Esi Knife, a replacement for Jack Knife

EVE Technology and Research Center Third Party Developers
1

90% finished now.

Hi, some weeks ago i begin to create a new ESI Control panel for my accounts. As you maybe know, the new ESI interfase have some serious drawbacks, and is partially a VERY CLOSED way to see the things, more stable, yes, but have serious problems. Oner of the problems i fight continually is the need of multiple Querys via auth post and then you need check maybe 400 or more calls when before you can do some things with less than 20. I know we can caching the data (player names, corp names, etc) but first time is a serious consideration, and is an other level of hell to do market analysis (myself use a little the fuzzwork market instead the ESI).

Anyway, i first purchase a domain called EveKarma.com (not related with goons) and now i am migrating to a new domain, esiknife.com , with the purpose of simplify the control of your own characters (i made some videos soon) and in second place, as a Jack Knife replacement. My original idea was Publish in Github the sourcecode, but with the recent purchase of Microsoft, i decide not do so at the moment.

In the development of esiknife.com i find some things confusing, as example, the assets show some weird things (pins in planet already destroyed, etc) and some hard limits. You can only see 50 mails in the ESI and easy 1000 first assets (raised to 5000 in v 0000.6) , but the spirit of the FIRST jacl knife was simple.

Main Page of your data (ships, corp, wallet, what weapons four races, etc etc)
Journal 
Transactions
Mails
contacts
corp story

The mails are not complicated to get, but are a hell to save. You must read the 50 mails, save it and show it. I put in this first version only the headers of the recent mails.
This is an example of the Knife of Inactive Seller:
https://esiknife.com/knife/knife_NTY5YzFiMmIxODU5YjFjY2JjMzI1Nj.html
, i put tomorrow the main page (ships, skills, photo, corp, actual wallet, etc), and the other ideas are as i say before.

  • The File is erased each 30 days. Cannot be altered or erased sooner.
  • You can give the token (NTY5YzFiMmIxODU5YjFjY2JjMzI1Nj) to your potential recruiter, and the recruiter can get in one step the file

I am open to comments and to discuss ideas in reddir or in the offical forums.

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For assets you need to use the x-pages header and page parameter to get everything. For mails you need to use the last_mail_id parameter to get everything.

Someone already made a tool named EsiKnife, so, you may be better off staying with the evekarma name to avoid confusion. But, ofc. It’s 100% up to you.

Also read the sticky in this forum and get on slack with us, it’s a great place to get help with any problems you encounter with ESI.

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Thanks. I choose the 1000 assets and 50 mails limite because is a quick and dirty aproximation, and already too much queries for that. I am caching thenames of corps , pilots but anyway is slow the first time.

Esi Knife was selected because i dont know the the other solution (esital) and when i know, the domain was already purchased. By the way, i think my little aproximation is more amigable and near to the original Jack Knife. For me esital crash when i run a pilot with 500 notifications and ask too much Scopes, dont needed.

Maybe i go slack later, thank for the offer.

4

Mail and assets are key features for any tool looking to replicate the feature-set of jackknife, and you’re opting to effectively not support these… because you’re making too many queries?

You’re already making the initial query, just follow the appropriate headers and keep performing the query until they tell you to stop.

Open a connection, fire requests down it to your hearts content.

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First, of my 33 characters many of that are less than 200 items inventory, some of them, two exactly, are plus than the 1000 assets limit.

The poroblem with the mail is not the queries in first place. The problem is is a hell save it. If you want put a pdf / html with 50 mails content, is a stupid thing in resources consumed. I dont want or need a delay in saving my 1600 mails some people have, and iam targeting to do a STATIC SNAPSHOT of thye token state when the people sign for it. If i target a Pandemic Horde character (i am not) save the last 600 mails in the moment of the snapshot, is not good idea.

I know i can save the 50 or 600 or n mails in a separate archive, but are three queries for each mail at last, probabley many of then new and no cached, and an ESI error, delay, bad connection or whatever have more cons and go es to happen.

If no people use my software, i have not problem. The heart is not the knife functionality, is the panels and account control, including the comparation between a roster of characters skills and reputations.

6

So your esi knife isn’t a replacement for jack knife, rather it’s a haphazard feature set based off jackknife’s and your needs.

Your characters have small inventories, not everyones do.
Your characters may have small inboxes, not everyones do.

If your intent is to create a text based snapshot for the user, why not allow the user to toggle different sections to be included in the snapshot? Or configure the number of mails you pull, if the user wants to download a huge text blob, whats the issue as long as he can control it.

As for
but are three queries for each mail at last, probabley many of then new and no cached, and an ESI error, delay, bad connection or whatever have more cons and go es to happen.

