This is not actually a tool for “combating afk cloakers” - such a tool would be a high-slot module so that you could go from system-to-system actively hunting. This is a tool for achieving a blue local in your preferred krabbing system. The difference is subtle, I know.
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This is what I have been pushing internally and I hope we will be able to get this done, even if it’s after the update hits TQ.
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I’m curious is there’s any sensible suggestions why this change couldn’t be put forward along with players with an active covert ops cloak getting the same 15 minute window hidden from local, you know in the name of a bit of balance
It seems highly likely covert-ops use is going to fall off a cliff in response to this update but my proposal would allow them to maintain their role and keep them desirable to use while also preventing people going to work cloaked in a hostile ratting system. There’s a win either side there.
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Since it seems that this change is already settled to be published in more or less current form, regardless of player feedback, Is this change coming up the upcoming tuesday or will there be an announcement?
A lot of people got shafted by how Nullification got handled.
can stop the meltdown. nothing to worry. this is a useless item other then against pure AFK’rs. its too easy to spot and too easy to kill. and all you have to do is recloak.
its not a huge game changer , might make some things like bomb groups , staging , capitals a bit harder but nothing is perfect.
as is this is just dumb idea that got tossed out there to make it look like they are working on issues that we have been on about for a long time.
Why, how else to show the CSM and CCP its possible to read everyones opinion? It does put me in the unique position to say with certainty, that any particular opinion is the least useful off all opinions read so far?
Not in the least bit accurate but ok
After reviewing it myself on sisi, I gotta agree with him.
It’s 100% useless against anything other than pure AFK players.
Why do you keep replying to me when you know I don’t value your opinion?
Your lack of understand of pvp issues makes any review from you meaningless
Because nobody cares what you value.
I have all the understanding I need, and if you need more than 15 minutes to find somebody in a system, can’t find a safe spot to manually decloak and recloak once in 15 minutes if you need more time to self-reset your own timer, or just give 5 bomber volleys to this extremely fragile and extremely overpriced structure, you don’t deserve to pvp.
You’ve just proven my point perfectly, your post shows a total lack of understanding how hunting works, especially covert-ops play. Now chat with somebody who’s willing to tolerate you
your question is like asking why does food companies make food that most people like and i’m sure you know how that question looks 
once again CCP avoids a simple solution like requiring cloakies to consume fuel and comes up with a rube goldberg contraption that doesnt really impact camping much . Only the AFK camper is at risk as long as the defenders are willing to pay ( insert isk sink here)
the continued allowance of a single player to disrupt a system economy for days at a time as long as he is willing to warp once in a while is still a bad mechanism for overall game enjoyment.
Given this was created pretty much to help counter AFK cloakers is that a problem?
Yes because once again adding something like cloak fuel impacts many legit forms of cloaking playstyles, while this was only designed to address the AFK cloaker.
If someone is willing to ACTIVELY camp a system for days on end, more power to them.
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It’s not suppose to impact camping. It is specifically tailor to impact AFK camping, and it does. Complaining that it doesn’t meet some other goal than it was designed for isn’t helpful. People are still suppose to be able to interrupt your nullsec farming.
See people? The calls for more safety aren’t going to stop. In the carebear mind, any risk or disruption of some theoretical maximum ISK/h is “a bad mechanism for overall game enjoyment”.
While I guess such a viewpoint is inherently valid, it is not especially useful when you are trying to build a good single-universe economy/war simulation game. While it is nice to try to consider all views and wants, the reality is that many choices are mutually exclusive or zero sum despite the happy marketing speak indulged by some that Eve can be everything to everyone. It can’t - there are certain constraints on what is possible in a resource-based PvP sandbox game like Eve.
This AFK cloaking solution is fine, at least fine enough to address what was mostly a non-problem. This deployable is useful for doing what it was intended to do and not much else. As a result, people will stop truly AFK camping and this deployable will see very little use when we reach a steady state. It will kill some activities and slightly shift the meta (possibly in undesirable ways when it comes to the large null groups) but potentially it will be creatively used in a few other niche places by clever players to outwit their opponents. Let’s see where it goes, but I think this will be one of those items mostly forgot about by most players in a few months.
But seriously CCP, stop the pandering to the carebears out there like our friend here who don’t actually want to compete in your virtual universe and should be playing another game. Your game definitely can and should have space for those looking to avoid conflict or who have lower risk tolerances (or are new!), but you actually do need to respect risk vs. reward and set up some real conflict drivers. I know you are trying and this is a complex game, but stop indulging the risk averse and quit falling into the trap thinking that more safety is what your game needs or lack of safety is keeping new players away.
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Exactly. Because we know for certain that “AFK cloakers” and “AFK players” are not the same thing.
There are a number of providers of botted AFK cloaky camping services, with cynos and offering remote control to the customer to drop whoever they want. It is totally apparent that even players who do cloaky camping will quickly adapt with a single script solution of “hitting F1 two times every 14 minutes (random 1 to 59) seconds”. Against this type of AFK cloaky camping behavior, this “solution” is worthless.
Which isn’t really an answer to the question I was asking. I am not asking about the efficacy of the solution.
Even if the solution isn’t as useful to stop scripted AFK cloakers AT LEAST is isn’t massively breaking other forms of cloaky gameplay, like a cloak fuel or other solution would have.
The argument “this won’t work because people will just break the rules” is also bunk.
If anything it could help somewhat with catching those bots. Without this for one you don’t even need a bot. But if you used a bot, it would still sit there mostly idle, giving CCP very little data to be able to catch them. At least with this module the bot will have to be far more “active” which could hopefully at least give CCP more data to analyze.
Keep in mind I’m still firmly in the camp that this whole thing is a solution in search of a problem.
And it’s not my argument. My argument is “this won’t work because people who are already been breaking those rules for years, everyone knows they did, and they are a major part of the problem responsible for a solid and growing chunk of behavior this solution intends to address, are unaffected”.
Can you please do me a favor and read the topic? We already have screenshots of botting software patch notes that found a perfect counter to these without changing its activity levels much, if at all.
I’m in the camp that a problem is much bigger than this solution can ever hope to chew.
I have read the topic. And reading is important. I suggest you do the same. I’ll speak slower.
Right now, an AFK cloaker has to do almost nothing to stay logged in and cloaked all day. It would be difficult to even pinpoint if they are botting or not as they do not need to do any input to maintain this all day.
With mobile observatories a bot has to interact MUCH more than before, re-cloaking maybe every 30 minutes at least? Now if you see someone managing to camp all day while staying cloaked either they are:
- Super dedicated.
- using some sort of script.
So the all day campers will stick out like a sore thumb more than before. Simply due to the effort required to stay cloaked all day.
Will it actually help combat botting? I dunno.