Skill Queue Removal

Is it really the case that so few people enjoy adapting and overcoming adversity?

Seems a shame really.

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I have done a lot of reading on EVE and CCP/PA. I have the time, I’m bed-ridden half the week and the rest of my time I spend with my grandma. I read, that’s about all I do besides playing games, taking care of granny and posting nonsense on forums.
Articles after articles, EVEwiki fandom, EVE University, lore pages… I saw depths and intricacies in EVE that other games don’t have, fresh science fiction, incredible art… the universe that was created there is astounding. Of course I want to play this game.
I came into it as a discoverer, to understand it on lore and conceptual levels as a work of passion between the creators of EVE. The time they spent spinning all those stories between the factions and pirates and all the rest I haven’t even yet discovered is worth something to me. Just like the creative dynamics that exists between the artists in Hollywood to produce and make 1 hour 40 minutes worth of Kodak film that bring in billions of dollars every year. EVE is currently at 60 million dollars a year give or take. Yet what supports entertainment industries is Talent and Imagination. I read that several of the creators have left the company. How much of that talent and imagination went with them?
CCP keeps coming out with updates to try and keep the players interested all while doing a balancing act between entertainment and its economics, tinkering with something here, pulling a lever there all year long with changes from graphics to mechanics in an effort to launch it into the next 20 years. How many players can they afford to lose is a question I bet they asked themselves.
I fly a Catalyst. That’s about all I fly most of the time in the game. I call my ship CatAstrophe. It’s off-centered and looks like a shark flying sideways but it goes fast and has 8 high slots. I’m training all my skills on it and hope to train the Omega-skill-only once I am satisfied with my Alpha demo. I would really hate CCP if they decided to nerf anything on the Catalyst.
I do fly a couple of Gallente battlecruisers but I reserve those for fights once I join a corporation and know more about strategy. I’m not at that point yet.
I am at the point to find out what CCP plans to do with this incredible game. What road are they going to take it down, what decisions will they take and what will impact me as an explorer of the work of art that is EVE.
That is the reason why I posted the thread. I don’t want to hang here for 5 years and find out that I hate what CCP has done with the game. They keep most of their development decisions inhouse and while I understand the reasons behind it, it doesn’t give me much to work with. Fanfest isn’t a road map and questions are treated as “rumors”.
I’m left with a lot of questions that aren’t very condutive to make a commitment on the game while at the same time, all I have seen is great. I have very little complaints… not nearly as many as I would have should they dare touch the Catalyst :sweat_smile:

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It wouldn’t surprise me if they replace skill queues with skill point packs you purchase.

There’s more to be apprehensive about than the “disappearance of the training queue” - while still “accumulating skill points passively over time (46:50)” that can be applied to skills and skill plans - so, minus the convenience and more clicking perhaps ?

Apparently the attribute system is too complicated, or so he says, because few people “know the training equation” - which is simply: (attrib1) + (attrib2)/2 = SP/min for an omega, by the way. The same goes for what used to be the skill rank (now training multiplier) - which according to the dev was never clarified as to how and why. Here’s a hint: impact on the game (hulls, supporting skills, tactics and even strategy), higher rank usually means better force multiplier.

Revamping that whole 2 decade old core system of EvE character building into something that - at least for the dev - needs to be simpler, will benefit simple players (those who don’t do research, or refuse to read). It is more than a few levels of dumbing down in one fell blow. The SP system as it currently stands teaches the importance of making thoughtful choices in the game.

If skill ranks and attributes are changed as implied by the dev, and in EvE skill changes work retroactively, that basically would entail your characters virtually being stripped of old SP and skill levels, to be built up again with a big pile of new SP. If the value of SP is no longer the same - and SP is real cash, as we pay sub for time which is used for training during the sub period, governed via the attributes! which affect training time directly - it is hard to imagine that we come out breaking even. That would simply mean it’s a sleight of hand.

