Marauders

PvE Gameplay Center PvE Ships & Modules
41

Yes, you are correct, amarr ships tend to have a lot of low-slots for great armor tanking. But for balance they tend to have less mid-slots causing less adaptability.

Lasers tend to focus on optimal range and less on falloff range, which has pluses and minuses, but again all part of balance. T1 laser crystals are also infinite ammo, and reloading is instant which is nice. T2 and faction crystals do wear out tho. And if core ship skills are maxed, usually you don’t have much cap issues, since amarr ships tend to have bigger cap as well.

If you are in the game for the long haul, cross-training races to fly their ships is definitely a fun way to get a nice wide variety of play styles.

42

Sadly, to be able to make my own modules or ships, I would need to get started in Mining, and this career really doesn’t interest me. Even more, the ORE Tech Tree show me that I will be able to pilot only the Venture Mining Frigate, so not really worth it :confused:

Plus, even if Industry looks like a fun second activity, I really don’t understand how it works ^^

Thanks for you help =)
I’ll try to get a look on amarr ships once I’ll have reached my objectives in the Caldari branch. Plus hybrid turrets also need capacitor to fire (even if it’s lesser than energy turrets), so I’ll still need to get my capacitor skills up if I want to focus my capacitor on other more important things than my turrets, like a heavier shield tank ^^

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43

Amarr ship: very different to the Caldari ships you are used to. It’s Amarr hulls I’m most familiar with.

As has already been said, they are normally armour tanked (almost exclusively) - and tend to be slower. It is easier to build an active armour tank than an active shield tank. And you have to change mindset from “not going into armour” to not worrying when your shield go down rapidly. There are more armour modules to choose from than shield modules.

Energy Turrets: heavy cap usage, but the ability to flip crystals instantly is extremely useful. Only fight in optimal, falloff is too sharp. Because of slower speeds you will find range control harder, but you have some great brawling hulls. Navy an T2 crystals do wear out, but you’ll rarely see it. A thousand shots minimum.
MWDs are mixed blessing. They don’t do anything for capacitor size and usage.

On the upside they are beautiful - nothing matches curved gold and ivory glinting in the sunlight.

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44

I use a salvaging imicus for this reason when I want to salvage some ship wrecks in a pvp combat zone: it’s more mobile than a destroyer (or Noctis) so with some salvage rigs you can salvage some nice loot fast.

For PvE salvaging a destroyer is still better than the scanning frigates. 25% faster cycle means that 3 high slots count as 4, which is still only half the amount a salvaging destroyer can bring.

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45

No you don’t. Tech 1 rigs are made from salvage material only and 15 minutes time.

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46

Ah ? Well thanks you :slight_smile:

47

Back on Marauders.

They have one main highsec use - they are godly in scenarios where you are attacking a structure and you expect the structure owners to actively defend the timers. They are effectively indestructible as long as they have capacitor, are immune to non-capacitor EWAR, and deal battleship damage with (almost) cruiser tracking but the range of a battleship.

Outside highsec you’d use dreadnoughts for these purposes but in high dreads aren’t an option.

In PVE they are a step up from T1 battleships, and a sidestep from pirate faction battleships. Generally pirate battleships offer better value in this scenario at present prices (this might change - historically Vindicators were more expensive than Marauders, if that happens again then this analysis may change)

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48

Alright, so Marauders are tiny Dreadnoughts that get an access to highsec, thanks.

Citadel bashing isn’t something I’m actually interested in, I won’t gain a lot to destroy a citadel alone, that could be defended by a heavy fleet of capsuleers and I am not part of any corporation or alliance (outside of the NPC one), so it’s not really useful in any way.

Basically : a pirate battleship would be a cheaper version that isn’t locked in one place. I’ll try to look up one once I’ll have the skills and ISK to justify one.

The Serpentis Vindicator is the only one that get bonus to Hybrid Turrets, but the fact that the ship doesn’t get a range bonus but a tracking one, with highly effective Stasis Webifier, make it more a blaster ship than a rail gun one… I’ll probably stay with Rokh once I reach L4, and if I ever want to try something more advanced, maybe the Rattlesnake could be interesting.

49

Don’t underestimate the Vindicator.

It can apply damage to elite frigates with its blasters. -90% enemy speed is equivalent to +900% tracking, and if you fit two webs (completely optional), a target affected by both moves at approx 97.87% base speed (equivalent to about +4600% tracking).

Know the Spider Drone II in one of the level 4 missions (I think it might be Angel Extravaganza)? A Vindi can hit those with battleship blasters after dual webbing them.

