Can we define “meaningful”

(Nora Maldoran) #15

3 Likes
(Ms Steak) #16

*existence :smirk_cat:

3 Likes
(Nora Maldoran) #17

Argh!!!11 :facepalm::sweat_smile:

1 Like
(Solstice Projekt) #18

You did it TWICE! D:

(Ghost O'Mo) #19

Perhaps the word “inconsequential” would be better suited to doing those activities that nobody cares whether you do?

I think in an MMO, I can make that differentiation between those things you do which matter to other players and those things you do which do not.

I’m not saying that you guys don’t enjoy shooing rocks or running level 4 missions. Or ratting.

I’m saying, somewhat generally, that nobody cares if you do them.

For the “multiplayer” aspect to have the depth Eve needs to survive, I think players need to care about the actions of players… and that comes from:

  1. working against each other in a “meaningful” way.
  2. working together in a “meaningful” way.

If we don’t have meaningful obstacles, we will not work together in meaningful manners to overcome them.

It’s an MMO. Let’s make people matter in it. Good, bad, or indifferent.

2 Likes
(Solstice Projekt) #20

This, too, is meaningful.

In a shallow perspective, all it’s being is some random guy travelling through space, but when looking at the bigger picture, it’s meaningful for us as a whole.

(Traco Miritu) #21

The “comfort zone” is the only zone that counts…

All that is outside of it is called stress and there is enough stress in todays work so why should someone want that in a game?

A game has to be chilled and easy,anybody who wants difficulty aka MORE stress and call this “fun” has a serious problem that needs to be checked by a specialist in my eyes. :slight_smile:

Stress can be addictive and this is not healthy :slight_smile:

(Solstice Projekt) #22

The series has a reputation for being extremely difficult . And while that’s definitely true, terse quips about how unfair these games can be undersells the beauty of the series. Dark Souls is hard , yes, but the series’ creator Hidetaka Miyazaki says it’s not hard for its own sake.

Wrong, Balos.
As usual.

The reason why you want it chilled and easy is because you’re a loser. You want that, and for some disturbing reason live in the delusion that everyone wants it as well, which causes you to be intolerant of anything else.

(Traco Miritu) #23

ONE example proves anything for you?

Wow how stupid…

What exactly came after dark souls?

Right…nothing…

And this is why YOU are wrong to the core…you do not know what is wanted in todays games…and you prove it with any new post…

(Solstice Projekt) #24

You assuming that there is only a single game out there, that isn’t “chilled and easy” is ludicrous. You should be ashamed of yourself, either for living in such a tiny box, or for deliberately pretending there are no other games out there, which are not “easy and chill”.

You proclaim games have to be chilled and easy, as if everyone thought exactly like you.
Do you know what kind of people think like this?

I show evidence that there are games that are in no way or form chill, or easy.
Your claim is therefore proven wrong.

This is part of the “scientific method”, you uneducated fool.

Are you also denying the whole horror genre exists, because you think that what you want is what everyone wants? You would likely abolish it, right? Do you deny Real Time Strategy games exist? They’re absolutely not chill and easy either.

You’d rather abolish them, right?

(Traco Miritu) #25

ridiciouless…

Sometimes you remind me of Brick Heck of the middle…seemingly so intelligent but obviously so helpless…

You live in your reality and refuse to admit that your sight on it is not valid…

(Solstice Projekt) #26

Well, you’ve given me enough.

Thanks!

(Charley Varrick) #27

Meaningful all depends on the user. What’s meaningful to one is meaningless to someone else. I’m one of those who like to mine to unwind. To me that is meaningful. To others, their game is only meaningful if they blow my stuff up. I couldn’t give 2 shits about kill boards. To others that is all they care about.

Who is right? In the end, it’s a video game…no one is right. It’s all meaningless.

1 Like
(Nora Maldoran) #28

For the record: There is an entire genre called “souls like” games.

1 Like
(Mevatla Vekraspek) #29

You despise people that are imposing their “playstyle” onto others… and you do the same. Hypocrite.

1 Like
(Kezrai Charzai) #30

I agree with the OP that pushing beyond the comfort zone, and being challenged into upping your game as a result, is far more meaningful than simply doing the same easy routine over and over because you get some decent reward from it without much risk.

Meaningful interaction is interaction that causes (to some extent, forces) you to engage with the game at a higher level of attention and focus.

That said, there is a reason people stay in their comfort zone. Your own experience was, “hey we’re in our comfort zone, bit of a rut, boom along comes the big bad wolf and shows us what large teeth he has. We had to scramble, react, respond, change up, adapt, defuse the situation or risk losing what we had built. We did that, and it was meaningful.”

Now suppose that ‘meaningful’ interaction came along every week. Or every 3 days. Do you want to be in a constant state of ‘meaningful’ interaction? Do you want to be always scrambling at the edge of an abyss, trying to grapple your way back to stable ground?

EVE definitely needs to encourage this sort of meaningful activity. However there have to be periods of calm between the storms also. I think essentially CCP has set up their sandbox and left ‘meaning’ to the players to create, and I don’t think that’s quite enough.

2 Likes
(Ghost O'Mo) #31

I agree… if we define meaningful as those severe beatings that change how you operate. You don’t want that every day and cannot handle it daily.

My words are only as applicable as the state of the game against which I shoot them.

I think today’s game is largely devoid of meaning.

But the threat of negative experiences of substantial severity leads to other interactions which aren’t necessarily terse or painful.

They can be very good… and fun… and not stressful.

My argument that mindless and relaxing isn’t meaningful (unless imbued with meaning by something else) stands. I’m not saying that they’re bad to do… but that interaction with real people is what makes them meaningful.

I fear we have nerfed meaning out of the highsec with our quest for safetys

1 Like
(Jonah Gravenstein) #32

Tell me about it, there’s barely any player based challenges left in hisec for most people with recent changes, the only danger to people without a structure are mission invaders and suicide gankers; both of which rely on someone being a mug and the latter are hilariously easy to avoid, and they’re bitching about that.

I’m beginning to wonder how welcoming null is for an independent entrepreneur, and wishing I had more time available to me to try it out.

1 Like
(Elena Laskova) #33

Excluding griefers (real world definition), what does it cost PvPers if it becomes easier for players to avoid being attacked while in highSec?

They have all the rest of EVE to hunt for targets (if they’re PvPers) or victims.

(Jonah Gravenstein) #34

How much fecking easier do you want it?

Wardecs have just had their teeth and claws pulled, unless you have a structure.

Suicide ganking is easily avoided, by simply not doing stupid shite.
Mission baiters are easily avoided, by simply not doing stupid shite.
Suspect baiters are easily avoided, by not doing stupid shite.

The not so obvious forms of PvP in terms of competition between players not so much.

3 Likes