Am I a slaver? I'm not sure

So the other day I was just minding my own business doing things in the trade hub as you do and someone, like I guess just some rando, yelled at me and called me a ‘slaver’ as I was walking by. I mean that was kind of weird, right, but after security took the random angry guy away it got me thinking if I was really a slaver or not. I mean, I guess I don’t really know the answer to that?

I don’t keep any slaves myself. I mean, I’m pretty sure. I carry a lot of people on my ship, and it’s possible some of them might have slaves? Or maybe they are slaves? It’s not like I interview every crew member myself, but I think it would be unlikely though, but then people try to get away with bringing on board all sorts of stuff onto ships they shoudn’t so who knows for sure? It’s like trying to keep drugs off a ship with hundreds of crew, I mean yeah drugs are illegal but you just know someone is going to find a way to sneak some on there. Maybe it’s like that with slaves?

Then I was reading up on it and apparently being a slaver could be defined not just about whether you have a slave but more about whether you benefit from a legacy of slavery. Like, whatever that means, but I guess it might mean, did you used to benefit from slaves? So l asked my Mum about it and said “does our family have slaves?” and she was like “how would I know, ask your Dad” and so I asked Dad and he said “you remember when you were a child and your feet hurt from dancing and then they got infected and we got someone around to clean and sterilise your feet and give you footrubs” and I was like “yeah” and he was like “well that person was a slave” and I was totally like “no way he was so gentle I thought all slaves were like miserable and stuff” and then he went into this big long discussion about slaves in the Empire and all the good they do and how you only hear about the stereotype mistreated ones because of the war taking up all the media space and honestly I wasn’t really listening because he does tend to drone on a bit (I love him of course but you know how it is with parents) but I still really wasn’t sure if a footrub was much of a “legacy of slavery”. I mean some people get a whole palace built and I just got like ten minutes of foot massage once a week. I mean, he was good at it, but it seems on the lower end of the scale, you know? Like, my feet were pretty gross I’ll admit, but I don’t think I caused him too much trauma or anything.

So, what do you think? Am I a slaver, is it just a ‘yes’, or is it not that simple? Am I as bad as someone who owns thousands of slaves and beats them? Is there a sliding scale or are we all the same? Should I feel bad? How bad, exactly? And if so, what should I do about it? Should I find a random slave and give them a footrub? Are we all slavers anyway because we all use stuff that slaves have built, probably, at one point? I mean if you’ve jumped through an Amarr-built gate at least once… know what I mean? Or is it a no because I honestly had no idea about this until like, last week? Actually interested in the real answer, please don’t use the opportunity to go on a boring ideological waffle-fest about how good or bad slavery is, that’s actually not the question tysm

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A real slaver would know they are.

Maybe you should not think about it as a binary, but as a scale. Not “am I a slaver” but “how much do my actions and inaction support slavery”?

Because for the first the answer is “yes” or “no” depending on the definition of “slaver”, and there are many, so the answer is both yes and no, and deciding on which definition to use is likely not going to have an effect on anything.

But understanding the latter might tell you if you wish your actions, or lack there-of, to change.


Like, I don’t even know, that’s really difficult to quantify. How would I even know if my actions support slavery? Or inactions for that matter? I mean, this is the whole quandary I’m having.

That might sound weird, but to give you an example, I used to be in the Amarr Militia a few years back, which on the surface would seem to be supporting slavery, right. However I was really bad at flying combat and people kept dying (e.g me, but crew also) so I quit it altogether after a few weeks and I definitely won’t be going back. Now assuming that the Amarr is fighting for the right to keep slaves (a bit of a simplistic summation maybe I dunno but let’s not get too sidetracked here), was my action of flying militia missions actually supporting slavery, given that I sucked so badly at it and a bunch of militia crews died because of my mega incompetence? Or is it my quitting of the militia position the action that supports slavery more because I’m not inadvertently donating ships and scrap metal to the Minmatar cause on a regular basis anymore? And what effect would that have, anyway? I mean there’s probably Minmatar ships out there flying right now and successfully liberating slaves that are built out of bits of my exploded hulls, it wouldn’t surprise me. So it’s really not very clear-cut to me. I don’t actually know what to change, or even if I should, or if it would matter anyway. I know that I can just (probably) not have slaves and that would be me not being a slaver, but beyond that it seems murky.

