My No1 market advice: undercut by at least 3%

I’d like to talk about a mistake I see on the market and wrote this guide to help beginner traders and people who just want to sell loot how to make their sales.

Let’s say you check the market data of item X and see that the lowest sell order is for 100.0 ISK. The mistake is listing for 99.9. The thinking behind this is that the lowest sell order will sell, no matter how high it is, so let’s make it as high as possible, which is the minimum amount below the old top sell order.

The problem with this is that the seller at 100.0, along with the one at 100.1 and the guy who will list his item half an hour later will set/modify their order to 99.8, so you won’t sell.

If you try to combat this by babysitting the order, then you have a chance to sell, as yours will be the lowest for a few minutes, until undercut again. Babysitting needs you to be there and waste your time. Also broker fees.

The unavoidable fact is that if there is 1 buyer for approximately 100, and there are 5 sellers who want to sell around 100, only one will sell. So you have 20% chance to sell. The next day another buyer will come, but also more sellers. There is no guarantee you’ll ever sell.

The solution is listing your item for 97. Half a day later look at it and if it’s still there, undercut to 3% below the top order! Half a day later, again. You can be more aggressive if the distance between buy and sell orders is big or the current sell price is 50% higher than regional average.

Why does it work? Because for lower price, there will be more buyers and less sellers. Some people who rather bought an alternative item when X was 100 might pay 90 for it. Some sellers who transported or produced this item for profit will stop when it stops being profitable. When the price is at equilibrium, the number of daily sellers and buys match, so everyone - including you - will sell.

What happens if you bought this item for 80 and the price keeps coming down, below 80? Then you made a bad investment, eat this loss and leave this item. Leaving up a listing in the vain hope to sell is wastefully locked capital and market slot. Sure, if you have reason to believe that the price will rise, go for it!

When you see the buy and sell orders far away or the sell order in another hub far away from Jita sell, you see an empty niche candidate. Then you can keep undercutting until you and all the 0.1-ers sell. If this equilibrium price is still profitable, congratulation, you found an ISK printing item, enjoy being rich! If the equilibrium price is below your profit expectation, well, we don’t win every day. At least you helped others buying their item cheaper.

Yes, there are exceptions when setting 0.1 below makes sense, like when the top order is several days old, so its a possible equilibrium. But unless you are sure it’s an exception, undercut 3% minimum!

Fly safe around Uedama!

I’d also like to give some advice. Pinching pennies inside of a station makes you a day trader.

Learn the difference between a short position and a long position.

Learn from experts and then go your own way.

The greatest market players have a natural ability to understand ebbs and flows and some of us can see patterns physically in our mind which make the economy function similar to liquid dynamics.

the problem with your math, you’re not taking into account the amount of isk you lose by relisting.. the broker/relist fees were introduced to cut down on 0.01 isk games inside stations.

Are you talking to me brother? I don’t believe I’m responding to anything other than giving my number one market advice. What’s the issue?

You must be speaking to the op… There are millions of ways to play the market. It’s just unfortunate that people think pinching pennies in a station is actually how you play the market.

If any of you would like serious advice on how to master station trading pinching pennings, I’ll put trillions on the fact that I am the expert here. But what’s nice is I don’t care about the gains. Go ahead ask me questions on how to gitgud.

I will share with people who don’t know while everyone who currently enjoys making money with this gets angry and tries to ban my account.

As a matter of fact I’m so confident in this I will have to change characters because I would like to keep this particular account… It’s one of about hundred but I like the name on this one.

Be fast because this thread will be unlisted.. Trust me on that lol.

Let me give you the first step in game…

Your market quick bar is now what you will use to scroll up through all items you’re interested in.

To evaluate it which items belong on your market quick bar for profitability… You will follow the simple steps and this is step number one in evaluation of all markets in game. You can use a calculator or you can simply look at it and do it in your mind roughly like I do.

Subtract the low from the high. This means you subtract the best buy order from the best sell order. (Ignore outliers)

Then you figure out quickly a guestimate daily volume for that market using the volumes graph at 180 day view. Multiply the first number by the daily volume. This number is what you will use to evaluate profit potential. Bigger numbers better. You can also write a note of that number on each market quickbar entry.

After you find highly profitable markets… Your next goal is to increase your market share.

At this point I will open up for questions to clarify and change accts so I also don’t use my limited edits in other areas of the forum.

if i was talking to you, you would have had a direct notification, like this… but no i was not talking to you, i was talking to the OP. kick rocks.

Why are you so rude? Are you angry with me in particular? I don’t know who you are so I’m not sure why you’re being rude. What I can say is that I will block you the next time it happens. If you think that’s a wise choice, go for it.

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The broker fee is the same, regardless the cutting amount. And you’ll cut more times when you cut by little.

Gevion… Anything can produce results. You cannot assume people are using your timeframe.

This is the mistake you are making right now. Deeper undercuts works better on bigger time frames… Yes. Only AI would think this is anything but normal in every case.

So obviously if you are changing prices every thirty seconds you would use the lowest increments.

Please don’t read one single book and then start preaching about the religions of the world.

Every market in this game is different. Plus each individual market has almost unlimited variances in time frames.

You must use the proper tool for the job. If a 3% undercut is working for you that’s because it’s a good tool for the job you need to do. We don’t all have the same job.

List for 10, you will sell instantly! :smiling_face_with_sunglasses:

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Lol. Fax Syz

It’s also true if it’s sold quickly you probably didn’t get enough LOL.

Well, we all have our own rules.

Sometimes I don’t even list an item with the lowest price. I just figure the margin I want to make and list the item at a price to achieve that margin. Not in a hurry to sell. Most of the time, it will sell in 90 days anyway.

The Eve economy is not a real economy because we are talking about virtual money. Some people don’t even have a margin in mind. they just produce, no matter the cost, and will sell no matter the margin. So you will be undercut, no matter the price. It’s so easy to make money in the game that they don’t even care about losing money on the market, there a no consequences. They just produce for fun and like playing shopkeeper just as a kid would do.

I agree that selling for a more reasonable price is more likely to get your items sold than if you undercut the lowest sell order by the minimal distance.

Whether that’s 3% is debatable, but I do the same thing of putting a larger gap between me and other sellers to sell easily wuthoyt babysitting.

I didn’t read that whole useless post, but I read the first 1/3rd, and I also didn’t see any mention of how or if the actual cost of the item factors into this or margin of profit. By his math, he will go into a negative very quickly, since a lot of the items on the market have very tight margins. But hey, if it’s the minerals he ‘‘mined for free’’, I guess that’ll work.

Also – I have a very successful tactic against such ‘‘traders’’ on the market. Don’t think you’ve stumbled upon some magic formula to cut all the other traders out.

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