CSM 14 - Week 16 Update

A very, very short update on the CSM


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Thanks for the new post. Both CCP and the CSM need to do more than “lurk and listen” to the regular channels they have been doing for years. Brisc and I had lively discussions over last year where I argued that failing to aggressively reach out for opinions and views from people not actively participating in discord,Reddit, and the official forums resulted in a creation of an echo chamber, where like minded people or ideas tended to reenforce one another and other opinions were either ignored or never brought up. RW was a nice example where many of us questioned the need or demand for its development, only to be bluntly told by CCP that everyone they talked to was asking for HS group activities. Another example was the issue of stale (10+ years) missions and exploration sites not being revitalized or made more interesting. CCP replied that since people were still doing them, they were fine, all the people they talked to wanted no surprises or differences in their missions (min/max), and people weren’t really mainly missions runners or explorers.

You hang around the same group of people, opinions tend to distill down further and further until anything outside the loudest opinion is ignored. I’m beginning to doubt CCP’s highly touted data mining capabilities or, perhaps, their ability to accurately analyse what the data shows. If they think anyone on the CSM outside of Steve is considered to be HS, what other data have they misinterpreted? What a mess.


I will give you credit for stepping up and providing those updates. If actually the numbnuts at CCP would grow some balls and do the same…

I agree you deserve credit for providing this information.

  • Providing some minutes, which say “we cannot comment on this, it’s all very secretive” is not very reassuring, just the opposite, it raises more questions and concerns and it does not help to build trust and faith.
  • But faith is, what i need right now. I’m still relatively new to the game and i like the game a lot. But i have serious concerns about the future of the game. Since i started to play the game at the beginning of September i have the impression, that less and less players login. And i do not see any information, how CCP (and the CSM) will handle the situation. I’d like to see a roadmap which developments CCP plans to deliver at which time schedule. I read the minutes of the annual meeting between CCP and the CSM and to me it looked like a meticulous recording of what was talked about, but no commitments and no tangible results. If i’m wrong and all this information is available somewhere, then i apologize and just point me into the right direction.
  • But right now, i have doubts, if i should dig deeper into the game and if i should invest more time and more real money in the game or whether it wouldn’t be more promising to look for different game. If i have the feeling, that next year they need to shut down the game, because hosting costs exceed the monthly income then i will certainly quit.

In a nutshell: it comes down to communication - and this is CCPs and yours, CSMs, job to do: you, CSM, must help to communicate the future of the game to us players in a way, which is credible and comprehensible, to help stop the player depletion, and it is CSMs job to urge CCP to radically improve on those issues, which current players see as the most pressing ones and which would attract new players.

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To address your points:

  1. The CSM is bound to keep the discussions confidential. The goal of releasing the meeting minutes to address these concerns without revealing information that is meant to be kept secret.

  2. My anecdotal data is showing steady increases in player activity since the end of Blackout. That is based data limited to my playgroup and we need to take into account the end of our 6 month war.

  3. If you are trying to decide if you want to continue to play EVE, it’s for you to decide if you personally are having fun and enjoying your time. Do not read too much into the chatter here and elsewhere. It’s a personal choice, that shouldn’t be driven by other people’s opinions.

As far as the future, I think CCP is listening to the concerns and making efforts to improve both the product itself and the processes to make changes. But I would not expect huge changes. EVE is a like a huge cruise ship that has to turn slowly, it’s can’t make 180 degree turns without problems.

I guess we will agree to disagree on this one, but whenever one releases a document, mention some stats, but dont show those stats that is a huge problem. Especially in a situation such as the BO debacle.

I will also argue that if I sit down and go over every NDA document the CSM signed, I guarantee that I will find things that are not included and that should be told to the public.

As far as that, I will quote Arrendis in that we may be " cautiously optimistic", but that is even an understatement based on the BO and the less than lackluster Vega. CCP listening? They have to show that by their communication and updates that make sense. Not updates that they dreamed up during one of their sauna drinking party…

“As far as the future, I think CCP is listening to the concerns and making efforts to improve both the product itself and the processes to make changes. But I would not expect huge changes. EVE is a like a huge cruise ship that has to turn slowly, it’s can’t make 180 degree turns without problems.”

While I usually like any ship metaphor or analogy, I think comparing CCP and a cruise ship is not quite accurate. On a cruise ship, you usually can have fun no matter the destination, although rough seas can cause things to go afoul quite suddenly. I think of CCP is more like:


or perhaps


Nobody ever thought, that withholding information was the idea of the CSM. But this is exactly the point: A CSM, that withholds information from the people, which they should represent, cannot be trusted. We have no way to follow up what you are doing with the information we give to you. Trust must be earned! (Remember?)

So a CSM agreeing to these limitations and working under them is a construction fault in itself. People will always say, you are in bed with CCP, defending CCP and just trying to soothe us.

CCP and CSM should change that in my opinion.

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…and regarding my information request: Does a roadmap exist? If so, where can i find it,

Thank you in advance!

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