How I feel about EVE right now

I’ve come and gone with EVE over the years. There have been long stretches where I played almost full-time with half a dozen subbed accounts, and there have been long stretches where all my accounts were Alpha, and there have been long stretches of something in-between. I’ve done everything from hisec industry to lowsec FW to piracy to nullsec alliance military fleets and POS management to mining to mission running to living in wormholes to playing solo across a wide swath of different areas. I’ve given some thought to what actually draws me into the game and what turns me off.

I enjoy fleets. In fact, fleeting up with other pilots is pretty much the only way you can get me into PVP and even then I prefer to fly logi. I enjoy logistics and reconnaissance. There’s something deeply satisfying about all the planning and scrambling necessary to provide strategic support to fleet and alliance assets, particularly when those fleets or assets are in a spot of real danger. The coordination with other pilots, and not just your own accounts (although the more the merrier) lends these activities the same satisfaction as combat fleets. Wormholes are fun for all the same reasons. I’ve considered joining Signal Cartel more times than I care to count. I also enjoy mining fleets, in fact I loved boosting mining fleets with my Rorqual back in the POS days while I mined on my alts with a fleet full of like-minded combat ready krabbs. It makes you feel like a contributing member of a team who is happy to have you with them. This feeling is the beating heart of every MMO, and the game’s success or failure is largely dependent on how well and how often it facilitates players experiencing that feeling.

This is the real reason so many pilots are citing the death of the Alliance Tournament as a reason they finally left EVE. The AT was team-building gudfights rut rut rut for the home team in a nutshell. It was the EVE version of e-sports when e-sports is eating the gaming world alive. Who in their right mind would kill it? I understand that CCP hates casinos and gambling and wants to kill it with fire, but really guys, despite what the Goons believe is true deep down in their souls, casinos are not the devil that’s stalking EVE. Casinos were actually a good thing for generating “content,” and if the Casino War didn’t demonstrate that with flying colors, well, I don’t know what to tell you.

The truth is this: the devil that is killing EVE is bots. The Botting Menace is the antithesis of everything that is good about EVE, everything that makes people want to play EVE, and if CCP does not kill it with the same fire with which they killed the casinos then in a few years all this game is going to be is Botting Online. This makes me sad not because I dread the loss of PVP, but because I actually enjoy activities like running missions or ratting or mining, and I don’t want to see these things ruined by bots when they should be something which is enjoyed by players.

On a more personal note, nowadays I mostly login for Incursion fleets, because that is the most reliable, easily accessible way for me to go explode some stuff with other players who need my dank reps. It helps that it rewards me with dank ISK, which enables me to pursue other goals in the game such as building my own little industry empire in some far distant wormhole, perhaps. For the record, I rage quit EVE the last time when CCP reduced the number of hisec incursions from 3 to 1 to make room for Invasions, which are an inferior gaming experience. Incursion fleets pay better, and more importantly they require participation by more players. In an era when EVE is dying I understand providing fleet-based PVE for smaller groups…but really, you could have just fixed FW/losec and done a much better job of this that would have been exciting to more players and not taken something away from people who still regularly play. But I digress.

My real life precludes me from dedicating serious time to the game in the way I once did, and besides that there’s only one nullsec alliance I would even consider joining, and even then I have serious reservations about participating in that aspect of the game despite the fact the mechanics are probably the best place for me to find the feel goods I’m looking for. The politics, which has ended in an inevitable detente between a half dozen or so Super Dropping Super Important EVE Celebrity Coalition Leader FCs, is killing the game second only to the botting. It’s a major turn-off to me investing myself in such goings-on. I would enjoy watching all of nullsec burn to the ground. I guess that’s one good thing about the Triglavians.

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I tried it few times but it always did not impress me. It didnt feel engaging, it was tiresome. Jumping, waiting, someone was lost, People didnt know what to do, me included. Too cryptic language also. PvP reduced to target and press f1 felt not rewarding after all that hassle.

I may have felt like many others in fact. Thats why the filaments that lead to null were so popular I think. Reduced waiting times and straight into action.

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I would ‘like’ your post more times if I could. Pretty much agree with everything in it. Just quoted the ‘reduced Incursions to 1’ line because I think it’s probably time CCP recognized that nerfing popular content in order to make their ‘new’ content more played was kind of crazy.

@CCP, put Incursions back up to at least 2. Shake them up a little if need be, but let people play the content they choose rather than whatever CCP thinks they should be playing.

(Apologies if I’m out of date on Incursion limits, I haven’t been playing much lately)

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And yet you chose pvp to sneer at.

Why?

Wardecs (you know this). The watch list. Awoxing. Ganking.

Honestly when crimewatch was first introduced i was supportive. Suspect timers seemed like the right thing to do. I didn’t expect that it would have such an impact on can flipping or ninja looting. And then we’ve gone a step further by making anyone who 3rd parties in a fight criminal.

These are players working together to create content. Finding an alternative to the grind. And what’s more, they don’t need much sp or isk to start out (well wardecs do now).

I just repeat the data when someone says ‘pvp/ganking pushes players away’. If I’m wrong they should have something to show for it.

You’re happy enough to let such claims fly but if anyone answers it with data you can’t help yourself.

They were portrayed as the demon scaring away new players. They were nerfed in the name of helping player retention. T’was awesome.

