Can we get an honest CCP response on the state of the ESI?

The CCP devs are reasonably active in this forum and respond to quite a few posts, so I’m hoping we might be able to get a real, honest response from one of them.

As we all know, the ESI has a lot of bugs, inconsistencies, and other issues that are well-documented but don’t receive fixes from CCP.

Since the ESI was released in 2016, we’ve seen a steady decline in the effort contributed to it by CCP. There hasn’t been a post on the third-party developer’s blog since 2021. The team that was responsible for it hasn’t posted since 2018. Most of the CCP developers who worked on it have since left CCP. @CCP_Chimichanga (Nicholas Herring, the Technical Director of Infrastructure at CCP) commented 2.5 years ago that the slow ESI development was due to a move from JSON to Protobuf internally, but there hasn’t been a real update since then.

It seems that the only time CCP will comment on the state of the ESI is when they have to disable something because it’s broken or has been abused (market history endpoint recently, still disabled, and the search endpoint earlier last year), but they won’t comment on why other issues (purely on their end, not due to abuse) won’t be repaired or receive any development effort.

I get it if you simply don’t have the time or money to work on it and add new features, but these tools are used by hundreds of third-party apps that keep this game alive. Some of these issues are pretty minor in terms of CCP developer effort but would have a major impact on quality of life for third-party devs.

And if the ESI has been “archived”, for lack of a better word (won’t be touched unless absolutely necessary), I get that too. It’s a business decision that I don’t agree with, and I think it will gradually cause greater and greater harm to the game as the current state gradually becomes more out of date, but that’s your call. But if this is the case, CCP could at least make a public statement about that so we stop hoping.

So, CCP, please give it to us straight:

  • Has the ESI been archived/abandoned?
  • Will developer time/effort be allocated to fix any of the major bugs, inconsistencies, or limitations?
  • If some developer time is or will be allocated, what’s the best way for us as a community to identify what we consider to be the most important fixes or improvements?

It’s hard to keep track of who is around anymore, but I’ll try everyone I know who has worked on ESI at some point or might be able to answer these questions (please don’t ban me for doing this, I’m desperate):
@CCP_Convict @CCP_Swift @CCP_Chimichanga @CCP_Mephysto @CCP_Prism_X @CCP_SnowedIn @CCP_Masterplan @CCP_Bartender @CCP_AquarHEAD @CCP_Zelus

3 Likes

100% this. Some of the more egregious examples:

  • The bookmarks endpoints were “temporarily” disabled in 2019. They’re still not re-enabled. That’s a hell of a “temporary”.
  • On the public contract item endpoints, you can get ME/TE/runs for blueprints. On the private (character/corporation) equivalent endpoints though, you can’t, because they’re older and were never updated to meet the new design.
  • CCP decided it was better to create a completely new API for new faction warfare data than to update the faction warfare endpoints on ESI. Yeah, they would rather create an entirely new API deployment and not tell anyone about it, instead of just updating the existing one that the third-party devs use.

Crazy stuff. I’ve been a tech lead for a lot of companies, and I’ve never seen one be so OK with such poor maintenance.

1 Like

To be honest, EvE would be a better game without ESI. Just make all kills/losses public and keep public char data, that’s it. Imperfect information would make EvE a better game IMO.

3 Likes

What a ■■■■■■■■. I dont know any other game that has an api that nearly matches what EVE provides. Its the base for the myriad of third party apps out there, many of them still working even without further work on the api. It had an impact on me and other people getting into development as a profession or improving there. Reasonable criticism is one thing, crying due to the sake of crying is something else.

I know the csm cant say anything due to the NDAs

CCP decided it was better to create a completely new API for new faction warfare data than to update the faction warfare endpoints on ESI

Happens a lot in our industry, “the code is rubbish, I know better lets re-write it” and then you end up with nothing really getting done. That, and devs tend to re-write code they don’t understand… Honestly, ESI future is not looking good.