Maybe we should just abolish ISK and let anyone fly what they want. Oh and also ban weapons…while we’re at it maybe banning leaving the stations would be a good idea…you know, for the poors and new players feelings and all…
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They’re taking the scientific, psychologically abusive approach.
Yes, because they’re easy money. Donkeys hunting carrots.
The analogy is pretty much spot on.
Yeah, but does this apply to Farmers? They need scripted content, they need things to farm. Their only goal seems to be accumulating more wealth and crap. Consumerism. It works until it doesn’t, then they leave for better carrots and the game will be ruined. The sandbox means nothing to them, just look at the guy above.
He’s literally asking for what I’ve been saying will happen. First CCP removes game-play from exploration. Next CCP will remove jumps necessary to run missions. Next people will complain that NPCs in missions are too far away. Then it’ll be the gates into the next pockets. It’ll go on and on and on until people will complain that they have to do anything at all to make isk and demand Universal Basic Income.
I don’t see how the game being a sandbox matters when it comes to Farmers. They don’t play for playing’s sake, they solely play for the drugs. You call it “goal oriented”, but in reality it’s “drug oriented”.
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The income difference in ISK isn’t important. It’s the replacement time for resources put at risk.
It’s out of balance for new players. The economics of EVE pushes them in the worst possible direction: low income in order to achieve low risk.
Of course there are a few exceptions who aren’t boosted. But most new players see far too much time grinding between them and ever finding out if the rest of EVE might be interesting.
It’s reverse marketing. There are a few environments where it works well. MMO gaming isn’t one of them.
There. Shortened it to what you’re actually saying.
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Based on a manipulated pseudo-quote.
I use “victim blaming” or variations on that because it has a wikipedia page. That way it’s hard to distort the meaning. But not impossible of course, /lol.
Sorry, I don’t think I was clear there. I meant goals like “I want to become a pirate” as opposed to “I want this list of stuff”.
Started well. I agree.
Ended poorly. You can’t occupy both the high and low ground at the same time.
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I would like to point that my Somali Bootcamp from the past trained new players in Wardecs and many of them went on further in the game taking a PVP route. So why would you not give a newbie the time and effort to show him what he is a capable off? That is how drive content and help people stick to a game and find their niche.
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Because the idea we are talking about is sitting there trying to teach EVERY newbie about PvP.
Not just a select group who have already made it past the NPE, learnt how to undock, how to group weapons, and found their way into shootable space or even rarer a corp recruitment.
But EVERYONE.
PvP’ers would demand payment, it would either be abused, full of useless people who haven’t learnt the above but think they are elite, full of trolls, or a lucrative income source because CCP balanced the rewards poorly.
You will always get bad apples that will try to take advantage of newer players.
I would like to think that people, even new, are able to judge when they are being scammed or being given useless advice.
You are way too pessimistic. And I am way too optimistic, but I would rather look at things from my point of view rather than a defeatist. When I did what I did there was no ISK reward for me. The reward was seeing a group of newbies taking down people way above their punch weight. And the newbies had no isk pressures as I sponsored everything. Fits, ships, and losses.
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But that is contradicting yourself.
There was a reward, you said so yourself.
The difference here is they were ‘your’ newbies. Not some randoms you throw through a specific set of PvP and then watch go onto where ever (Or channel directly into either being fodder for you or some other abuse of your position etc depending on limits placed on you.)
It all comes down to involving players in the NPE in a direct ‘required’ manner is always going to be a terrible idea, because of the numbers of ways it can be abused and the hours CCP would have to invest into managing that.
Note, this doesn’t mean I don’t think CCP shouldn’t look into some kind of intro to PvP NPE. I just don’t think it should involve players as part of the NPE process. Only as the natural interactions said newbies encounter as they fly out into lowsec etc as part of it.
It’s funny how you call people fascists when in reality, you are the one denying people the choice to play in ways you don’t appreciate.
Using violence, insulting people, lying about facts, distorting what other people say, trying to make your personal unbased opinion the universaltruth. YOU are the only one here that checks all the “fascist” conditions.
I saw that and forgot the isk part. I did correct. 
I would rather have players involved rather than CCP forcing PVP through the NPE.
In the past there use to many initiative to help new players get into PVP. Now I don’t see that many. RVB needs a reboot, Brave needs to go back to their roots, EVE uni needs to be become more vocal and active again. independent people known for helping needs to come forward again.
Once new players know there is a choice they will jump at it if they want to. They just need to know about it.
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I hate to put my hand in the blender…
But the farmers referred to here arent playing.
They are afking to come here and complain that they feel aggreived when they, like all the rest of us, need to replace losses.
I dont see how its fascism to not like them.
Edit: Maybe farmers is wrong. Kulaks would be closer.
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This bit, I’m not going to disagree with.
But involving players…
Remember there used to be people that camped the newbie systems and ganked people there, or baited them. This is why we now have rules against doing such things, because players abused it.
Even if 75% of the players who do it are good, even if 95%, 5% bad people involved will be enough to ruin the idea.
What the hell?
What was wrong with that?!
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lol, you put your hand in the blender.
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Someone objected to the ‘f word’ I think.
True. I knew I shouldnt but I did anyway.
Perhaps its a model for NPE.
Should I try my other hand, or rebuild my old one, only with more armour?
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No idea. I only report posts that are trolling, insulting, or spamming, so I don’t see a reason to report yours even if I don’t agree with you.
And maybe this kind of players actually are just “in his imagination” to quote him.
It’s not fascism to not like someone. I don’t like myself, because in reality I’m jealous of my superior IQ. It’s fascism to deny people the right you are granted because you don’t like them. It would be fascism if I denied myself the right to breathe because I don’t like me.
(just to be clear I use “myself” so NOBODY else should go in an outrage because they feel directly attacked by my sentence. In reality I feel like my superior IQ and my superior stupidity make an interesting, while ambiguous, person. /me pats his own heads )
shape-remembering metal. Falls in a blender ? Just heat it and it comes back !
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