Need advice on ships for level 4 missions with specific preferences

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#21

And my point is that it is not enough to say it is “as good as”. Because precisely if it was not kinetic locked vs angels it would not lose 15% of its DPS.

In effect the thermal/kinetic lock can’t be ignored as it can reduce its damage by 15% for some rats.

I’d rather do 150 EM.

The RS has 5 missiles, +50% bonus do DPS the/kin so 7.5 ELaunchers . against angel for example it loses 15% DPS so 6.3 Elaunchers. On sanshas you lose 17+% of your DPS by going thermal instead of EM so effective 6.2 launchers.

The typhoon has 6 launchers, -25% rof so effective 8 launchers - against any target. Against sanshas that’s +30% DPS ; against gugu/serp it’s +5% DPS.

And don’t forget the application bonus of the phoon. Or the range bonus of the raven.
And since we compare to pirat ship you can as well look at navy versions : navy phoon has 8.25 ELaunchers, RNI has 8 launchers (but its application bonus makes it a +33% damage against small targets - that is BC and below, or BS and below if you fit fury - so 10.7 Elaunchers so +72% DPS vs sansha compared to RS (in fury or vs BC- ships).

So no, the RS is not a great missile boat. It’s a great missile+drones boat. It has 7.5 Edrones (heavy or sentry) and that’s what saves it.

#22

I didn’t say the rattlesnake is “a great missile boat even without the drones”.
I said “The rattlesnake is also as good as any other missile boat despite it’s missiles being thermal and kinetic restricted” meaning it can still operate desireably even despite the lock.

I’m not comparing it against a dedicated missile boat that can hit the resist gap flawlessly cause that’s the last thing a rattlesnake is, especially given the application bonus of the phoon. I’m comparing it to itself in a less desirable matchup.

Example (all skills 5):
With just missiles, a rattlesnake vs a Centum Loyal Hellhound deals a pitiful 127 DPS with EM against 72% resist, but 190 DPS (or as you put it, after “losing 15% dps”) with Thermal against 79%, both times using precision cruise. A typhon outperforms it with EM, hitting 210 DPS with faction cruise and 203 with precision cause of it’s application bonus.

I can with confidence say that you get the same relative performance by shooting kinetic into angels. As for the rest, besides Blood Raiders, no other rat seems to have an EM or Exposive primary gap.

This is also not accounting for drones. My only point is, and has been, that the rattle can operate desireably in any faction’s space. Also it has an absolute monster of a passive tank, being able to derp through mordu headhunters and the last room of angel extravaganza, which is yet another reason for OP to pick it.

EDIT: The rattle needs a web to apply full possible DPS against that target cause it’s so dang small, losing performace beyond 100m/s. Precision phoon applies the damage perfectly thanks to it’s bonus but I feel that’s an issue with pirate ships in general, i.e. that despite having desireable role bonuses they usually lack crucial stats. Both the rattle and the domi have 7.5 drones but the domi also gets a tracking bonus, that kinda stuff.

#23

Then don’t say it’s as good as when it is not.

This and that are two different things.
The RS is a bad missile ship, but its bonus to drones can make up the lowest missile efficiency. Being kin/thermal locked makes it worse in many cases. If it was not locked, then it would be a correct missile ship with 7.5 ELaunchers like the Nscorpion has 8 (and therefore makes it a subpar missile boat) or same number as the praxis.
Saying that rats having thermal or kinetic as second resist does not make it less of an issue. It’s still worse in terms of missile boat than other missile boats, because it is thermal/kinetic locked.

#24

Alright, that’s fair. How much DPS can a typhoon, dominix, and rattle squeeze out on a capstable or passive tank in a sansha mission, with drones and missiles combined?

Cause right now when I pull out an old, capstable rattle, I get 974,1 tooltip DPS at 81km.

#25

I am sure Anderson will give you firm numbers, but my cap stable RS gives me 1450+dps at 64 km.
It does use C3-Xs, I’ll keep the rest secret.
So, it appears that some skills are being missed; you should be above 1100dps for easiest level 4 missioning.

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#26

Those are usually bad fits.

Also 1400 paper DPS is not 1400 effective DPS. plus the range is useles when your drones need to move.

looking at raw DPS is bad. The navy raven should have less than your rattle, still have more effective DPs if you factor in drones moving and application - for a similar price.

Anyhow this is unrelated. I’m not saying paper DPS is lower. I’m saying, as a missile boat it’s worse than the others. It can be a good mission ship, but if you only look at paper DPS you will miss a lot.

Imgur

name/cost/ehps
rattle 2b6 270
Nphoon 1b8 324

both with cruise (thermal for rattle, em for phoon) and curators II. Plus two painters for phoon and painter+omni for rattle. target is sansha BC.

#27

If you wanted to blitz, the typhoon fleet is the best in its current state

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