Thukker Tribe Ship Tree

(Shara Kusomi) #1

I saw someone mention an idea for a Thukker’s ship tree but they didn’t really flesh out their idea so I fleshed it out. I focused on defining qualities of the ships and tree itself rather than all of the ship stats

Favor projectile turrets and missiles. Favor speed,lower Sig radius and firepower over survivability. Favor explosive damage.Favor Target painters and sensor linkings. High slots have maximum amount of turret and launcher slots according their high slots. Lvl 4 skill required

Frigs: lvl 4 frig
Cruisers: lvl 4 cruiser
Ecm Cruisers: lvl 4 cruiser with lvl 4 sensor linking and target painting skills
Battleships: lvl 4 battleship

Thukker Tribe Frigate
Traits: 10% tracking speed,10% falloff,5% optimal range,15% missile velocity and 10% explosive missile and projectile dmg
250 hull,250 hull, 250 shield,5 sig radius and 440 max speed

Thukker Tribe Cruiser
Traits: Medium projectile 10% fire rate, 15% falloff,7.5% optimal range. 10% bonus fire rate to Rapid lights,assault heavies,heavies 20% velocity and 15% explosive missile and projectile damage.
1200 hull, 1200 armor, 1400 shield,90 sig radius and 300 max speed

Thukker Tribe Cruiser Disruption Cruiser
Traits:5% target painter effectiveness,+15% strength to sensor link effects, +15% optimal range and +25% effectiveness falloff range of sensor links and
(role bonus) when a ship is sensor linked they have +50% sensor dampening resistance and +20% to afterburner and mwd speed increase,-25% prop mod activation cost, -25% sig radius from mwd’s
1200 hull,1200 armor,1300 shield 100 sig radius and 250 max speed

Thukker Tribe Battleship: 10% fire rate,10% falloff and optimal range to large projectile turrets and 10% fire rate,7.5% velocity to rapid heavies, cruise and torpedos and 20% explosive missile and projectile dmg.
6000 hull, 6000 armor,6500 shield,300 sig radius and 135 max speed

(Do Little) #2

I’m not sure we need more ships that are simply minor variations on ships we already have. On the other hand, Thukker are nomads and a lot of people have requested a ship that is optimized for a nomadic lifestyle over the years.

Think something like an Orca, minus the ore hold and a more appropriate set of bonuses. Maybe the ability to anchor the ship and use it as a small structure while flying ships from the maintenance bay, the ability to fit an improved cloak without speed penalty similar to black ops and a couple points of warp stabilization like DSTs might encourage a few of them to venture into dangerous space.

Not sure how practical it would be but it’s fun to think about and an ideal ship for the Thukker tribe.

(elitatwo) #3

You forgot the 100 heavy fighter bomber launch tubes, the citadel - insta-death-ray, the capital jump drive, the 50 light fighter launch tubes, the 6 rapid ancillary doomsday turrets and the 7 capital gun mounts.

(Dior Ambraelle) #4

I would like to have the Thukker tribe an omni-logi faction personally. The nomadic lifestyle would fit the ability to repair everything on the go, so the would have bonuses to remote shield boosters, remote armor repairers and even remote hull repairers. This last thing would make them really stand out from the crowd.

(Lugh Crow-Slave) #5

if by stand out you mean break eve then yes

(Villiam Kaardanen) #6

some feedback:

  1. if its a faction it means only 1 ship per size (1 frig, 1 cruiser, 1 bs, capitals come later) and 2 racials to pilot

  2. flexibility is already present in the Minmatar Navy ships, they need their own Gimmick to stand out

Minmatar + Caldari is usually the skill requirement for Thukker ship suggestions. both make use of missiles and shield in their doctrines (despite the flexibility of minmatar ships to go armor and having a main preference for projectile turrets). we dont know much about the Thukker actually so we dont know the preference they have regarding weaponry and defenses or combat strats.

the hardest thing to figure out from the Thukker is a gimmick for the ships. the Thukker are space nomads so a possible bonus for salvaging would be present. in fact, i would say that being master salvagers and survivalists in deep space would be the main prominent feature of them rather than combat.

still we cant rule out combat and possibly tank bonuses. the Thukker are meant to endure themselves in a hostile region of space while scrapping whatever they can find so it could be something like this (just an example):

Thukker frigate

-Caldari bonus-> 10% bonus to rocket and light missile max velocity per lvl
-Minmatar bonus -> 5% bonus to rocket and light missile launcher rate of fire per lvl
-role bonus(es?) -> 50% bonus to rocket and light missile damage, 100% bonus to salvager optimal range, 50% reduction in salvager duration

4 highs (2 launchers)
3 mids
3 lows

10-15 m3 dronebay, 10-15 Mbit/s bandwidth.
180-200m3 cargobay

3/4/3 is the general slot layout for faction frigs but seeing that salvagers occupy highs too, i swapped it to 4/3/3. the 50% flat bonus to damage compensates the lack of launchers (gives 3 in total + whatever increase in DPS from the rate of fire bonus + 2-3 drones).

the racial bonuses are typically found in the T1 hulls, very unimaginative i know but if you really want a PvP boat that vomits missiles well, there’s the garmur (or the worm, if you also like OP drones). this is more of a PvE vessel. you could still try i think.

the drones were an extra to help compensate the lack of weaponry, the extra cargo is done to follow on the footsteps of the Astero since its also designed for staying long periods of time in space. as for the role bonuses, bigger range and faster cycles mean the ship can clear wrecks very fast, something needed when you cannot stay too much time due to the danger.

the basic idea of the vessel is that it has selectable damage type to adjust to the region it lives while also sporting the tools to quickly harvest from wrecks before moving out without having to swap in a mobile depot (unless you want to add some explo stuff like relic/data analyzers, but y tho?)

its an example anyways.

