Surgical Strike – Coming 15 April

This patch is a significant buff to kiting ships, cheap mass fleet doctrines, and suicide gankers.

This patch only slightly nerfs Muninns optimal range. Doesn’t do anything for their alpha output (relative to enemy tank) or survivability.

This patch heavily nerfs any other fleet comp that isn’t a Muninn, expensive 1+ bil doctrines, PVE, active tank PVP, empire hauling/PVE/Mining, and much more.

This is an atrocious change, that has far reaching implications that you clearly aren’t thinking about.

What on earth are you thinking?

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don’t think so, RAT 's will do more damage due to the loss of resistance on player ships.

chances of not surviving suicide gankers or gate campers will increase.

not a win win situation for PVP’er or PVE’er, only for the campers.

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In my opinion, from a prospective of a new player, the game is going to be even harder. You are going to have to fly more expensive ships to make your first isk, and you will be a lot more vulnerable while doing pve. “This will promote people joinin corps and playing together” yeh, but there are people who just want to play solo, and this is not going to help the game.

The 20% resistance reduction is… disappointing. They wanted to nerf capital ships so they nerf all ships EHP? That doesnt make any sense, literally. Plus, they not only reduced the survivability of ships, they also increased T2 ammo damage, which means its easier to die and easier to kill. Is there any other change to balance these nerfs? Nope, they just throw that out and expect it to work.

Lets talk about the capital nerf, they reduced 20% all resistances plus they reduced bonuses to XL plates and shield extenders for Supers to 200% and for titans to 300%!!! Let me show you:
(Tested by a friend in SISI) A normal titan fit:
Before the patch: EHP 33.720.000 (Armor resistances: 86% 81%, 81%, 84%).
After the patch: EHP 21.428.200 (Armor resistances: 82% 76% 76% 76%).
Do you really think this is “balance”???
After the patch a Titan will die to a couple of supers, A F***** TITAN. They should just change its name, its not a titan anymore.
And lets not forget about the other Super change, their fighters. So they wanted to nerf capital ships and give Supers a “role” so they reduce their EHP but they give them +6000 DPS??? (+1 heavy squadron) That doesnt make any sense.

What they should have done, in my honest opinion is: reduce 20% resistance ONLY for capital ships (remove the stupid nerf to XL plates and extenders) and if they really want to add that extra damge to T2 ammo, just remove T2 guns from alpha accounts. If they dont do this people are just going to train hundreds of alpha catalyst pilots with t2 and are going to gank everything in high sec/null sec.
Before this patch a 2 Billion isk carrier could “fight” and hope to survive like 10-15 bombers (which cost ±80 million each), now all people need to destroy a capital ships is more crappy ships, with a lot of guns and no mechanics at all. Just brawl like monkeys and there you go, you killed one of the “hardest to get into” ships in the game…? That doesnt make sense to me.

Anyway, there are a few good changes in this upcoming patch. One of them is the removing of support fighters from supers. Thanks to this now carriers will finally have a role in large pvp battles and wont be used just for ratting. Limiting the capital capacitor booster to 1 per ship is also a really good way to nerf capitals, but this plus the resistance nerf plus the ehp nerf is just too much… The other good change is the EHP and signature bonus to battleships (they really needed that).

They claim they dont want people to log in, rat, or mine, make their isk and log off, but EVE is about playing the way you want. This is no longer an option.
EVE Online cant afford to make these ridiculous changes from one week to another and expect everyone to keep playing, most of the player base are adults, if they dont like what they see, they are just going to change game and move on. And with 30k players active every day you need to be REALLY CAREFUL with changing mechanics (im not talking about nerfing specific ships/modules, they are going to change a lot of important aspects of the game in just one patch!!!).
This update will reduce the amount of new players who stick into the game and will increase the amount of veteran players who will leave the game, and that is a really bad move from CCP.

19 Likes

This thread sure is interesting! Clearly there are two camps, both of which have some good points they are making. Personally, I reckon this development won’t change all that much to the ganking thing in Eve, ships will die faster, so maybe there will be a slight uptick in number of deaths.

However, I do think ganking is a problem in Eve. Especially for keeping players. And its not just going to disappear. The rewards for ganking are great, loads of loot and close to zero risk. I haven’t really come across any equivalent rewards for taking out gankers/criminals (yeah, sure an occasional bounty). May be worthwhile looking into something like that. At present, other than getting to not lose your loot, I don’t see much use in cleaning out ganging squads. Alternatively, additional losses when you are killed with a criminal status could help. Just for some balance.

Some consideration for the noob players, who are often Alpha (perhaps first investigating before moving to Omega) would be good. As an Alpha player, I’m pretty hesitant to spend $$ on a game where my stuff is just going to be taken by some other fellow in a gank group (and I speak from good experience). Basically the moment you move on from having just completed the training to any form of challenge (low sec for example), you can count on being ganked. Sure, this is part of the game, but real discouraging for new players - especially solo players.

