Regarding Senator Bellaron's Proposal

(Jev North) #80

Can all citizens of the Federation actually run in one of these things, too?

Realistically, I think it helps to have a shipyard conglomerate.

How free are you if everything you get to choose between is already picked out for you?

(Rinai Vero) #81

More free than the guy who gets no choice on either matter, anyway. Your point would be more valid if there wasn’t such ample evidence of diversity among the backgrounds of Federation candidates for elected office. Hell, Souro Foiritan was just a grad student who enjoyed student government when he started his political career.

(Jev North) #82

You think someone is born a Megacorp CEO?

(Aria Jenneth) #83

Uh … actually, kinda, yes, Jev. If you’d picked any other position, including the board, I’d have said no, but the “Chief Executive” caste is made up pretty much exclusively of the descendants of great heroes and historical figures of one kind and another.

It’s the one segment of society the child of a laborer has basically no hope of attaining, whatever their gifts, at least without becoming a “great hero” themselves.

(Tressith Sefira) #84

Would it be possible for people to start a separate “The Federation is the worst” thread? Aedre intended this thread to discuss a specific piece of legislation in the Senate. Thanks.

(Veikitamo Gesakaarin) #85

Yet, as regards currently sitting CEO, neither Hataakan Oiritsuu nor Mens Reppola came from Executive families.

The only places where entrenched family dynasties exist are in Wiyrkomi and Hyasyoda, and that’s a function of their corporate cultures.

Off-Topic Thread
(Aria Jenneth) #86

I didn’t say family dynasties, Fake Veik. I said that you can’t get elevated to the Chief Executive caste by normal means. There’s a bit of a difference.

(Veikitamo Gesakaarin) #87

Chief Executives are appointed by the shareholders, which is the regular means to do so.

(Aria Jenneth) #88

There’s a caste, Veik. As with so much else in Caldari society. And you know as well as I, neither we nor anyone we’re likely to know was ever going to be invited to that particular tier. How the Ishukone leadership arrived at its station is one of those mysteries.

The State might be more meritocratic than other societies. But it has its celebrities-- I’d even say nobles, still. Who better to figurehead a major State entity than someone who traces their line to K’vire or Tovil-Toba.

Pedigree has a merit all its own. And you know it.

(Veikitamo Gesakaarin) #89

Resting on the laurels of past success has never spared any Executive their failures of management. Even former CEO Heth with his liberation of the Homeworld could not survive once his mismanagement of Kaalakiota was made known.

The reason why a corporate Executive in the State is afforded respect is not because of their pedigree or caste, it’s their ability to survive in one of the harshest political arenas.

I sure would not trust to be lead by anyone without the strength of will and ruthlessness required to rise to power as a CEO of a Caldari Mega.

(Aria Jenneth) #90

Gods and spirits …

Heth wasn’t an “even.” Heth wasn’t from a great family to start with. Heth was a temporary aberration the great families definitely relished getting rid of-- and who made it super-easy for them by balancing his re-taking of Home with half-losing it again after ordering it doomsdayed and forcing the admiral who heroically refused that order to take tea. (Now there is a foundation for a great family, if Admiral Yanala has kin.)

As for who you’d trust to lead, Veik, nobody asked you. Or me.

The world is as it is. Accept it or come out as jaalan, I really don’t care.

(Veikitamo Gesakaarin) #91

Personally, I trust CEO Oiritsuu and the Sobaseki Family to lead Kaalakiota, as they always have.

(Jason Galente) #92

You know, I agreed with you at first, but I don’t like people who double down on vehemently calling other people hypocrites for the status of their country failing to live up to its ideals, when, to my understanding and experience with the State, it has quite a lot of its own hypocrisies of the present. The State talks about prosperity, markets, and the rising tide lifting all boats, yet when I spent years there, I saw slum after slum after slum. Men working 16 hour days operating incredibly risky machinery, losing limbs, only to be tossed aside rather than offered pensions and medical care when they could no longer work because they were crippled.

Granted, this varies planet by planet and corporation by corporation, but one thing I can give the Federation credit for: there, these sorts of things are the exception, not the norm. While I can admire many things about the State, workplace safety, freedom to choose employer, and freedom to lobby for better working conditions and living standards leave much to be desired.

And I believe that makes you… right, a hypocrite. If you’re going to double down at throwing stones for ‘hypocrisy’, make sure your own house is secure.

(Veikitamo Gesakaarin) #93

For all that, did I say anyone outside the State should adopt the State system, however?

(Jason Galente) #94

No, but the various hostile takeovers by State corporations imply that it’s not much of a choice anyway, whether warning is given or not.

(Veikitamo Gesakaarin) #95

Then that’s beside the point, because as far as I’m aware I’m not the one railing against that which exists in my own court now am I?

(Jason Galente) #96

From my point of view, both the Federation and the State are irredeemably corrupt and hypocritical. The Federation is doing what you’re saying, and the State has its own form of hypocrisy: it pretends it is not engaging in the same thing the Federation does, just through trade instead of moral crusades. And for all the talk of the State about the vanity and degeneracy of the Federation, corporate executives are infamous about living lifestyles of such power and decadence and vanity that they make the Gallente look like abstemious Amarrian church boys. This reached a notorious peak before Heth cracked down on it, but wouldn’t you know, it’s back with a vengeance. The only noteworthy exceptions to this rule of vast hypocrisy amongst the corporate elite of the State regarding their own lifestyles would be Otro Gariushi, and, like it or not, Tibus Heth, albeit perhaps only with regards to the luxury and not with regards to the thirst for power.

(Veikitamo Gesakaarin) #97

No, the State just cut out the democratic middle man as inefficient and ineffective in recognizing the power of corporate institutions to enable cultural, political, and defense realities in the interests of the Caldari people.

Off-Topic Thread
(Charles Cambridge Schmidt) #98

I wonder why we don’t see as many threads about the Federation on the IGS. Makes you think, y’know?

(James Syagrius) #99

Well, from the look of things I would say that is a no my dear.

I am always amazed at how many things Caldari are the ‘sole’ experts on.