Guess I’m not, yay guilt free life. This logic is much simpler for me to understand.

You are still looking for “am I or am I not”, instead of nuances.

Yes, you supported slavery by flying for the Amarr Empire. No, you probably weren’t very effective in it. It’s not either-or, it’s both.


Yes, you are. You’re welcome.


Well yeah, that’s kind of the point of the thread, to get a definite answer.

Being two contradictory things at once is too confusing for my brain. Why can’t I just be one thing.

This answer’s a little light on detail but at least it doesn’t confuse me.

I guess what I’m trying to say is if I meet that guy again and he still does feet, should I pay him?

Paying someone, does not make them less of a slave, if they are one.

I pay my slaves, a lot. They will remain my slaves till the conditions are satisfied under the criteria of the Scriptures as currently revealed for our times by the Empress of Amarr’s dictates on the topic.

If you wish the most basic, atomic level, and morally neutral way to attempt to define slave, then you are left with one who has their ability to self-determine perturbed by another, at best.

If this foot massaging fellow is not able to self-determine their objectives in this life, such as where they live, when and how they work, what faith they practice, they are a slave in the most qualitative sense as can be given. Keep in mind, slavery is not a mere binary condition with quantitative certainty. Slavery is a wholly dynamic term, no more absolutely definable than any other experience of an aesthetic.

As for if you should pay him. That is a value judgement for you to make. My take, yes of course. If they provide to you something of value, then why would you not in turn feel obliged on some level to reasonably compensate them for the effort they’ve made that has contributed to your own existence?

Because life isn’t that simple.


I don’t understand what is all this whining about.

The question of whether you’re a slave or not is for you to decide. This is an absolute value of a function of quantity of slaves you personally have, added with absolute value of a function of revenue you receive monthly from selling slaves. If it exceed a certain positive limit, you can consider yourself a slaver.

But if you neither personally have any slave, nor regularly capture slaves to sell them, or otherwise commit daily trading of slaves, I see no reason in asking such questions.

When you get such issues you really should not ask YOURSELF if you’re a slaver or not. Instead, you shall ask who are those haters who called you as one.

I have dealt with that grade of people before. Though instead of being called a slaver, they called me a “Provist”. As a matter of fact, I have never got a honor of invitation to become one - and theoretically I even couldn’t get it, by a number of reasons I am not providing here.

Does it make me a Provist though, does it make me question if I am a Provist, if it’s pretty much obvious it’s not?

No, calling me Provist doesn’t actually say anything about me, it only tells that people who do that are illiterate and ignorant haters who don’t even know what “Provist” means.

The same goes for you, being called a slaver doesn’t tell anything about you, it just shows that those who called like that are same degree of illiterate ignorant haters, who don’t even know what “slaver” means.

Now, what should you do about it? I don’t know, it’s your life. If I had an opportunity to meet these people in person, I’d just break their nose with my fist or my foot to teach them a lesson, because, really, such behavior doesn’t even look like they’re honorable enough to challenge them for a honorable duel. Though you pretty much could do that as well.

Family names and personal reputation can be way more impotant than personal lives. Never stand back when someone says something false about you. Confront them and make them pay. Would it be monetary in a court of law, with their blood or even their lives, doesn’t matter. Just make them pay.

Gosh. Okay I guess it’s kind of complicated. Guess I just… won’t worry about it too much then?

Seems reasonable. I mean it’s not like I don’t have the money.

It was just like some rando, not anyone important. He was dealt with, I’m pretty sure.

If that’s what you decide, then that’s what you decide. But when you start to really examine it… nothing in life is simple. There are always nuances, complexities, considerations of perspective and context.

How you address those complexities will define you, far more than any single label like ‘slaver’ ever could.


I mean, I was just a little curious, wasn’t out here writing a thesis.

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