Because it isn’t likely that any communication will be made unless days before launch, I suggest:

  1. take screenshots of your current skills and keep them up to date, so you know exactly what could be taken away and replaced with ersatz SP.
  2. be aware of what you can do and use today. Not all changes have happened in the spirit of “you’ll be able to do the same things from before the change”. I know for a fact I could not run reactions anymore after I came back, as an example.
  3. beg our CSM representatives to monitor this as closely as they can, and fight hand, tooth and nail against a devaluation of SP (your invested real money and time), taking away choices, dumbing down the game, and whatever else that comes with it. I know that at least one of them is following this like an eagle (perhaps it will be a moa after the revamp, lol). Keep the fighting spirit of the CSM alive, support them, as they are literally our only chance to prevent catastrophies without “winning EvE”.

Which brings me to my questions: what is it that CCP thinks seeing that makes “dumbing down making the game more accessable” so important in most of their current design approaches, what perceived problem is it they are trying to tackle ?

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“not all change is good”

Fresh sci fi? If you like static ould balls maybe

What do you mean ?

One of the posters above claimed the lore was fresh scifi.

Its far past its sell by date.

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I’ve seen many questions come and go within forums and NEVER get a real answer.
Those questions are based on interpretations from segmented info derived from any branch of EVE’s organization.
I’ve had troubles understanding how ISD tally a rumor for the case, when it is the organization itself who’s not crystal about things to come… because, for me… when someone posts about the inner clockwork regarding the game finances, what’s there for an ISD to do?

So, my conclusion is… there is only a post block when the ISD knows for fact that it is not true. But when it is speculative, then it’s ok to go because of the prior condition. Just an example.

The skill queue disappeared long ago for me. I have zero interest on the queue… I merely seek for whatever new thing I must learn to go with the flow… sometimes the flow is so against my game, that I don’t even bother and go train laser curving or whatever stupid unnecessary skill I will never use.

So, be it.

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Sorry, I used slang. “fresh” meaning stylized, awesome, rad, phat, cool, far out… lol.
I am aware that a lot of the art and lore date back 20 years.

Opinions may differ

But yeah, it reeks of old cheese and laziness in that way of using it too.

I respect your point. If I wanted to be critical I’m sure I can find a long list of things that suck with EVE, easy. I preferred to reply to Altara_Zemara by pointing to something CCP may change that I would not appreciate, just like when they changed the Procurer on her just when she was getting used to it and spent bunch of skill points on it.
Anyone can criticize, that’s easy. I can do it all day.

Cool, Im glad to see we can both respect each others views ^^

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Perhaps one should also ask whether a micromanaged sandbox is even a sandbox. Micromanagement and creativity simply don’t go hand in hand.

I have one called Schrodinger’s Catalyst.

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Hello wolves,
@CCP_Swift ,

It’s Google Translate’s AI talking to you!
(Yes @Ursula_Anders , I read absolutely everything, but I don’t systematically intervene in order to let the other members of the community speak; you, the wolves, you should do the same!)

More seriously, I am surprised that this debate can land on the forum only 2 months and a half after the broadcast of the Fanfest 2022 video. Personally, I am impatiently awaiting the realization of these announcements which make sense to me; I specify that this takes absolutely nothing away from the emergencies that I mentioned elsewhere, the categorization of players according to their style of play on separate servers (MM-RPG-RTS on one side vs. PLEXs + injectors on the other ) in my opinion, to remain a priority within CCP.

But back to the subject that interests us here; what were these actually big announcements from Fanfest 2022:

1- all skills rebalanced.

2- characters attributes removed.

3- learning implants revamped.

4- skill training replaced with free skill points accumulation over time.

Since 2003, the question of the progression of our characters has always arisen, so this does not only concern new players, but all players. In addition, the way CCP has heckled skills over the years has done absolutely nothing to help the negative feelings experienced by players, update after update. The developer on the Fanfest 2022 video talks about complicated things. But that’s not really how I would express things if I were in their place.

For me, by constantly wanting to keep control of the mechanics of the game and its rules, CCP has wrongly complicated everything, making things so artificial that players have gradually felt penalized with regard to all the work of learning already accomplished in the past. In addition, for EvE Online to finally regain its acclaim, it is imperative that this system of learning skills becomes both more transparent and also more natural:

a- more transparent: in the sense that no skill can, overnight, be totally useless, as is already the case today.