That’s not to say i didn’t think there were some bad practices regarding wardecs. The ridiculous k/d ratio was alarming and the likes. Which is why I posted this in 2015:

Work in progress does not fill me with confidence. When it comes to ccp, WIP doesn’t necessarily mean WIP. Planetary interaction has been WIP since 2010…

Grats.

I hope you know i meant no offense. But i wasn’t going to entertain the idea that the people i was addressing were frequent pvp’rs on their alts. And I’ll point that out when such people try to judge the motivations (or mental/emotional state) of pvp’rs.

…and when you then win a fight against that bait tanked VNI and his 4 buddies, you get the chills - with your modules on fire.

And I agree, ganking some noob or ship without modules on is not super duper challenging or interesting but many people are only capable of shooting at newbies or ships that cannot shoot back and go on how “gudh” they are at not pvp.

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i didnt sneer but you made a very one-sided statement without any foothold which i extended with my comment. The only reliable figures are those by CCP so far - anything else is just a ‘feeling’ or ‘biased opinion’. I have no preference for any of it in particular but you made the pvp part sound like a fact - which it isnt/wasnt .

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Fancy that…

This is the primary reason why people stick around. I come across a lot of players and they don’t even hail back.

Im confused.

CCP posted a thread to talk to their players. They decided to post it to a website their players may or may not have an account (plebbit). Even though there is a website every player is guaranteed to have an account (EVE online forums). Making interaction with the true player base exlusive to the actual player base and with minimum effort from the players.

Where have I see this before?

“We want to make an FPS tied into an existing game that has a pure PC player base.”
PLAYSTATION EXCLUSIVE!

I could never hit myself in the face hard enough to make a sound loud enough as to be analogous to this level of big brain.

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Oh dear. In most cases i would agree with the general demise of good manners but this is so out of context. A well educated pilot will not greet you in local nor will he acknowledge your presence in any other form than with the love of his/her weapons or simple ignorance.

Local is not your social meeting point. Corporations are. Direct convos are if one deems you interesting enough.

I would have to say that I am the best thing about Eve right now.

I am here to bestow great insight and knowledge to all beings about the ills of the galaxy… you know things like CODE.-tards, Goons, and other sundry personages.

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Is CODE. really that important or relevant to the game?

Retaining players who quit when they are killed is a fools errand and the wardec changes proved that. They just quit the next time they are killed.

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Yah, you should really read the website: www.minerbumping.com

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If anything, as a New Player who discovered EvE one month ago, CODE. is one of the primary reasons why I started playing EvE.

I’ve waited quite a long time to post this because I needed the occasion :D, but this thread seems okay.

I am neither a ganker nor a miner, so I’m not really directly concerned by their activities.

But before starting EvE, I spent some time researching about the game and it’s community, like most people do nowadays, and the website minerbumping was one of the best things I could find out.

No matter if you agree with their methods or not, it’s amazing to see players that invested in the game, with the Will power to maintain EVERYDAY a website that make me have a good time with every single post.

There is a lot of ridiculous affirmations about them. All they do is blowing-up ships.

->“Somebody left the game after a gank!” : Yeah, who care? This is likely someone who would have left when loosing his ship two days later for whatever over gameplay reason, just somebody not made to play EvE. You can’t play EvE if you can’t stand dying.

->“They only target new and weak players!” : You mean those ganks they do everyday on ships worth several billions, sometimes up to 30 billions, are on new players?
Stop it, that’s ridiculous, as an actual new player 1 billion already seems unreachable for me…

->“They do it to feel badass against weak targets!” : If anything, most of the people who bring this “argument” ARE the one trying to feel badass, always wanting to be recognised as the ones who are doing “tRuE pVp”, as if it had any sense in the first place.

Stop pretending that you do what you do to “help retain new players” when you are a five years old account and have no idea what actual new players wants, nor have you actually done anything worth the interest of a new player that could keep him interested.

Your cries on the forum are not gonna keep me, or any other new player, interested.

CODE. however participate in me trying EvE and then staying on EvE, even without direct interaction.

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That’s cool, and glad you are trying and enjoying the game!

That said, you found reading a website entertaining during a period when you have little to nothing invested in the game and no experience with long term player behaviours. You may be able to see that running a website that some people find entertaining, and being good for the game over the long term, are two different things.

Nobody ever said that CODE. doesn’t provide some entertainment for certain individuals - after all, the codeites themselves are their own audience. CODE. is also not a monolith: it’s got better and more interesting types, and it’s got bottom-feeder salt miners.

I’d be fairly confident in stating that CODE., in general, is not a significant factor in helping to retain new players. When you’ve had a bit more experience with the game, say a year or two, come back and tell us your thoughts on how positively CODE. interacts with players.

EDIT: Another thing to note is that some of the less emotional complaints aren’t about Code per se, they’re about the design of the game mechanics. The game mechanics create the environment in which Code operates; given that environment, they’re really just doing what the game allows. To judge the long term effects on the player base, you have to do the math and say “For each Code or other ganker type player who has stayed active and interested in the game for years, how many victims per year has that player interacted with? Are those victims more likely to stay in the game afterwards, or less likely?”

It’s less important to worry about what groups and individuals are doing, and more important to look at the overall design and say “Does this way of doing things make the game better and more interesting in general?”

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They’re important in the way of reducing subscription counts when they gang up on a newbie who just witnessed where all the time he invested into his ship is gone in an instant whilst being called stupid.

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Flat earthers must love you…

Yes, James saved me as well. Glory be upon Him!

The absolute and complete commitment to RP makes me cringe SO hard.

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