Broker Relations

Greetings,

We have just released a devblog summarizing upcoming changes to the mechanics around creating and updating orders on the in-game market. Please feel free to use this thread to discuss and provide your feedback to the Development Team.

19 Likes

This is stupid. Get a friggin’ economist again. You put new eden through a recession which is actually now a depression by the last transaction changes. This will make it worse.

40 Likes

A couple of questions

1: if the discount for the Advanced Broker Relations skill is 50% at a skill level of 0 means that everyone will at least get a 50% discount, surely discount should be 0% at skill level 0 rising 15% per level until 75% at level 5

2: Can you use this opportunity to make placing orders of less time than 3 months a worthy option, currently the same fees are paid regardless if you put something up for 1 day or 3 months. can you tie in the length of time an order is placed for to reduce the charges across the board (brokers, sales fees etc)

26 Likes

Looking forward for more haters !

6 Likes

Margin trading scams gone.

Many will rejoice, however even though I don’t scam, it makes the game interesting to not fall for a scam, so ugh, let’s just make the game easier. When does that stop?

14 Likes

so ccp are killing yet more of the game to combat bots? so sick of this method

22 Likes

“An order’s price can only be specified with a maximum precision of 4 significant figures.”

To clarify, now nothing can be priced at less than 10.01 isk? Cause that sounds like a fairly significant change.

Regards,
Cypr3ss.

3 Likes

Can you clarify the effect that this will have on items that use 3 or less significant figures?

8 Likes

As your stated goal is to move EVE to more realistic market, I’ll point out that there is one thing that makes this impossible: the forced anonymity of the seller. On realistic markets, customers can choose to buy from someone else than the lowest-price seller for various reasons; in EVE supporting or boycotting particular suppliers would be crucial.

Other than that, the attempt to move towards less bot-like station trading is great in principle. I worry that the escrow-in-full and order-change fees will favor big-time traders in favor of newbies / small guys though.

38 Likes

Tick size
This penalizes hardcore market types and is generally meh. It will really neuter he market and competition will fall away. Too bad they could just catch the script kiddies.

Upwell structures broker fees
Good!

Modifying an order ISK fees
With the tick change, this really discourages the trader aspect of the game a bit more…kinda sad really…Industrialists will be happy though…

13 Likes

Commenting just on margin trading:

The margin trading scam depending on the client lying to a player. This was bad.

17 Likes

but it was useful for fair trading too

6 Likes

Maximum precision of 4 significant figures.

1.01 = has a precision of 3 significant figures, which is less than the maximum, so it’ll be fine.

9 Likes

Glad to see Margin Trading is gone, the scams were a nuisance. The client deciving people was always pants-on-head stupid.

Mandatory 1% minimum citadel fee, plus some of that going to NPC’s. Think that’s healthy. Stops people citadel 0%'ing for their in crowd, which sucked for competition. Adds ISK sinks to nullsec markets, which is good.

Tick Size - Meh. Doesn’t actually mean or do anything. It’s irrelevant. Reducing by the new limit will still always be the best option for sells and raising for buys.

Relist fee is bad. Really bad. Hilarious to see a dev blog state “Among these are orders that are being modified hundreds of times, with behavioral patterns that are very likely not human.”

Market traders have been vocal about struggling to deal with bots for years, so you do something that punishes the same traders as much as the botters? Hilarious.

All you’re going to do is make bots compensate for the modification fee on the fly, because a bot can do the following arithmetic very easily, where a human cannot:

    • I listed for x
    • It has not sold for y days despite z orders being filled for this item.
    • I’ll relist it to the total value of w, to give the best chance of selling the item before becoming unprofitable.
    • I have y value in my head, which I will not go beyond, for the total cost of purchase price + broker for that + sales price + broker for that + sales tax for that + relist fee (cumulative).

Do they think a human player is going to be able to dig thru their wallet (lol new wallet strikes again) to determine these values? Will I know of my 300 orders that for Salvager II’s I’ve already done 2 relists so a further one would defeat my profitability because I inherently know exactly what my buy price was when I purchased them 4 days ago?

You could achieve the exact purported purpose (besides killing another profession - Plex for Accelerators that remove broker/relist soon, I guess) with the following changes:

    • Make Relist Fee be 1000isk per 1mil of value (0.1%), so 300m is 300k. Small for trading but it adds up to be a respectable ISK sink for CCP’s “We’re balancing an economy we ruined without an economist, lol” efforts.
    • Make listing an item for sale instanteous, make relisting an order delay that orders appearance in the market by 30mins. This destroys botting behaviour that relists instantenously, promotes intelligent pricing that rewards human wisdom (“I can relist, but where will the market be in 30mins?”).
29 Likes

you can price something at 0.01 isk if you want. That’s 3 significant figures.
you cannot price something at 100.01 isk. That would require 5. Once you go above 100 isk, your minimum increment is 0.1 isk. once you’re above 1000 isk, it’a 1 isk. etc etc

17 Likes

The relisting change is cancer. It feels like CCP is just trying to kill as many playstyles as they can this year \o/

The fact that they had the nuts to list graphs showing that “Most orders don’t get relisted so this won’t affect people!!!” proves that none of these yahoos in charge of these changes have ever played as a trader, and that’s kinda depressing.

48 Likes

I made a killing during the blackout “recession.” Volatility = Opportunity. Bring it on, baby!

:red_circle: This change is garbage, but I doubt CCP cares at all about what their players think.

26 Likes

Except this is the opposite of volatility…

4 Likes

The skill’s old ability to create a Want-To-Buy order with only partial ISK escrow is removed, so all WTB orders will require 100% escrow to be paid up front. :face_with_monocle: