Fix the warp core modules CCP

Make the module Active.
Make the bots press the buton, if they want warp core stabs.

Do you think this will actually do anything?


Yeah, bots can already activate modules, so I’m not sure that would actually accomplish anything.

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I see already producing tears :slight_smile:

Make it one only, active, and each cycle adds +1 warp stabilisation. (Bonus points, make it a built into every ship feature, & if as it cycles you lose DPS or can’t undertake offensive actions)
Then make the cycles depend on the size of your ship, and you have now solved perma points while still allowing a fair chance to kill someone if you have the DPS on grid or close by. At a certain point it could even overcome bubbles on your start point.


Or instead of trying to fix WCS CCP should just remove them entirely. It’s a bad concept that encourages bad fits and bad strategies.

What if they introduced base warp core strength stat for all hulls, and inflate warp disruption strength for different meta modules, added new ship role bonus, etc. New layer of complexity. It’s been suggested many times over the years.

Say base WCStr for frigate/cruiser/BS is something like 5/10/15, single “point” gives you strength based on your ship size, so a cruiser with 10 base points is able to tackle any frigate, even 1x warpcorestabbed. And a frigate needs two x5 modules to tackle a cruiser, or 2 WCSes to counter every cruiser point. Some specialized ewar ships might have double or tripple role tackle bonus. And of course there are always scripted HICtors out there with 100x.

Might somewhat take away from fleet tackler newb role, but that would depend on bonused ship alpha/low skill friendliness.

New warp core strength skills, modules, rigs, implants. New warp disruption strength modules rigs, implants and skills.

This seems very much like a solution in need of a problem. Why do we need to introduce all this extra complexity when the system as-is works just fine, with the exception of WCS being a newbie trap module that should be removed?

I would argue that a binary system does not work fine. It is what leads to the kitey meta, where people will not engage unless they have a clear win. We need more grey areas in EVE, less intel, more ability to break out of a fight when it’s not going well (but is still close).


Interesting. I think the bots will learn to press the button in a short time and be very proficient at it too. I think its the humans that will struggle.

But you know, the OP has made his case with just three short sentences in two short posts, and one of them was just to express glee in the imagined anguish of victims.

I am usually more positive with people’s ideas, but in this case, how about no?

Okay, I fit 4 warp core stabs to my haulers, and anti-gankers still kill them. In fact, last time I went out, I lost a hauler, and had to leave another wreck unlooted because I knew I would just get killed again. So, you can still get killed with WCS’s fitted, as long as the people that are hunting you are properly prepared. Moreover, it causes them to devote more mids to tackle, which often means less tank for them (i.e. anti-ganker, shield-tanked lokis), which means that they’re easier to gank in turn.

I’ve also spent time gate camping in shallow null, and have seen WCS’s allow people to slip past our gate camps. Naturally, it depends on the size of the camp and how many points they can put on you, but I believe that WCS’s are an important travel tool (most frequently used by explorers).

All of that being said, I don’t have experience with WCS’s in all areas of the game (such as hunting bots), so I can’t say for certain that the mechanic works good everywhere. However, I think it works well in the areas of the game where I have observed it. WCS’s give people a PvP avoidance tool, which can be countered by individuals and groups that plan ahead.

Is that what they’re calling “counterpoints” nowadays? Try as I might, I just cant keep up with all the new slang of all you whippersnappers.

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But your suggestion would make this problem even worse. If you know that you can’t stop the other side from disengaging unless you kill them before their WCS clock expires you have to bring superior numbers to kill them before that happens.

Yes, and that’s kind of the point. WCS rarely save you unless you’re in a situation where a smart player would have survived without WCS and in exchange you’re making your ship less effective at whatever you’re trying to do with it. It’s newbie trap module that people who understand the game know to avoid.

I’ve also spent time gate camping in shallow null, and have seen WCS’s allow people to slip past our gate camps.

Do you not have bubbles and HICs in nullsec?

Yeah, we made extensive use of bubbles, but stabs would still sometimes help some guys get away. For example, pilot warps gate → Celestial → gate to avoid bubble. One person follows pilot to celestial to try to get tackle. He warps off anyway because he has stabs. Or, someone gets caught in drag bubble, and we start chewing on it. Something else lands in the bubble soon after. One dude switches over tackle, but the prey still manages to bounce one he reaches the edge of the bubble because he had stabs.

Naturally, the composition of a gate camp will influence how useful stabs are, but they can sometimes help.

But those are all edge-case scenarios. How often is it really a good idea to cripple your ship in its primary role in exchange for a 1% chance of maybe getting to escape from a gatecamp when you’re too lazy to scout with an expendable ship and avoid it?

another " I want to kill stuff without making effort" thread

All those extra chances to survive add up. Low align time, tank, warp core stabs, add enough of them together and you’ll survive more situations that you would have died in if you didn’t choose that particular set of modules.

Warp core stabs aren’t crippling to a ship that doesn’t need to quickly lock targets far away. Haulers, explorers, there are situations where one or two of these in the low slots bring a lot more positives than negatives.

Bots can press buttons. I don’t see how this changes anything.

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But the point is that you can’t fit all of those things at once because you have limited slots available. WCS come at the expense of more useful things and add much less value to a fit. And, unlike other options, WCS only help you once you’ve already screwed up and been caught by something you should have avoided.

Why ‘should I avoid it’ when I can choose to fit less tank and agility to make me immune to a single scout with scrambler + disruptor?

Warp core stabs are a valid choice that maybe make a hauler less tanky, but there are situations where extra tank or extra align won’t save a ship once it gets caught.

You make it sound like ‘Oh you screwed up and got pointed, you deserve to die!’.

You call it ‘screwing up’ when someone catches your ship.
I call it ‘screwing up’ when your ship explodes. There’s many things you can still do after someone puts a warp disruptor on your ship. Jump gates and leave them behind with weapons timer, ECM burst or drones, call in help, survive with extra tank modules, etc. Warp core stabs are just another tool in that box.

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Because by avoiding it you avoid any threat. By relying on WCS to bail you out you lose your ship if the other side has enough points to lock you down.

Warp core stabs are a valid choice that maybe make a hauler less tanky, but there are situations where extra tank or extra align won’t save a ship once it gets caught.

There are. But the scenarios where those things won’t save you and WCS are effective and you couldn’t avoid the threat entirely are rare. So why make your ship less effective in its primary role just for that one in a million chance of getting something from your WCS?

You call it ‘screwing up’ when someone catches your ship.

Because it is. If you get caught you have to roll the dice on whether or not they have more points, have more friends that you didn’t see, etc. Why would you give someone a shot at you when you can avoid them entirely?

If they are active modules, can we overheat them?