Q. I had been surprised by the remark of certain players on this subject, but my recent experience has shown me how well founded this remark was; by completely restructuring my character Ully Loom to make it a full alpha while waiting for things to stabilize on the CCP side following the latest announcements and incomprehensible decisions, I realized the impressive number of skills that had become totally obsolete; this is a situation that cannot last any longer and CCP must continue its efforts in the direction of more transparency…

b- more natural: in the sense that there should be a tangible link between the character’s activity report and the learning of their skills, a learning that in fact would become totally automatic.

Q. I give you a small example, you want to mine for the first time in Hulk; nothing should stand in the way if you already have the necessary financial means to buy it on the New Eden market; you then equip it in the same way with the desired equipment; then you venture into the asteroid belt for the very first time, and that’s where your learning begins, your time spent in this activity allowing you to gradually gain each skill point needed to strengthen your mastery of said vessel; And presto, the turn is played, everyone is a winner, players like CCP who would thus regain their letters of nobility…

And take my word for it, by doing so, CCP would above all restore confidence and freedom to players who would always explore the New Eden universe further. In real life, it is the time spent repeating things that makes each of us become over time. Hey! well for our New Eden characters, it should work very much the same. And by aiming for this goal, CCP would give a new meaning to its MMO-RPG-RTS, making it closer to the natural profile of each player.

Q. Then hop, rebelotte; if you are an impatient player, you are free to switch to the server dedicated to PLEXs and injectors in order to artificially accelerate this learning process; if, on the contrary, you are a patient player and love MMO-RPG-RTS, nothing prevents you from devoting all the time necessary to discovering the game’s mechanisms on the server dedicated to MMO-RPG-RTS, if these mechanism can remain unchanged over time, CCP having to undertake not to modify them again as in the past…

So. Try To Fly Safe Again. Or Not.

Ully Loom

ps: Don’t feed the troll - [Preferences][Notifications][Users][Users Ignored] + Add what you want Forever…

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IDK…

I was unable to foresee the achievements from a “goal” set and it’s gains…
I don’t like it.
It was such fun to see the skills effects grow.
And the items unlock.

I guess it’s an-other kind of game.

Even if this was not going to happen “SP would not be completley removed!”

It changes everything due this quote above and as it will start to change everything in Eve Online once more Capsuleers see through the cracks.

I’m sorry, delete it/edit it… no matter what is said from this day forward the fact that it was mentioned in the way it was on this thread is enough to spook every skill point farmer who placed a deal of RL funds into their accounts for the joy of building ontop of that system that had been Eve Onlines main structure.

The purpose feels lost and continuing down this path is now a waste of time. Even without change, the slight mention of it had already made that change and just watch the market react.

I will reply to this or at least a concern i saw there in all that text…

Along time ago I was asked in my 1st week of playing EvE by my 1st CEO what i wanted to do…
My answer: be an arms dealer.

I was a career ganker my first 2.5 yrs in the game, lived in nullsec for abit…then had to take 6 month break cause of RL.

Max was created in 2013, and for the first time i actually mined some rocks…I also started simply, I bought cat prints and researched them…cause I knew then just as now the demand for catalysts never runs out.

My corporations BPO portfolio grew every year, and its member made hundreds of billions over the course of its existence.

@Paliphany_Bradbury dont be an industrialist, be an EvE player, learn to marketeer with the best of them, be a down in the gutter cutthroat MOFO, you dont want to share the belts your mining…gank them, use the ganking to recruit them, and mine for you…Be an Arms Dealer…not an industrialist. get aggressive.

@Max_Deveron I very much appreciate that you are paying attention to the discussion.

But OMG!? You’re advice is to tell me my playstyle and goals???

The whole reason EVE had an appeal was that I could strive to create my own playstyle/approach. You’re telling me I’m not an EVE player!?? Not a discussion of your methodology/approach?

I’m at a loss for words.


My Dad said I could be anything I wanted to be when I grew up, but when he realized I was his daughter he disowned me.

nope, i gave you 1% of 1% of my experiences, with about 0.5% of the advice i could give you in an open forum…

Just give it some thought, and let your mind wander…sooner or later something will spark and you will start planning and scheming how to play this game in ways you might not have thought of before.

and that is all i can for you at this time, attempt to leave a seed of thought and some water and hope it grows.