But thats the thing. You have to compare a ship type that doesnt exist. Not one that does.
Do you think one XL weapon on a t2 battleship would be oppressive? Keep in mind these ships are as expensive as a dread.
Not opressive, just meaningless.
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Fair enough. Price of marauders is so ridiculous even if they did dread DPS it wouldnât matter. Theyâre too fragile and canât jump, so the price tag is meaningless. However if the T2s followed the SB/ABC theme of glass cannons with cloaking/mobility/range then it could potentially be meaningful? They can use MJDs, and with XL rail/beam/cruise etc they could kite pretty well against caps. Idk just spit balling cause the idea sounds cool.
Then by all means donât respond to me - respond to this thread proper and not troll those who are actually responding and contributing their opinions.
Garbage troll responses like this make people not even want to contribute on the forums. Good job 
No, go away.
It made its point, in that its a meaningless thing to add to allow battleships to fire Xl weapons.
The thing is, any mechanism or system that would allow the use of XL weapons on Marauders would only serve to produce something that is like a dreadnought but far more annoyingly better.
It would need more than 1.5, 2k dps because otherwise theres no difference in using just regular weapons on a marauder.
Add on top of that, a ship that can MJD and warp around?
No, go away.
No, go away, get off this discussion if you have nothing more than this to add.
Shouldnât we first explain what the word âvitalâ means, before we send him along his merry way? He could be repeating the same nonsense somewhere else, and there someone else would send him away, too. Eventually, after a limited amounts of send-aways heâd be back here.
And no one taught him that if it was a vital change, the game would absolutely need it to survive, which is a dumb claim to make. This reminds me a lot of WWE commentators. I can only recommend listening to them. Their ability to butcher language in the most cringe worthy, pain inducing ways is absolutely horrifying!
Whatâs even more horrifying, though, is that the only reason why they can do this, is because of the millions of idiots in the US having no â â â â â â â clue anyway.
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love that people are under the impression fighters do THAT much damage⌠or dread weapons without seigeâŚ
Example, my rattlesnake does 1400 dps, my nid around 2000dps⌠a leshak wellâŚ
And dreads do pitiful damage without siegeâŚ
So what you people are really saying isâŚ
âwtf havent i bought myself a leshak yetâ
Happy to clarify that for you all 
Honestly, I think itâs just people who want to experience cap gameplay but donât want to skill into it.
Youâre right to an extent, OP probably sees carriers as oppressive and wants to level the playing field. But a different part of it is wanting the capital experience, without the cost (time cost).
Training into a T2 battleship is childâs play compared to training into capitals.
Um? Is it really⌠Have you ever been in a capital before??? Itâs easier to train into capitals then any of the t2 battleship, and before you say they are not the blackops needs full jump skills to pilot where normal caps donât and you might as well have perfect gunnery/fitting/tank skills to actually make Marauders even close to effective⌠Not to mention the cost of the t2 battleships being outrageous. Hell a Chimera sells for 900mill where a Palladian is over 2bill for just the hull alone. In the current game t2 battleships are to niche to actually be useful. Thereâs only 2 roles. Highsec dread/ mission boat and blops jumpbridge. Adding a third role âmightâ help this by making a dedicated capital counter ship.
I think you havent been in a small gang and tried to kill a pvp vargur⌠xD
Really? So youâre telling me that solely training racial battleship 5 is a harder train than:
- Advanced spaceship command 5
- Capital ships 4
- Jump Drive Operation 5
- JDC5 (5 is not optional in a capital)
- JFC3
- Capital tanking and capacitor management skills
That of course ignores carrier, which has a higher training multiplier on it than T2 skills (blops/marauder), which means it takes longer to train as well.
And of course it ignores the fighter skills that would obviously also need to be trained by this proposed T2 hull. Dreads require Advanced Weapons 5 as well, so your marauder doesnât even have that going for it.
Donât talk from your ass.
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- You need jump drive 5 and calibration 4for blops, caps only needs calibration 3
- You do need advanced weapons op 5 for a Marauder
- fighters are just specialized weapons just like capital sized guns and reps, all other support skills are equal.
However this thread is not about why caps are classified as caps so your still special donât worry. This thread is addressing how t2 battleships are lacking and a possible option of helping them out is giving the class the ability to counter caps.
Also yes lasker on YouTube does have some good videos of it but those fights are very rare due to the price of the ship .
Speaking from experienceâŚ
1a. True, you donât technically need Jump Drive Calibration 4 or 5 to sit in a capital ship⌠but without it you wonât be going very far.
And without at least level 4, you wonât be welcomed in most group operations because your limited range will dictate how far everyone else can go (even if their skills are maxed out). This is because capital battlegroups need to stick together for protection and logistics reasons.
2a. Actually⌠you do.
https://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Golem
3a. Yes and no. Some support skills apply. Others are specific to the âcapital sized weapons.â To use a capital effectively one has to train those up to at least level 4 to get most of the effectiveness out of them.
I say this often in the New Citizens section: The larger the ship, the higher the character skill and teamwork requirements are.
In the case of capitals, some skills go hand-in-hand with teamwork (e.g. Jump Drive skills).
In the case of Marauders, you have a ship that simply builds on roughly the same skills as a Tech 1 battleship. Only a few âextraâ skills are needed.
In short⌠what others are saying is true; capitals take longer to get into and be effective in than Marauders.
PvP in marauders? most peope will be looking at how to scram you and drop caps tbh, and rightly so; marauders are NOT easy targets to take down in pvp. They are a royal pitfa - if the player knows whats he is doing of course.
Lol exactly my point, they are shiny killmails in PvP unless you have crazy advantage.
Also Iâm not comparing t2 BBs to caps you guys are, Iâm saying they are similar in some ways but really I donât care what you can dig up saying how hard capitals are to train into thatâs not what this is about⌠Go start a capital thread or something if you want to compare caps to subcaps
Dont be so dishonest as to pretend that all you need is battleship 5 in order to fly a marauder or a blackops ship.
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