Solo logi

So I’ll preface by admitting that I’m a logibro. I logi in the Alliance Tournament every year, have logi’d for fleets for the last four years and any time someone needs a logi, I’ll jump into one.

I guess I’m attracted to that healer/support role.

However, even after the logi nerf, it remains a cancer on fleet fights.

I’d hate to see it buffed in this way. It’s kind of the opposite of what I believe is needed to keep fights interesting and just heads more in the direction of who’s logi can outrep the others DPS better. They win.

The range is still a huge +ve for logi, meaning less skill is needed by the DPS ships.

Reducing the effect of remote reps more (including making the ships less survivable) would require more skill in a fleet overall, so it comes down to superior piloting, not more logi than the other side.

So while this suggestion would be great for my personal play style, I think it’s opposite to what would benefit the game.

interesting. i wasnt trying to go for “more” healing to be honest. the intent was more to follow the roaming fleets and be there. if there is only 1 logi pilot available, now they could go and stay alive.

But how do you control that?

If a ship is a great solo logi, there’s a good likelihood that it becomes even better in numbers and fleets will use the best option available.

So strengthening the survivability for solo allows fleets to leverage off that strength even more, as the logi will need to spend less time keeping itself alive.

Logi is sadly cancer in this game. It forces one of two types of encounters:

  1. Alpha fleets that just volley ships off and not give time for logi to rep
  2. Logistics “arms races”. The team with the most logistics wins. Ships fly with big buffers, so that their logistics has time to rep them up.

I love the concept of logistics… but in practice, I’d love to see them just… go away. Replace logistics with more ewar (more of the same ewar we already have).

I have also been a goto logi pilot, so much so that i would often solo logi.

I have experimented with fits a lot and its not impossible to get an exeq that runs three reps and have its own active armour rep and prop mod cap stable. You don’t take much dps because in small gangs you wont be near the fight.

A lot of what you describe sounds like an orca though. Not joking. Battle orcas are pretty bad ass.

Probably one of my bad ideas, but what would happen if we would introduce something like the damage mitigation on the citadels: limit how much remote assistance the ships can receive.

I have lots of bad ideas too. Rather than a logistics cap, I’d like to see a diminishing returns system. Something like “for every 50% of the ship’s buffer restored, reps become 33% less effective, over a 10 second window”. Would apply to remote reps only.

While we’re at it I would love to see a DPS cap of 40% of the ship’s HP (over a 5 second timeframe) implemented as well. Means that under a constant barrage of fire with no logistics, the fastest a ship could poof would be 12.5 seconds.

Thus logistics remains an incredible force multiplier, however it rapidly becomes less useful. The capped DPS means that ships won’t just evaporate.

Has the added benefit of saying ■■■■ you to alpha fleets… which have exactly zero entertainment value. Has the drawback of completely screwing gank tactics, which CCP did say they want in the game. Then again, are ganks really all that “fun”? I refer both to freighter ganks in HS and also to blops ganks elsewhere.

all good points. we could prohibit incoming reps and make it a self rep only.
how would that play into lore or reality?

That would invalidate literally years of player training (by removing logistics from the game). It would also make players hugely risk averse knowing that their shinys can go pop and there’s literally nothing they can do to stop it.

While I find remote armor reps to be a major stretch (even by eve logic standards), remote shield reps do seem quite feasible.

This seems similar to the normal stacking penalty. I think this would be better than a simple logi-cap actually, we don’t have to spend time figuring out what the cap should be based on, and how to apply to different sizes and hulls.

Similar, yes. Gives the logistics the freedom to rep through a boatload of damage on a target very quickly and not feel that “well what the ■■■■ am I even here for” feeling. Plus a skilled logistics pilot would recognize their reps were diminished and tab over to a different target, returning to the original target later if it was still in need.

T2 Logistics are unbalanced, I say nerf their signature radius to make it comparable with other cruisers and remove their fitting bonus to large remote assistance modules and it would probably fix all their problems. A new type of T2 Battleship or Battlecruiser could be introduced that would have both advantages (more slots and bigger capacitor pool) and disadvantages over Logistics Cruisers, such as higher signature radius, poor agility and lower scan resolution.

This would be good - CCP recently did something similar with certain missile bonuses, and I think it was a positive improvement.

This would not be good. Logistics needs to lock and rep reactively (which means they need to lock faster than average in order to rep before their target is dead), which means they’d be forced into fitting at least one sebo. The sebo has plenty of other uses, but being forced to fit a module is counter to intended design.

Not necessarily with a battleship fleet. Take a look at the orca or soe bs that i can never remember the name of.

The Nestor. Their unmodified scan res puts the average lock on another battleship at 6. 10 battleships doing 1k DPS (feels like a decent middle ground) puts said remote rep recipient 60k EHP in the hole before reps even start.

15 battleships and now you’re looking at 90k EHP in the hole.

Granted it can throw a huge amount of reps out, but that feels very risky to me.

1k isn’t really a middle ground. An all V Mach with auto-cannon need 4 Gyro to get to 1k and that’s only withing it’s rather short optimal range. You need 2 mag stab on a blaster Vindicator with navy ammo which is again super short range only.

Logi locking time is moot at long range. It’ll either be alpha strikes that blap you and all the faxes in the world wouldn’t save you, or it will be sub-critical sniping damage, where reps have more than enough time anyways.

Brawling, on the other hand, has no option but to be melty, and if they want to get melty with you, they get melty.

Lots of brawling doctrines out there that are 1500+ dps (blaster megathron for example). Of course they have to get in close enough to apply, but that’s what warping to tackle is for :slight_smile:

3 mag stab + 3 DDA void in blaster + ogre is not 1500 DPS. I repeat, your number are not middle ground.

I lied, 1300 dps. 1400 with heat, which, you can bet I’ll be heating when we’re killing the nestors! Not my fit, I think I’d probably tweak it a bit from this but as a POC it works.

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