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50

Indeed, the Vindicator is an extremely interesting ship (plus Megathron hulls are really nice looking), but as you said, it’s more effective as a blaster ship, and I don’t think I’ll be able to use Stasis Webifier at a range with rail guns, even if I use Antimatter charge :confused:

51

This was a fit for a Vindicator that I found:

High slots

  • 8x 425mm Railgun II

Mid slots

  • 2x Tracking Computer II
  • 1x Senson Booster II
  • 2x Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link

Low slots

  • 1x Imperial Navy Large Armor Repairer
  • 2x Armor Hardener II
  • 3x Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer
  • 1x Tracking Enhancer II

Rig slots

  • 2x Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I
  • 1x Large Nanobot Accelerator I

I suspect it’s expensive and the T2 Railguns are a non-starter for an Alpha clone, but it might give you a few ideas. That’s a fair lump of ISK though - the hull is 500m ISK, that Repairer is another 100m ISK. The two Federation Tracking links are another 100m ISK for the pair. The Magnetic Stabilisers are 100m ISK each - that’s a billion to start with. I suspect those faction modules are there for fitting purposes.
Still, it shows what can be done.

At a price.

52

The web bonus is the reason to consider a Vindicator over alternatives. I would never consider a Vindi fit without at least one 60% web fitted.

IMO you always start with a microwarpdrive, a 60% web (T2 or faction as dictated by budget), a scram if it’s for solo PVP (else a second web) - then fill the rest out.

It’s just not that impressive as a railgun platform.

53

I see at least two paths to follow here.

  1. Buy the Rokh, thereby cross training from Caldari to Gallente using hybrids, and then upgrading later into the Vindicator. Even a rail vindi will out-dps a Rokh, and with tracking computers, still have more than enough range for PvE, with the bonus of great tracking. This has the downside of a longer train, but can be a fun diversion as you are trying out different platforms.

  2. Stay with Caldari, train up maybe a Raven, then upgrading to a navy raven or a rattlesnake will be fairly quick(both upgrades are great PvE boats). Then from there you can branch out into other areas.

I guess the main thing is, if you eventually find mission running agreeable, you will want to get into your money maker fairly soon, cause it will be a solid steady income stream to fuel any other activities you may want to try later on. Maybe even saving up the 2bil isk for that marauder eventually. :sunglasses:

54

Thanks you !
It’s true that getting into a moneymaker quickly will greatly help me, and with that maybe I’ll be able to pay my subscription fairly earlier ^^

55

I used to fly marauders a bunch. I flew the gunnery three - Kronos, Paladin, Vargur. I never use bastion module but it’s there as an “anti-ewar” button in case I need it.

The bastion is a gimmick. Their true strength is their sheer versatility. You have a lot of fitting room, lots of slots, and lots of bonuses to power. You can configure your ship in thousands of different ways to keep things interesting. MJD and long range weapons, MWD and short range weapons, etc etc. I found that a Kronos with web, grappler, and painter can very reliably smash frigates and I had a blast (heh) with it. Think of it like a lego set. You can keep configuring it to your pleasure.

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56

You can also reprocess salvaged stuff to get basic materials. I often do, if the buy order prices look bad - why quicksell stuff for 1 ISK? And others mine so I don’t have to do it. So when I want to build a small ship for some reason I usually have all the cheaper - but needed in bulk - materials from reprocessing loot I didn’t bother to sell, while I buy the fewer units of rare materials from some miner/trader.

57

Ok, so let me get this straight.

You are still in Alpha state. Want to become Omega somehow. Asking us what to aim once you become Omega.

You are full of planning aren’t you? Nice one.

Ok then, newbro to newbro. I can only give you my experience, dont know if its the best way or not, but its what I have done. Also, I’ll share you my research on what to do in long term planning.

My toons born three/four years ago, but since I took three years hiatus, it makes me still less than one year old actually. Both experience and skill point.

In my time back then, there is no Alpha. Just 21 days trial time. Its like a free 21 days of omega. Its just 14 days actually, but since Im using someone link as referral, they give me 21 days.

This makes us different in many ways. The cause the first time I can plex my account is come the help of Pro Synergy. That corp is extremely a huge help. They lend me a noctis for free to start savaging people wrecks. (Love you, Katimah). The thing is, Alpha can’t use Noctis. This is where I cant help you. I dont know how to help you get your first plex as alpha.

After I got the first plex, Someone told me about MJD Rattlesnake (people in salvaging channel are quite chatty). Sniper Sentry Strategy usually best done by Dominix, but since Rattle role give you basically LV5 domi damage bonus with just a single gallente battleship skill level, its a good way to start.

