Fixing the Cruor

(PinkMonkey Dragon) #1

Most of the pirate faction frigs instill fear in people seeing them coming. A Worm is nearly without a counter, when it sits inside a novice plex. A daredevil means almost sure death to anyone who cant get away or out-dps it. A Succubus can just do anything it wants as it speed tanks you or leaves at will from most fights. A Dram can get under anyone’s guns. A garmur is the cancer of the frigate world for sure. Dual rep asteros can take small fleets to kill, if they can survive it.

But the cruor … is hardly ever seen. It’s not very fear inspiring. It has many solid counters (drones, ancil shield tanks, missiles, projectiles, cap boosters), and it’s slow, not very agile at all, doesnt carry great dps (it has the same as a succubus, but without any bonus to tracking or range). It has one little drone …

SOLUTION: I think it’s simple, having fiddled around with it. In needs another mid slot. It doesnt need to be faster, it doesnt really need more cpu or grid (although i always seem to be 2 pg or 5 cpu away from something awesome) … It just needs more mids. HOW TO GET IT: Drop a high slot, and change the neut-nos bonus for amarr frigate skill to 35% (up from 15). That way, the fitting room used for the nos’s can go in the mid, and it gets to keep its neut/nos trick. I would like 5 more CPU if it was done, but i think that one trade off would actually be enough to make it work.

Anyone else got a way to make a cruor not suck so bad?

(MinerArt) #2

How is the Cruor slow compared to other frigates?

Cruor: 330
Worm: 320
Daredevil: 385
Succubus: 340
Dram: 460 (dam that sucker’s fast)
Garmur: 415
Astero: 312

So it’s 3rd slowest, can drain caps like nobody’s business, works regardless of your capacitor status with draining cap, and stasis webbifies.

Doesn’t sound like it’s slow to me considering it’s middle of the pack and can slow others down. It also gets a drone to assist.

Then again if your target has no capacitor it’s unlikely to return fire unless it has cap boosters which means it’s a weaker target or using guns without cap.

As for your “2 pg or 5 cpu away” did you consider implants?

(Dark Engraver) #3

Just needs more deeps

(Arthur Aihaken) #4

So what - another high slot and turret?

(PinkMonkey Dragon) #5

Remove a high and change the Neut/nos bonus it has to 35% (or 40%) from 15%, and add a MID.

As to Dark thinking it needs more DPS, i’m not so sure. It has a little more (due to drone) than the Succubus, and no one really thinks the succubus is lacking DPS. There really isnt a bonus i would want it to trade for more dps either. Besides all that, dps isnt why its broken, it’s that it doesnt have survivability, or utility. An extra mid would do all that, either in more control (web), more cap (The thing caps itself out in 38 seconds even with a GOOD fit, if you cant land a nos), the possibility of a shield tank (leaving lows for the DPS–hmm, an extra mid might even mean more dps.

Just feels really out of place among pirate factions, most of them have an extremely overpowering advantage with few counters–where the cruor has a TON of counters (missiles, ancil shield tanks, projectiles, drones, cap boosters) and ONE sort of half-baked power to nos things… it even starts off with like 300 less EHP that a navy comet (and a comet gets more dps, more drones, is more agile, has a tracking bonus, etc)–and mind you, a comet is a faction frig. A cruor isnt even on the radar compared to a comet, but it should be.

The extra mid would open up its power a lot.

(PinkMonkey Dragon) #6

All good points, but doesnt change the fact that its far and away the least used pirate faction frig (10 solo kills could have you in the #1 or #2 spot all month).

Also, Cruor is almost always armor tanked, rigs and plates slow it down. That would put it below the worm right away. The only one slower has a cloak, and is meant to explore. Imho, that makes it the slowest combat pirate frig there is. It also has the second worst inertia, AND the highest mass.

It’s slow. Very slow.

But that isnt even why its terrible. It just has no utility, you cant do a whole lot with it. Because its slow, it HAS to tank, to do that you lose any chance to fit dps mods. To tank very long you need a repper, on a ship who has no free mid, and cant control range (because: SLOW), so you struggle to do much of anything very good.

Yes they have no cap–but that doesnt matter at all fighting anything with missiles, anything minmatar, or anything with drones–it doesnt matter to some one who has ancil shield reps, or even cap boosters. The special ability it has–the nos, doesnt make it strong. it has no way to stand out like all the other frigates do.

It’s the corax of the pirate frig world.

the 2 or 5 pg thing is with implants. It just cant quite get enough stuff on it. But, lose a high and change the bonus, and everything would fit fine. Hell, at that point, it could LOSE 5 powergrid and be fine.

(Ember Fireheart) #7

I think the best way to boost it to where it needs to be is by giving all its modules the same engagement range, where atm they are all over.

20km web and 9km nos

20% web range bonus
15% cap drain bonus

Would rather it had a 20% nos/neut range bonus, then at least it would make sense.

The only reason why the cruiser doesn’t suffer from the same problem is because medium neut’s have higher range than small’s.

(Stitch Kaneland) #8

No utility? It has 2 bonused nos that suck cap no matter what. It is slow, but it has a long web(s) to reach out to any frigate kiter allowing you to catch up. With 2 bonused nos, it doesnt need a cap booster for active rep, it just uses your opponent to cap up. A dual rep cruor is stable with 2 OH nos with scram, web and mwd (off). Its dps is alil low (170ish) but it has tons of utility to cap out an opponent or catch them.

(PinkMonkey Dragon) #9

Yeah, that could work too. The bonuses are all over the place, which is why most folks cant figure out what it does. So far as i can tell its a kite-catcher. use the web and mwd to go get them and brawl. Only, the cap usage doing that lasts less than 40 seconds (unless you get to land a nos)–if you use neuts instead of nos, its sub 20 seconds.

I think that would just turn it into another kite ship though, which with its speed its not well suited to. Plus, if that was the bonus change, it would take over a minute to cap out most frigates, and 3 or more to get a dessy down using NOS. I know most fights dont last that long, nor half that long at frig level. It really does need the amount bonus, atleast for the nos.

i would be would be willing to try your idea, over the drop of the high. I think if the roll bonus was simply changed to “100% bonus to small energy turret and small neut/nos range” it might work. You’d still have to use dead space nos to get anything close to 20, but it would lock onto most frigs for sure.

(system) #10

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