On the ndokassi discovery - who do you think has jurisdiction?

(Teinyhr) #64

More aptly, someone finds something near a place where your great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great aunt lost stuff that nobody is really even sure anymore what it was that she lost, do you demand that person to give you whatever they found because it might be something that belonged to your family? Lines of succession blur as eons drudge on.

Even so, I already said, that yes, they do have more probable claim to those artifacts than anyone else. Just that they have a claim for them does not mean that they are entitled to order everyone else around.

I’m only mad at you because you keep twisting my words.

(Arrendis) #65

You’re getting pissy at me about things Sukandi Bjokur said, but I’m the one twisting someone’s words?

Are you sure you’re not reading into things motives and malice that was never there in the first place?

(Teinyhr) #66

Could ask the exact same thing about you.

(Arrendis) #67

Well, I’m not ascribing motives or malice, just commenting on the anger you’ve explicitly stated exists.

(Teinyhr) #68

Yet in the past 6 months if there has been any way to interpret anything I say in the worst way possible, you’ve done it.

(Arrendis) #69

Well, that certainly hasn’t been a result of any conscious or consistent malice or intention on my part. And, as I firmly believe the onus to convey our intentions is upon the speaker, not the listener, that’s on me. I apologize for giving you that impression, Teinyhr.

Off-Topic Thread
(Teinyhr) #70

Apology accepted.

Now, can we move on to the fact that I’ve been advocating for co-operation from the start, because essentially we’ve been in agreement about everything, except one thing: Right now the artifacts are in the possesession of Galar-Yu and in their research facility. I don’t see the need to start bouncing them (or hordes of mediators, councilmembers and lawyers) around the galaxy just to satisfy what I assume is Sukandi Bjokur’s ego.

Because that’s what I believe is essentially the root of the problem here, from my perspective the Ihumanoana Circle is the insanely jealous party here. Both are archaeological Circles, whose passion is to uncover the past. Except if it’s specifically their past, then nobody but them is allowed to study it. And that, my friends, is just pants-on-head-stupid.

(Arrendis) #71

I wouldn’t advocate moving them at all until the dispute’s resolved. My position is just that until there’s a resolution, and in seeking that resolution, it has to be kept in mind that this is a very different situation than digging up the remains of vanished civilizations. If it’s established that the original owners of the artifacts were Kul-Brutor, that doesn’t necessarily mean the contents were Clan-specific items. With that in mind, care needs to be taken to ensure sensitivity to the needs and concerns of the Brutor Tribe, well ahead of any consideration of pure scientific curiosity.

Because no archaeological inquiry is worth conflict and bloodshed between the Tribes, and let’s face it, while I agree that

I still hold that

Even if everyone involved should grow up and handle it like adults, they’re human… so they probably won’t.

(Teinyhr) #72

I sincerely doubt that’d be the case. Plenty of “we won’t trade with and talk to you, like ever” -stuff, probably.

(Arrendis) #73

I bet the Gallente felt that way, too.

Better to be safe than sorry.

(Constantin Baracca) #74

I do think Arrendis has a point, there. Certainly, the ndokassi have likely preserved their contents for centuries, and should at least continue to do so for a few more weeks. It does to make sure there are no hurt feelings, especially on discoveries that should be of interest and pride to all Matari tribes. It can certainly take time, and it’s not as if everyone makes it easy, but it would surely be time well spent to avoid any ill feelings over the subject.

Even if it doesn’t come to bloodshed (and I tend to agree with you that it ‘probably’ won’t), it’s worth untangling the political threads first. No sense in tramping on toes on something that isn’t an immediate emergency.

(Melisma Ramijozana) #75

Grief above and below, this perfectly good debate has turned into a catfight.

(Arrendis) #76

No, just a misunderstanding, hopefully cleared up now.

(Rana Ash) #77

I still would like to see a third party to be mediating this, be it the tribal council or one of the other tribes that has no stake in this. Before some hot blooded moron goes and does something stupid, like steal the containers or bonk someone over the head with a clipboard…

(Teinyhr) #78

You clearly haven’t seen me and her actually fight. More like a friendly tussle, that. Anyway, off topic.

(Teinyhr) #79

I’m still perplexed by this notion. We can be our own worst enemy for sure, but I still find it just weird that this is something people think could turn into violent incident, even if it is just a couple of nerds throwing pencils.

(Chan'aar) #80

Sebbie pencil’s tend to be the armour piercing, fin stablised, discarding sabot type.

(Rana Ash) #81

I accept no other pencils, and besides even the dummy ones are pointy. I speak as a veteran of the great pencil fight of the republic university class of 016.

And Teinyhr, there is always one or two that has to take things to far. One matari that feels no one but Brutor should touch what is in the containers or that it belongs in the hands of the Vherokior that found it. Perhaps i am being a tad pessimistic, but past events kinda colors my views here…

(Annisir Kaugan) #82

It is academia, all about jealousy and who gets funding for their pet project. It isn’t 2 nerds throwing pencils, it is one, Sukandi, on his own. Doubtless the university bars are full of archaeologists arguing the point, and pointing out Sukandi’s own failings as an archaeologist. It’s what they do. The news item makes no mention of either the Brutor, or Vherokior tribal leaders, or anyone else for that matter, coming out in support of either side. Galar-Yu has said, quite rightly, that they will open some of the containers under controlled conditions, and presumably publish the results, and invite the press. For the news service to label this an inter-tribal dispute is reckless, bad reporting and sensationalism.

(Jason Galente) #83

Who I think Owns It: The Vherokior
Who gets to decide: Whoever wins the game of diplomatic chicken that is sure to occur.