They told me to go to Apanake, using a simple T1 MJD Rattlesnake doing SoE lv4 missions. In this place, there is no gurista NPC. Meaning, not many thing can touch my ship.

Considering I was just less that three month old, its quite impressive. No need to watch damage types because not much stuff damages me, No need to choose ammo type because low skill can do no damage anyway. Those Sentries is the one doing all the works. Blapping frigates charging to me at zero transversal, doing nice damage to cruiser even to the battleships. Im easily wiping all pockets in all mission with just my trusty combination of Warden, Bouncer and Gardes. Changing them depending on how close they were.

Even the final room of Angel Extravaganza can be done by me. Still need extra works. MJD and Overheat MWD to get away from enemy sentries at 200 KM.

Thats how I can do Lv4 missions without waiting months to train skills using blitz ship like Mach or Barghest. Blitzing is the best way to get income from missions, but it cant be done with just three months old character. And no injector too, back then.

Well, Salvaging and Mission running is how I start. Then I realize, it became tedious doing them to plex my account every month. Then at one day at a salvaging session, I read about Planetary Interaction.

With PI, and help of one particular newbie friendly PI corp (Love you too, Foo). Its my first time to venture directly to WH. “Three months old and inside WH?” Thats the question many people ask to me at that time.

But, when you see the skill requirement to start doing PI, its the most logical move for me. Need only weeks to train up three of my toons makes every PI skills lv 4. Its so good I got enough ISK to do some other stuff and even create one more account and train the other three toons the PI skill. With just some spare ISK, I can set up 30 planets of colonies in total.

The most important thing is, PI is kinda passive income. I just need half hour daily to check out my colonies or restart the extractor, then spend a session in weekend to haul stuff between planet. I can play other games in case im bored killing NPC with my sentry.

Im sure you can do it too. Need many learning, trial/error, and heavy planning when you want to do PI, but its worth it.

Thats what im doing until now. Beside hiatus for three years (getting severely sick) Im still doing PI, and like you, start planning on what to do for long term.

So here is the part where I’m sharing my research with you.

Like one guy above us said, “Pick one weapon you like and use ships that using it.”

That is what I commending you to do first. Learn what many people use as weapons.

Lets see the usual stuff in PvE;

What people use in doing mission?
Machariels, Barghest, Rattlesnake, Paladin, and various frigates for burners. Thats means you, wait no, WE have choice of Autocannon (Projectile), Torp (Missile), Beam (Energy), and Sentry (Drone) as weapon system for starting blitzing/full clear with MJD sniping. You can use an universal fleet of Worms from your many PI accounts for burner missions.

Next, what people use in null sec ratting?
Vexor, Vexor Navy Issue, Rattlesnake, Thanatos/Nyx, Nidhoggur/Hel. Great array of drone ships. Using either Fighters, Sentries for those RR ships, or usual drone for AFK ratting cruisers with 100mn AB.

How about WH site running?
C5/C6 WH sites usually use RR Rattlesnake, Golem, Vargur, Paladin, Phoenix, Naglfar, or Revelation. Missiles and projectiles because heavy neut means must operate without cap, Energy weapons being used because no need for ammo hauling. Kronos even if it got high DPS of marauders class, kinda weird because it got the worst of both world, using cap AND ammo. Drones aren’t widely used in WH because sleeper really love eating them. Though, sentries still used in RR Rattlesnake, since sleeper put high priority for repper making sentries often being left alone. The sentry can be recalled instantly because people wont stray too far from them. Making drone aggro manageable.

Sub C4 WH, people use T3 Cruiser. So, medium turrets or HAM missiles. T3C quite potent in low level WH. Battleship stats with cruiser speed. They are good site runner, Fleet doctrine, cloaky hunter, scanner, and much more. Pretty much one-stop-all-you-can-eat-pawnmobile.

Thats for PvE. How about PvP?

In lowsec, people use frigates to have fun in plexes. T1 are commonly used because ISK/fun ratio. you can see people brings Tristan (drones), kestrel or Hookbill (rockets), condor (light missiles), Merlin, Incursus, Comet (small Blaster), Firetail (projectiles) and many more. Chose one depend on your taste.

Sometime people bring big guns on FW plex such as T3 Destroyer and cruiser. T1 Cruiser usually a bait because you can hide cloaky or un-scanable recon cruiser inside some FW plex.