Anyhow, just a couple of thoughts. Player retention would probably be a good thing, but then again it might damage that unique part of Eve in which it is a microcosm of a society where people don’t really care too much about the next person and there aren’t really any rules. Kindof like a political system based on anarchy.

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You seem to be under the impression that with this change CCP has somehow removed the ability to play solo PVE. This is simply not the case, so you’re getting angry for no good reason.

You may have to change your fit/s, you may need to use a different ship or ships, but you will still be able to do PVE activities solo.

Regards,
Cypr3ss.

2 Likes

Where did they claim this? Literally nothing in this update is preventing you from logging in, then mining or ratting and logging off.

Jeebus, the sky is falling, the SKY is FALLING!!

:expressionless:

You seem to be… confused… about ganking, if you’re ganking (killing things in high sec that aren’t under a war-dec) then you will lose your ship. You only get loot if you have a friend/alt able to fly in and ‘scoop the wreck’ from the ship you have ganked and then any loot you get is entirely dependent on the ‘loot fairy’ being in a good mood. The rewards you get for taking out gankers/criminals are exactly equilivent to what you could potentially get by ganking, it all depends on how the ship is fit and what drops (and what you’re able to collect after it drops).

Oh and welcome to our community.

Regards,
Cypr3ss.

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Removal of Support fFighter Tubes, does this also effect the Light Fighters ???

They didnt say that specifically, but thats what they want to do. They want more active playing. You dont need to be a genious to understand that…

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than it is the right way to nerf the ships, which requires the most player input … the should change droneboats first if the dont want afk ratting in my opinion …

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Yes there are certain fits that excel in solo/small gang meta because of their ability to local tank, and there are others that excel in large numbers. We don’t need to nerf the solo meta we need to nerf the blob, ancillary reps are only used by solo pilots and small gangs with no logi - is this a playstyle we want to see nerfed?

Again hull tanking is used by solo/no logi so lets not be too quick to nerf it until we’re sure it needs to be nerfed.

as things stand Void and Rage are already must have, but close range t2 projectile ammo is terrible and conflag is just meh. i mean conflag has more dps but the cap and tracking drawbacks mean it’s almost always better to go with navy multi in pvp and t1 crystals for structure grinding and some pve because they never burn out.

4 Likes

Well that’s certainly not an issue you need to concern yourself with… being a genius that is. PS, undocking and ratting or mining is being active. If you fail to see this then there’s little hope for you.

Regards,
Cypr3ss.

Every supercarrier after 15th april 2020 will be only launch Heavy fighters, 4 tubes. No lights, no support anymore.

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Yeah good point. I’d rather a buff to application on the short t2 ammo than a raw damage bump. I’ve never really understood why the ammo that has a shorter range is harder to hit with.

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Whould would have thunk. Another boon to gankers.

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The tricky thing about ganking, is that by definition, if you are being ganked you have no chance to survive, make your time. The gankers don’t really risk anything.

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In regards to the 20% reduction to resist module effectiveness, this is essentially compensation skills at level 5 going to 0. I would consider that this, in conjunction with the short range dps buff, may make frigate / destroyer pvp even faster and thus harder to get into outside of larger fleets, solo and small gang are already difficult to learn as a new player.

Personal Suggestion Instead:

  • Shield and Armor Resistance Compensation Skills no Longer Affect Capital Ships

  • or -

  • If this negatively impacts small ship PVP (as I have considered above), make the resistance compensation skill have a bonus effect for small ships.

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nobody uses resist mods in frig/destroyer pvp so i wouldn’t worry

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You do know that the shield compensation skill doesn’t affect invulns/hardeners anyway right? Only passive modules

“Also buffing suicide ganking could make highsec the most dangerous place on the map.”

Because people willingly make themselves targets in highsec. It is easy to fit enough tank to deter most gankers because gankers target haulers many jumps ahead of the gank spot so all you need to do is make your ships a bit less flashy with a bit more tank. It is plenty easy to make a firend that can also slingshot your haulers and freighters in highsec which severely limits a ganker chain’s ability to scan the hauler down to see if they are worth the loss of ships to gank. I have never lost a hauler to a high sec gank and I have slung shot plenty of corpmate haulers and freighters 25+ jumps to Jita with absoutely no problem. Or the easiest of them all…contract one of the professional haulers and do some more pve while someone else does the grunt work and then clone jump to Jita for 24 hours to sell your goods.

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It’s not.
It’s easy to fit enough tank to make them shoot the other guy, but it’s not easy to fit enough tank to actually make it not worth their time ganking you. A T1 hauler filled with Trit is actually gank worthy even if tanked if I remember the maths.

2 Likes