I fail to see your point? Three calls is nothing, and you’re programming against an API, failing a call is always a possibility and should be handled gracefully.

If you’re only really intending this for personal use, that’s fine, but it seems dishonest to tout this as a replacement for jacknife, claiming it’s 90% complete, when it just blatantly isn’t.

7

Good point. Waiting to see your own version =)

8

I finish the first phase of the software, with the limitaions mentioned (1000 assets and 50 mails), and migrated to Esiknife.com

I updated the example result page.

https://esiknife.com/knife/knife_NTY5YzFiMmIxODU5YjFjY2JjMzI1Nj.html

9

You’re limitations are easy to get around. For assets, as golden gnu mentioned use x-pages which you will get from the first query and afterwards you can do simultaneous calls.
For mails, what I do is displaying the first 50 and then append the rest using background calls.
I would also overthink the sharing system. Add something like a share button which asks for a character name which then has to log on using no scopes on order to see the page or sth like that.

10

The assets as is have other problems more serious than the 1000 limit.

  • Why are returning internal items already destroyed ? (one example the extractors in planets already destroyed and without command control)
  • Why are returning SOME books injected passed via can or DST bay ?
  • Why are returning some whole containers / ships, i know not in my possesion ? maybe passed to other char via dropping in space but look as not the case because not look as ships

When i find how answer these questions i check the Assets. At the moment i already pass the five hundred “knifes” genereated and are only 4 characters with more than 1000 assets. One percent affected look normal.

The problems when the mails are the time needed to save that. I am in Mexico and having problems to do anything more in my Infinitum connection (copper final mile for Internet of Telmex ), and is out of my control to do experiments. If i cant put quickly enough the final page (second page for the length ) in less than a minute (150 plus one call for each receiver) the application look as broken and more chances to not be used by people with bad connections. My wife use computer connection too and I cant see reddit.com/r/awww + heroes of the storm + netflix jessica jones (she) without a three minutes pause in get the 150 calls. Maybe not the more scientific way to do so, but if a VPS Solid State 8 gb ram server with zero cache for be a new characters can do quickly, is better discard ( less than 1 in linux uptimne in knowmnhost seever ).

The method you suggest for share can have some problems :
1 ) need do more knifes/snapshot if u plan to apply in many places at the same time, one for each place applying.
2 ) You not know who go to apply in a corp. You know the corp, but not the people who review your application, you cantr send the message
3 ) Oh yeah, you need a thiird person to log to see. Many prople in eve are paranoic and dont go to use my tool if they need log.

Thanks for try my site. I suggest you check too the comparison options in the DT high menu when you are using the whole package. Is the part more feedback receiving myself.

11

Version 0.0006

  • Put a correction in skill number of caldari carrier in knife section.
  • Raise the mark to 5000 items in assets

For checking other problems related with assets, Esi Knife now returns the first 5000 Assets in your character. By the way, i am relatively a pack rat ith my hauler and she only have 2473 rows.

I am serious thinking in create a new way to seek and search the assets trying to autosort / humanize the content, not in esi knife html shared page, but yes in the esi full logged page.

One of the secondary problems i am having is related the time for creating three or four tables with script of sorting (do u know you can sort by column, already ) ? Probably will be better create a sort , shrink approach and do it in a new table, but focusing increate an optional flag to show “stupid” and “question mark” items.

As example the stupid items, i have a toon who eat a blue pill and is in his nventory, and the destroyed parts of planets.

Ny the way, the question mark are, where in the hell is this inexistent container ??? I have not three stacks of plagioclase, were in a procurer i pass to other char, things.

Important : You need login again or generate a new token to use the 5000 new mark

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Are you planning on open sourcing this after completion and deployment?

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Probably but in my own site. As i say in reddit, current problems in my work with use github, and need solve some issues first.

Maybe in one or two months if real life not stop me before so.

Ayt the moment no serious issues :

  • jun 05 make trash the location of citadels (were stations ) and i need auth each one with the character , not all are public
  • request for put the basic missile functions in the esi knife page
  • content of 50 mails (problem to do so)
  • the mess with the trash present in assets as is.

any request of features are welcome.

14

Until we have independent confirmation you are the original developer of “ESI Knife” and not someone misappropriating the work of another and impersonating the real developer of it (or appropriating the name “ESI Knife” from someone else because it sounds cool and might cover up how shitty this really is), I’m under the assumption you are lying about who you really are, and are attempting to pass off the work of another as your own.

Once that confirmation is obtained, I will either apologize for being an ass, or leave what happens to you up to CCP for whatever they think they can bring down on you.

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Umm… if you are saying if i am a CCP developer of the proof of concept, i am not.