If we move from solo PvP to fleet doctrine, we start to see the usual meta. Lets take two big coalition that you will likely join when you decide going there. Goons and Panfam uses different doctrine depends on each Fleet Captain. Though they usually using comparably same stuff.

Brutix, Ferox, Hurricanes, Harbingers, or Stabbers. Those are doctrine stuff using medium weapons. WH corps also uses T3 HAM cruisers, mainly Loki or legion as doctrines. Loki is simply the one to go for DPS and Legion chosen because versatility between HAM & neut. Safe to say medium turret and HAM missiles are good investment for PvP stuff in the future.

For small weapons. T3D like Jackdaw often roams around in nullsec warfare. Caracal also widely used, though act as anti frigate with its rapid launchers. Sabre and Flycatcher also widely used in roaming, gate camping, or WH hunting. Some deadly nullified frigates like Claw being frequently used by some FC (people said Claw gonna be nerfed though). Also, one thing to consider. light missile and small Artillery is fast to train.

You can also train up for suicide ganking in HS if thats your thing. They use catalyst with Small blaster against tankless miners. or camping in gates with brutix, canes, and thrasher against industrial ships.

Large weapon department, we got alpha fleet. Not alpha as clone, but alpha as volley damage. This strategy using large artillery. Doing one single shoot from huge number of ships to KO people without giving them any chance getting repaired. Their concept comes from the fact that wrecks cant be repaired. The ship to go are Maelstroms and Machariels.

Or slow-cat fleet. The simple brute force fleet. Shooting huge DPS while tanking huge DPS. Abbadon and Guardian are usually used for this.

Several FC also have Rattlesnake doctrine. It was like Ishtar doctrine. Using sentries as main weapon to poke people from far.

Other large weapon used are torpedoes. Quite big array of ship type using them. Stealth Bomber, battleships, and Phoenix. Its the weapon to go if you want to do some structure bashing. Stealth bomber bringing torps also can be used to solo hunt explorer in WH.

I cant talk about capital meta. have no experience in it at all. In WH, capital arent widely used in PvP. I just read the news about something something FAX gonna be nerfed, something something Titan Doomsday, something something long range fighter, something something instablap Moros, something something troll battle Rorqual.

There is also other warfare that not directly inflicting damages but still quite powerful.

Logi ships such as Guardian and Basilisk (or their T1 Augoror and Osprey) are a must in many kind of fleet.

There also cap warfare. Ships build solely just to neut people to dry. Curse, Legion, Bhaalgorn are the guys to go for it. There is also Guardian and Basilisk used as cap support ships giving caps for those who needs it. Its because cap is life.

Many fleet support employing cap chain. Not only those logi ships, but also Rattlesnake and some Nestor with their RR spider tanking strategy. Their remote repair also used for their sentry, and cap transfer are strong enough even in neut meta. Its quite common ways to do stuff in WH.

ECM stuff like Jamming Tengu and Sensor dampener Maulus used to instantly removes logi ship repairing the fleet and restarting their locking process. Relocking 10 allies from the start? it gonna took precious seconds the FC doesn’t have. Caution, you gonna primaried like a plague in this kind of ship. No enemy FC gonna let you in battlefield mess around with their fleet for long.

Tacklers, those interceptors or assault frigates that quite hard to removes are needed to keep the target on place. Bubble ships such as Sabre and onyx are commonly used, for super capital ships with build in warp stab wont go anywhere.

Sensor booster also being used in gatecamp. instantly tackling any ship trying to warp off. Used in pipe systems where many people goes thru.

There is also Blops strategy. Hitting their target, send destruction, and gone in seconds without being detected or using gates. Stealth bombers and Black Ops Battleships used in this kind of fleet.

Well, thats it bruh. From newbro to newbro.

That all the stuff I can collect. Im haven’t searching about other aspect like industry, mining, manufacturing and trades. Me myself still dont know what to do for now. Still train my core skills so any ship I chose latter will be on par with other people use. Might starting to train a T3 Cruiser to prepare my future WH life.

Might gonna become potent hunter or elusive carebear. Might starting a corps or lone some in a C13. Might build a keepstar and a titan in a Nullsec static C1 WH. Might shooting people with festival launcher stuff. Dont know, let see when the time comes.

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58

Train into Gila and do events. You will get more interesting PvE on a side and a lot more ISK for your trouble. Running missions after that will feel like swimming in pitch.

59

I heard the Gila was a must in a lot of PVE jobs. I’ll still need to get my Drones skills up.

You’re saying Gila is good choice for missions, but what level ? Can it does L3 ?

60

yes…