Play Catch-Up with Alphas and Indy

It is past time for Alpha characters to have their Indy sides given an upgrade.

Alpha pilots can fly Battleships and use T2 weapons and yet the only mining vessel available to them is the Venture. Also at this time they can not use mining drones, ice miners, or barges.

Not having the ability to fly mining barges is made even more strange by the fact that an Alpha can use a strip miner - or they could if they could fly the ships they fit on.

Not asking for the use of T2s or Command ships here, just barges and mining drones, options that should be more than fair considering the warships and modules available to pilots of the same clone state.

This is deliberate balance.
There is more progression on the PvE side with ship classes than on the mining side. Barges are basically end game mining in highsec.

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Alphas are meant to destroy themselves to have fun, not to produce or massively aid the production of things. Helping them produce more things is countering the purpose of Alphas.


Eve doesn’t need more industry - it needs more people blowing stuff up. We’re at the point where the value of ore mined is far greater than the value of ships/structures destroyed. Eventually people will have stockpiled all the reserves they need - I’m surprised it hasn’t already happened.

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Alphas are ~50% subcap combat capable and ~5% mining/industry. This is intended with CCP hoping there would be many alphas blowing stuff up (or being blown up) to fix the economy that is ever more broken. But it doesn’t seem to be working.
I believe that having T1 barges wouldn’t be that much of a problem - alphas will be still limited to T1 barge using T1 strip miner with worse skills. A better miner than now, but not as good as omegas. I think there is not that much of a difference compared to say alphas using T1 BS + T1 guns for LVL4 missions instead of T2 guns and better skills to possibly run incursions too. I don’t think it is THAT much of a danger to have it AFK mining for a while.

For industry, however, having access to say 5 research slots and 10+ fab slots would simply lead to people using alpha account for industry instead. Sure, alpha clone tax makes stuff a bit more expensive, but time is now irrelevant, just buy more prints… Having 1 research slot and 4 fab ones is fine enough - enough to get the taste of that profession or self-build the cheap T1 gear for throwaway PVP, not enough to endanger the industry.

For PI, a single planet without ability to import anything or build any factory, just extractors and silos, plus poor skills likely wouldn’t be too much of a problem - only basic goods would become cheaper and there might be even some conflict over pocos due to higher volume of exports and imports. (well, assuming CCP is competent enough to turn off other PI planets and extra capability once the account lapses - so the developed planets requiring higher skills would cease to work)
But tbfh I would rather see refineries to get planet mining module and to run reactions and whatnot there. Or at least to have a linked game where you could destroy other people’s PI and defend yours.

So we can all make a ton of alphas and strip moon belts in minutes?

Better not.

The problem of having an AFK income like that is indeed a potentially serious issue IF tons of people make alphas to have nearly AFK income when not “playing” the game. But I don’t think T1 barge vs venture is THAT much of a jump people would start abusing that.
Plus, you are limited to single alpha account, so the mentioned scenario is already illegal and also possible using ventures.

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As I said. I was simply talking T1 Barges and mining drones… nothing else.

Adding anything else would be too much. You could even nerf their ability to mine moon ores and I would be fine with that. Restricting the ores they can mine makes far more sense to me than not allowing them the use of barges.

It is the amount of traditionally low-sec and null ores available on moon belts that has things all wanky not the Alpha miners…and I say that as an Omega Indy player.

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We don’t need to inject the game with more minerals, which is basically what this buff would entail.

You don’t make this change in a vacuum where it has no effect on the rest of the games economy.

Beggars can’t be choosers. Why not subscribe?

Then you can fly anything you want.

I’m an Alpha and I can run incursions because of ships like the Windicator where even alpha fit hits like a truck.

Would it really inject that much of fresh minerals? I haven’t looked at the raw data and summed highsec regions, but from a quick glance it looks like the whole HS mining doesn’t reach Delve. Giving somewhat better yield to alphas won’t change much. To really influence minerals, you would have to nerf rorqs, all alphas are a drop in the bucket.

(note that I am not advocating for a change here - I don’t really care tbfh. I just don’t see all these perceived problems with giving alphas more mining).

Remember when people quit a lot of minerals go with them also. If destruction ever even equals mining/production then we actually have a net loss occurring.

Well, looking at the numbers from the monthly economic report, my opinion is that we definitely don’t need to inject the economy with more stuff.

The economy might not look so bad once rorqs are nerfed. So maybe then it could be possible. But as it is now, I just don’t think injecting the economy with more stuff makes much sense.

Unfortunately there is an easy work around.

I am aware, that’s why I said illegal not impossible. But as I said, this scenario is already possible using ventures. I don’t think T1 barges offer you that much of a change it would become heavily exploited if it doesn’t get now (well, for mining at least …. ). After all, alphas are free, you could just make twice as many of them.

If T1 barges aren’t much of a change, then there is no need for alpha’s to get them.

It’s the afk friendly nature of barges (the rettie) that needs to be avoided.

Even if the yield isn’t that much over the vent. Setting up a horde of retties to mine is too easy to do. Controlling 20 vents is a huge multitask. 20 retties is something you can set-up and leave for an hour.

This isn’t gonna happen.

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