My work is previous as the esi knife moniker.

You dont understand the implications of the developer EULA, and the Knife part is a fraction., The heart of my work is the account and comparison matrix control, and change the name because someone link me as a goon member and i am not.

I am the only people who do that speciivc software with DYYNAMIC MATRIX COMPARISONS.

IS NOT CLEAR HOW YOU THINK I CAN LYING ABOUT WHO AM I. But with your atack, the best proof of the work is mine, nd not attempting “use the work of another s your own”, is very simple. The code will be closed.

Why ?

The hypotetic real author can disclose the code.

By the way, you comment is ad hominmem atack. I am relativley known in the character bazaar forum, and your post, as a whole have non sense because the premise is the conclusion.

I use the time in my defense.

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@Krysenth By the way i took a little time to do this seven minute video of the matrix comparations Esi Knife made Possible. The Dream Team Module, auto select and remove of the view the characters that are, by the algorithm, redundant.

As far i know, Never has existed in Eve Online api / crest / tools other project capable to do a comparison between groups of chars, who have what skills, dream team, and manual control of expires date.

Maybe this is a simple proof of original work, and for me the redundant auto filter, and the green dashboards, are really more useful than the esi knife function.

Regards.

17

I’ve spoken with the developer of the tool that I consider to actually be what can claim the name ESI Knife and he has confirmed that you, in fact, are definitely not him. So… yea.

Aside from you using “fancy headline terms” to try and make it look better, you should understand one thing: the successor to Jackknife is not a mere “character bundler” like you’re peddling. It’s a recruitment tool. That is why the POC made by snowedin has so many scopes, as will any other tools- to view all the information that is relevantly possible to determine whether someone is a risk, asset, or a potential asset for a corporation. They are, after all, the EVE version of background checks.

Additionally, all of your “issues” go away if you take the step of using a hosted service, rather than something connected to your home network where you are neither guaranteed 99.99whatevernumberofnines% uptime or bandwidth.

Personally, I’d tell people to stay away from this as a recruiting tool. https://esi.a-t.al/ is a better functioning recruiter tool even though it’s merely a POC weekend project. It is also open-source, which allows people to host their own, and submit pull requests to add features or fixes.

18

Well,

For me You are making assumptions. Example: I am using a hosted service, in Knowmnhost VPS servers. You can check yourself using whois under the domain and the ip address. Please, dont try to look Savy.

Someone say is needed in other part, a interface GUI to the scopes of the other program. As far i remember, is a python program. You need python to install. And Jack Knife dont compare characters, a very simple form to do so was offered for eveboard.

The main issue is you are making again, ad hominem attacks.

  • Can you prove the original Jack Knife do something more than my program ? as far i remember only the emails issue. I think you can do what you want.

The diffeence, is you can say this is a weekend program, as a humiliating form of my project. Thanks. i dont know much programmers who can do it in the time i use it. You can ? Please show us your own version who make the problem of esital 500 notifications issue ago., or made an improvement of tour own code, with zero code to begin. Dont forget made yur own version of the filter of the redundant character selctor, or the 400 brave checker. Will be be beautiful in python, and i dont think you can do in less than a whole week.

Show me that I am wrong or remain silent. You have the same problem as many people, envy about those who can do things. You can have reasons or results. You do not have one or the other, I think …

For me, you are the people i lobve in my work, the people who need to pay me to fix they errors, and do what they cant do.

21

Erase myself my other message.

Reading all the past knowledge of Krysenth, and his direct access to a CCP developer, i think is better HE wait the new version of the python software, and i and others use mine.

The problem here is simple: Diff tools for diff purposes, some more readable than other. Mine dont look as a weekend project, and is not. Dont Matter.

I think yes, krysenth have relation with the developer, and maybe is himself. My software was made for my use, and is useful for me. The hugs of other users are not my motivation. We see what happen in some months, but i dont know the other puython software befre, and as i say, much scopes to my taste.

22

So, I wanted to let you know why you’re getting all the negative comments:

  • You’re closed source and request very sensitive data (email/password/eve data)
    • This is easy to fix: Open source your software
  • You are using a name already used by other software
    • This is easy to fix: Use your evekarma.com domain instead.
  • You don’t want to get all the data needed to replace jacknife functionality
    • This is easy to fix: Don’t claim you’re replacing JackKnife (Alternatively, implement the missing functionality)
  • You are using email and password as login to your site.
    • This is easy to fix: Use EVE SSO instead

All those issues combined raise a red flag.
All of them are easy to fix, but, you keep defending all of them and instead of correcting them.
That is what I don’t understand, why not just do the changes required to build trust and move on from all this negativity, instead of the endless arguments with everyone? …that is the real red flag!

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