Nope wrong. The way to learn is to take the free ships and do novice plexes.
Waiting for more expensive ships or more skills is the number one way to fail at EVE PvP.
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…but we agree? I never made any mention of waiting for expensive ships or skills. I said to take cheap basic frigates into fights and learn by losing. Same as you! I just pointed out it can be difficult to afford these losses as a new player.
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Novice plexes are usually full of people blitzing them in in billion-ISK ships.
Most Rookies are starved of ISK.
It doesn’t help that if you ask someone how much you can make at different activities they always give you their best day ever + 25% and then claim it’s the average /sigh.
Golly gee whiz, how has anybody ever figured out how to do things in this game?
well you’ve got 15 more friends than me, so good job.
Vets cannot relive the rookie experience. They know too much, and they have “insurance” against bad luck in the form of a huge pile of ISK on other character(s).
It’s not about “reliving” anything, friend elana, it’s simply that every one of the “bittervets” you despise so much started the same way and figured it out.
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This would need to be a required fittings only thing, or you would have that one asshat farming newbies in a blinged out corvette for keks and/or killboard padding. Also if it was a thing it would need to be entirely optional and easily ignored if one is not so inclined. Believe it or not there are people who do not want to pvp until they have set themselves up for it properly first, forcing that crowd to do so against their will may only leave a bad taste in their mouth that would be less than helpful for player retention. Why are nullbears trying to force newbies to pvp?
Are you suggesting that they will ever win against someone else in likely poorly fit newbie ships? It’s still failing at eve pvp even if they do it in a free hull.
This is one of the more interesting formulations of “victim blaming”, but it’s still irrational.
It doesn’t matter that gamers ten or fifteen years ago were prepared to spend a lot more time and effort getting started with games. It’s 2019, and things have changed (except in the minds of EVE bittervets of course).
Though EVE has got objectively worse too I think. Competition for everything except low-level mining is a lot tougher, but only low-level mining (among the normal set of rookie-practical sources of income) has increased rewards (not keeping pace with inflation, but at least prices are a little higher.
Or has there been a review of the rewards from L1 and L2 missions? IIRC I asked a while back and I think I learned they’re still a waste of time for ISK, with the first reasonable income coming when you can blitz L3’s (which requires quite expensive ships if you’re mining Veldspar in tiny ships.
Rookies should be given twenty combat-fitted “untradable” ships with a timer on them (self-destruct in at the end of a month (maybe less) and some assistance in finding people with similar gear to practice with. Only EVE Uni (and maybe RvsB) do this, and they are affected by the trust problem.
Instead they get to start with 20+ hours of grinding first - and learn nothing about combat in the process.
The bittervets should have been working on CCP the last ten years to fix this, instead of blaming the bored gamers who move on to something that’s fun to learn.
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That’s not EvE and shouldn’t ever be part of it. Also, we need less instanced space not more.
For all the reasons above, this is a terrible idea. Eve is a sandbox, if new players can’t wrap their heads around it then they shouldn’t be playing.
“victim blaming”, eh? Well, if you or anyone else chooses to feel themselves a victim, then that is you/their problem.
What you think is irrational is the idea that players are not stupid and can figure things out? That reveals a lot about you.
You are not just not thinking outside the box when it comes to beginning EvE and assuming new players will not either, you deny the very possibility of there even being anything outside the flat and limited box of your own making. Then you excuse your self-imposed and projected-onto-new-players hobblings with a false veneer of “it’s 2019 now”.
Oh, you are very very wrong about that.
It just shows - as many of your posts have - that you don’t know much about the game you like telling others how should be.
Trust problem?
First - Having been part of RvB (yes *gasp! back in the day) there was no trust problem at all. I have only ever heard good things about E-uni. As for any other group, some recruitment scams happen sometimes, yes, but many “recruitment scams” are really just ways to weed out the knuckleheads, suckers, dramaqueens, and habitual malcontents, etc.
Secondly - A genuine new player wouldn’t have much to lose, regardless, and even if they did lose something or indeed anything it is a test by the nature of the game.
You and sadly more others want to see such fundamental aspects of EvE change…and tragically perhaps they will… One wonders if such players would then stick with what EvE had become for them or just flit off to the next shiny that grabs their fleeting attention.
As I have played EvE more than a month, I apologise to you in advance for saying it is my intention to stay onboard EvE and see what happens. Eventually the RSPCA will re-home the server hamsters, but it will have been a great ride.
@Elena_Laskova - You know all the answers for anything about Eve…will you consider please to run for CSM? Although at one time I thought you must be a troll, I have seen the light and promise to vote for you if you please stand for CSM.
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Xuxe Xu
If you’re determined that EVE cannot and should not be improved, I don’t really understand why you post in these topics. Nor do I see why we keep seeing the argument “Since EVE is perfect, the people who makes suggestions are the problem”.
Both sentiments are best supported by silence.
If new players could distinguish between slavers and honest Corps, no doubt they would find people willing to help them. But the nice people in EVE are obscured by the rest. EVE is a nice game once you get going but it’s ridiculously (and unnecessarily) difficult to get started.
Vets need to accept that EVE doesn’t “selects” for people who are elite gamers. It selects for people with and exceptionally high tolerance for boredom. Which wouldn’t necessarily be a bad thing for those players, but it keeps EVE small - and yet it could be so easily improved - as the OP demonstrates.
“Victim blaming” is one of its favourite expressions, others are “stalker” and “bittervet narrative”.
You earned “stalker” by your actions. Now that you’ve stopped, it’s off the list again.
This argument “EVE is perfect - it’s the players fault that they suggest improvements or leave” is obviously crazy. Even back when it was invented (while EVE was growing) it was crazy, but after ten or fifteen years you’d think people would have figured it out.
“Bittervet narrative” because I remember all of this stuff from my first visits to EVE (about eleven years ago I think). It’s quite strange: the people change, but the words do not.
- If they die they still learn, they learn to die and get up, not die and cry. “gf and get a new ship”
- They won’t win at first unless by dumb luck they meet another newbie. They may be kited, they may not target or fire, they may attack the wrong target like a nearby NPC. They may not even have all their slots filled. Once they can loose without weeping (#1) they can examine what happed and learn.
- Getting killed is not failing at EVE, not getting up and fighting again is.
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It certainly can, should and in many respects has been
The problem is that what you think are “improvements” are very much mostly not. It’s that simple.
Yes…that much is glaringly obvious…
Oh, it is quite apparent you don’t like people saying anything that might damage your obvious ego and/or contradict your…thoughts. However, you don’t control others posting, regardless of any labels you give to anyone, ever so sorry.
A small amount of research would go a long way. Just reading the information stickied in the New Citizen’s Q&A section of the EvE forums would help. Try it: How to find the corp that is right for you
You didn’t address your running for CSM 
EvE would benefit so much from your far-reaching wisdom. I sure hope you do. Please?
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Have you read that thing? It’s a book. But it is indeed necessary for today’s EVE. The “startup threshold” for everything is way too high in EVE. Social interaction, including Corps are probably a harder problem than getting started with PvP though. OTOH …
… out in the rest of the gaming world, beginners are invited to Corps by people they meet as a result of doing something together in-game. I think OP’s suggestion would help with this.
I’m not interested in the rest of your post.
When someone like OP makes a suggestion with obvious potential, vets should use their knowledge and experience to try to improve it, or stay away. It’s up to CCP to decide whether they think an idea has a place in their game.
Yeah…wouldn’t want to read anything…
That info always has been important to know…that’s why it was stickied when that particular guide was written.
I’d still gladly vote for you for CSM. Won’t you run? Please?