EVE is an easy 7/10 on Josh Strife Hayes' Pay2Win scale

You can’t as I have already won.

You may send me 1 billion though if you want.

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No, I tried to explain something that I thought may be interesting.
Because if MMORPG are by essence prone to RMT, maybe they are by essence prone to P2W, whatever the devs do, and yes then PLEX does not change the P2W.

No, you claimed it’s meaningless because it would mean SV has P2W, which does not make it meaningless, and used invalid example of RMT like SV did not even have the possibility to trade in the first place .

Both those arguments were stupid : the first one because it does not relate to the topic , the second one because it does not relate to the topic.

I explained both to you in the following post. You just ignored both my points and made more trolling points, twisting what I wrote and what we were talking about.

Again, that is stupid. My understanding was precisely that everything is P2W the moment you can RMT. Saying it’s P2W when you can’t RMT is just a troll. This argument makes no sense at all. There is no logic.

How you reach “everything” when starting form “when you acquire power for money and thus RMT” ? You can’t ! Your “argument” has no logic, you only affirm stupid things after stupid things !

You keep misrepresenting reality for the sole reason it does not match your distorted view of it.
If all the games you play have P2W feature, then they have, like it or not. Claiming they can’t because otherwise “everything is P2W” is a completely stupid argument.
Enjoy your own stupidity, piece of troll.


Mr Epeen :sunglasses:


So have we come to the conclusion Eve isn’t P2W but heavily and strangely monetized in a manner that’s hard to compare to other games because (a) you cant win and (b) CCP have such a diverse player base they simply don’t know what the ■■■■ to sell us?



You would never play a pay to win game, right?

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I’m a bad example sadly, I play Eve and Starcraft 2 (co-op) because I’m old and crap at games but I do get your point.

What amazed me (from the OP vid) was the amount of money Fifa was making, this has made me realize, and I hate to take it there but at this point I’m considering it being generational, how much and how many people are paying. While I still maintain Eve pales in comparison to the games out there nowadays, and I’m in no way in denial of the fact the real money/game experience relationship in Eve is not perfect, but when Eve is compared to the now industry standard, rather than complain about it, consider what other options there are for CCP as an old IP and how much worse it could be.

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I don’t know who that Josh Strife Hayes is but I’d say it’s more like 10/10
ALL the powerful ships and modules are behind a paywall but it’s not P2Win??? :rofl:

The pay wall of actually subbing to the game? Which you can do by simply playing the game and spending no money? :roll_eyes:

@Wes_Wyhunnan Don’t pretend that EvE is free or not P2W. Grinding for something doesn’t make it front of paywall, it’s still behind it.
EvE is P2Win either with Money or Time but it’s still paying.
:roll_eyes: back at you. Twice: :roll_eyes::roll_eyes:

I told everyone in this thread 10 days ago, I beat the game, I never paid a dime. Eve Online cannot be pay to win, if I beat it.

However on the topic of the “free ride”, one can grind their way to omega. People will argue and debate about the Plex but the fact remains; Stranger A buys Plex with his cash and sells it for ISK… what a chump! Then stranger B grinds ISK and nabs the Plex which he foolishly uses to buy omega, when he could have used it on clothes! Of course, if everyone plays the game as stranger B does, there would be no Plex to grind. B plays the game for free, unless you count the internet, electric, and cost of his PC. Meanwhile we assume A is subbing and paying for others to sub as well by buying Plex.

I now return you to your regularly scheduled program… already in progress.

Have fun!

No, you didn’t.


If you’re a nerdy type that understands the market relationship with the NES sales you can easily increase your space wallet to cover your many pilots for months with such a low outlay.

Sure we can grind to have bling but had you seen the store this weekend?

Omega on sale and even though the price conversion between isk to plex is rather high at present, by planning for such future sales makes your nerdiness seem worthwhile!

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Doesnt matter how you acquired it, ccp sold it and designed mechanics to increase sales

Yes I did. I don’t want to spoil the ending, but the final boss battle and cut scene is too awesome for words. Then the chromatic gold lettering with the words, “Game Over You Win!” then the credits roll.

Have fun!

No, if you can’t use money for additional features in the game it’s not P2W.
Having to use your time is the basis. There is no game where no time investment is required. If you have a game but spend zero time in it, then it has no effect.

A game is a service that transforms the time you invest in it, into fun. At least that’s the basic idea.
To acquire this service you may have to pay, so use money. But besides that initial (or recurring, it’s the same) money cost which is required to access the service, the term P2W refers to additional payment available to increase the time efficiency of that fun device. That is, if you pay more, you will have more fun.

Is it realistic to play the game and only pay the subscription ? Yes. Many people do. Is it realistic to aim at a titan, a mothership, an AT ship, without paying money ? People also do it. So there is no “paywall” per se.

Indeed if you assume that there is no payment at all for the game, then the recurring cost (subscription) can be considered a paywall. But that’s because you assume a company can run without being paid. Which is blatantly wrong.
Either there is an initial/recurring money cost, or you need to have features that you can pay for, at the very least cosmetic ones. A game where the dev does not make money is something as stupid as players claiming the trit they mined themselves is free.
Just because your parents have been providing you free food, does not mean that this food is actually free.

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@Aiko_Danuja is the final boss.

I’m an orphan and I had to literally fight other kids every day so they wouldn’t take my afternoon snack.
Don’t talk to me about “free food”.

I’m the Alpha and the Omega, the source of all being, all feeling, all the dreams,
The beginning and the end.
I was there long before dust,
Will remain after the world ends in rust,
Long after the reality which I bend
For my will is what it all means.

Don’t tell God what he ought to do.

Don’t quote me again with your BS.

Don’t talk to me about “BS”.