum here. There was one released really recently.
edit: relevant graph


Incursions represent less than 10% of isk faucets.


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(Makshima Shogo) #5

Sure but that’s quantity, If it had to be separated by amount per person and sec status it would be very different i’m guessing. But I understand what you mean, inflation is coming from bounties in general.


(mkint) #6

From an economic point of view, it doesn’t really matter who brought the isk into the economy, just that it’s in the economy. There was another history graph that showed the problem growth is already in the bounties:


Incursions are around their median point, bounties are near an all time high.

You’re right, there isn’t official data saying isk per person, but I’m not sure that’s a problem. It’s not unfair to anyone because they are available to everyone. It’s not even fair to say there is a risk problem considering most income generating activities are already done at near zero risk regardless where they happen.


(Makshima Shogo) #7

Yea you are right, I guess once you have been doing something long enough the risk gets lower and lower but its still there to some degree more so when it’s in a pvp environment.

Hmm it’s quite a difficult situation actually seeing this, I wonder if using sec status in general to effect bounties/lp would be the way to go.

This type of setup will lower inflation from bounties while balancing out risk/reward abit more and make it so high sec mission runners don’t loose isk/hour if they adapt and move to the 0.5 area’s but it will be more temping to take more risk’s, could be interesting as it will provide more of a progression making it fun to work your way up.

These effects would be limited to Missions(level 4 only level 1-3 will remain as is) as well as Belt Rats and Scan-able complex’s(DED and Unrated). Anomalies would have to stay the same as they are now so that ratting carriers don’t become overpowered for income purposes, another option thou is to restrict carriers from entering before upping the bounties. Gating the anom’s would not be a viable solution as it would only increase safety, which null sec should not be known for lol.

1.0 -50% bounties + 1x Current Lp
0.9 -40% bounties + 1.2x Current Lp
0.8 -30% Bounties + 1.4x Current Lp
0.7 -20% Bounties + 1.6x Current Lp
0.6 - 10 % Bounties + 1.8x Current Lp
0.5 Same as current Bounties + 2x Current Lp
0.4 +10% Bounties + 2x Current Lp
0.3 +20% Bounties + 2x Current LP
0.2 +30% Bounties + 2x Current Lp
0.1 +40% bounties + 2x Current Lp
0.0 +50% bounties + 2x Current Lp
-0.1 +60% bounties + 2x Current Lp
-0.2 +70% bounties + 2x Current Lp
-0.3 +80% bounties + 2x Current Lp
-0.4 +90% bounties + 2x Current Lp
-0.5 +100% bounties + 2x Current Lp
-0.6 +110% bounties + 2x Current Lp
-0.7 +120% bounties + 2x Current Lp
-0.8 +130% bounties + 2x Current Lp
-0.9 +140% bounties + 2x Current Lp
-1.0 +150% bounties + 2x Current Lp

Caping Lp improvement so that it doesn’t make Faction ships too much cheaper in general Expecially from null sec npc farmers but at the same time LP is really good at stopping inflation since it has a way of leveling itself out.


(DeMichael Crimson) #8

In all my years of playing I can’t recall Rat Bounties ever being increased, same with mission pay. So I would agree they definitely need to be increased.

However, nerfing high sec is not the answer. The problem with your idea about reducing Rat Bounties in high sec is it places undue hardship on newer players who are already handicapped by having to use low level equipment due to low skill levels.

In my opinion Rat Bounties for each specific hull class should remain universal, no matter which system security level they spawn in.


(Makshima Shogo) #9

Yea I agree but that’s why I shifted the income off of bounties and onto LP, maybe something better than LP can be used to give new players some type of good income that promote’s them to keep taking on more challenges.

Maybe a Counter will be that the lower pay in high sec status is only applied to level 3 and 4 missions, where level 1 and 2 are untouched.


(Eternus8lux8lucis) #10

Why not an RNG random distribution that cant be gamed for all areas and regions? Bounties go up or down daily and never stay the same. If you want to farm one system or agent or whatever you might see some swings in income, or youd need to follow the fools gold rushes around.

But other than that I dont want bounties to go up but be replaced by tags or some other such devices.


(Makshima Shogo) #11

Tag’s are another option yea, as long as high quality tags are exclusive to very dangerous area’s and such and less to less dangerous area’s.


(Karl Poljus) #12

Well, then we should just change the payouts on battleships only. New players will be just fine on lvl3 missions and it will hurt those who abuse high sec safety to earn trillions. I don’t think that allowing activities which net more than 50-300kk per hour in high sec benefits newer players at all, so it would be only logical to remove them.


(mkint) #13

Rebuttal:


The most productive highsec region isn’t even in the top 30. Which compared to population numbers, is absolutely ridiculous.


(Makshima Shogo) #14

HAHA ok nvm… I guess bounties in general need to go down even more :confused: sigh damn goons killing our isk. But as a counter arguement how much of that is becuase of anom’s and carriers? how much of that is belt ratting and how much of that is anoms with vexor navies. Sigh I still feel I can make more in high sec doing incursions than I can in null doing normal stuff :confused: its not making sense to me atm, maybe people have like 10 alt’s afk ratting anom’s or something.

Incursions in high: 140 - 200mil/hour (Low Risk, Maybe some suicide gankers to worry about)
Ded’s in null 20/100mil an hour (High risk, lots of time spent scanning and scouting)
Relics in null avg about 80mil an hour (Med risk, Less isk/hour if you are killed by cloakies)
Low Sec Ded’s 5/60mil an hour
Belt Ratting 8-12mil ticks (15min) x 4 = 32/48mil/hour
Mining in high sec 10mil an hour (Miners are getting shafted hard)
Mining in null sec 20mil an hour (Miners are still getting shafted hard lol)
Mining on moons in nullsec 100mil an hour (Not getting shafted so much if they own good moons)
High Sec mission running 20-25mil an hour

Risk / Reward’s don’t seem very balanced xD


(DeMichael Crimson) #15

Null sec already has large amounts of high bounty rats as well as all types of exploration sites, high profit Ore belts, moon goo, etc, the list goes on. Same for w-holes.

Low sec has mid lv Ore belts and exploration sites along with lv 5 missions and FW.

High sec is the lowest paid sector with the least amount of high profitable ventures available. Like I said before, nerfing high sec is not the answer.

Now about the question of why players aren’t going to low, null and w-hole space, just ask yourself why do most players stay in high sec? There’s only one answer and that’s CONCORD.


(JUSTIFIED ARROGANCE) #16

Since CCP seems to never update straight payouts they need to just get rid of straight payouts and put LP in their place.


(DeMichael Crimson) #17

Some players don’t care about LP’s.


(JUSTIFIED ARROGANCE) #18

I dont care.


(Teckos Pech) #19

Why do you say that? If the real economy is growing at say 3%/period and the money supply growing at 3%/pereiod then there is no inflation. After 24 “periods” both the real economy and the money supply will have doubled.

The supply of ISK increasing does not imply inflation by itself.

Note also that looking at the graph @mkint has posted the money supply actually shrank in January 2018.

CCP also posts price indices which can be used as a measure of inflation.

The blue line is the CPI which is probably the best measure of the purchasing power of your ISK. It has been pretty flat since 2008–i.e. about 9 years.


(Ramona McCandless) #20

They might if the LP point rewards and/or what you buy with them were more useful or cheaper.

If a CNC was more accessible than the overfarmed pirate hulls, wouldnt that make sense?