(Arthur Aihaken) #7

Still pining for that Minmatar-Caldari Pirate matchup, heh? There’s only one for projectiles in the Pirate lineup but two already for missiles, so chances are a Thukker Faction would be projectiles.

The problem is that the Machariel already does it quite well so you’d need something unique. Maybe just give it a really high damage bonus so it has a nutty alpha to justify running artillery. Probably a target painter bonus, athough I’m not sure that would be needed with artillery.

The more I think about it the more it makes sense why we won’t have a Minmatar-Caldari Faction.

(Erethond) #8

Actually, Caldari also do railgun sniping quite well, so an artillery sniper could work well for a Minmatar-Caldari faction. But I’m not sure it’s very Thukker like…

(Villiam Kaardanen) #9

Thukker is mainly a minmatar faction, that’s the issue. a completely new faction that focuses on the potential of caldari gunnery in contrast to the usual missile doctrine is a nice prospect however. and with minmatar to booth? i could totally see something lgoing on there, something like this:

that other CalMin faction frigate:

caldari bonus -> 10% bonus to small hibrid turret optimal range per lvl
minmatar bonus -> 5% bonus to Microwarpdrive velocity per lvl
role bonus -> 100% bonus to small hibrid turret damage, 37,5% bonus to small hibrid turret tracking

3/4/3 (typical faction frig layout, 2 turrets)

something has to be given as unique gimmick, so i added that MWD velocity bonus. which i think, it doesnt exist in any ship in the game. could be a start, to compensate the ship could have typical caldari speeds (quite slow). allthought im not sure if the tracking bonuses would help rail in anyway taking in account the horrile tracking. perhaps changing to an extra optimal range bonus like with the cormorant.

other alternatives for Caldari gun doctrine could be EoM (Amarr hulls technically, but they use hybrids, kinda like Gallente but no drones everywhere, it would need a gimmick of its own, like, capless hybrids or something like that).

Minmatar could get Ammatar, heavy armored projectile platforms which go in contrast to the typical minmatar doctrine of going fast or web people to slow them down.

(Dior Ambraelle) #10

Hull reps don’t need to be efficient. We could give cycle time and cap reduction to remote shield and armor, but only cycle time to remote hull. Give the ships a relatively small capacitor, and I think they will be fine.

(Daichi Yamato) #11

Thukker ships are already in the tech 2 line up for minmatar.

The Nomad ffs…

(Villiam Kaardanen) #12

Thukker mix is only one corp inside the tribe. much like how Khannid Innovations is one corp inside the kingdom. there’s space to put faction ships there. its just that some corps inside them are dedicated to R&D of T2 stuff for the empires.

(Lugh Crow-Slave) #13

Thukker would never be caldari they have no ties if they were added it would be another gal/ minm considering ites the gallente that fund them

(elitatwo) #14

You mean the kingdom that is guarded by the Royal Khanid Navy?

Now which Curse and Damnation would be Khanid - oh oops…

(Sebat Hadah) #15

So basically minmatar reloaded?

(Dior Ambraelle) #16

Can you explain Sansha’s connection to Caldari? Aren’t they supposed to be a completely independent faction?
How about SOE’s connection to Amarr? They have negative standings if I remember right.

Isn’t this true for pirate faction balance too?

(Lugh Crow-Slave) #17

umm Sansha Kuvakei? you know the big head honcho?

amarr are the largest donating faction to the SOE. Amarr has negative standings to the SOE because the SOE aids many escaped slaves.

not if they can just write in a new faction that fits better.

also this isn’t really a balance issue as there aren’t really any roles left unfilled. its mostly just an OCD parity issue

(Dior Ambraelle) #18

By Sansha, I meant the faction, not the person. Isn’t Sansha’s Nation supposed to be the enemy of everyone, an independent faction of it’s own, that already was defeated once? Not to mention the quite specific AB speed bonus from the Caldari side, that would much more fit the Minmatar style instead.
Also, why does Amarr support SOE, if they are directly working against them?

(Villiam Kaardanen) #19

not everything in the game has a lore relation. as for the questions.

Sansha didnt only take Caldari citizens with him, he was basically trying to found its own empire (much like how Sebastien Moreau did in Immensea) with people coming from all corners of the cluster at the time.

Sansha’s Nation may have had a mainly Caldari (and probably Amarr due to close relations between both empires) but they also must have gotten people from Gallente and Minmatar origin. this may help to explain the way their ships are designed. you have to remember that the racial bonuses and stuff like that are for gameplay purposes, the lore is more intrincate than that.

Sansha’s Nation in theory is its own thing, they took the best out of the people that joined the society so this is reflected in the design of their ships. heavy shielding from Caldari doctrines, energy weapons taken from the Amarr members, improvements in afterburner bonuses may have been a suggestion by members arrived from Minmatar society.

same happens for SoE. they are a religious humanitarian group, religion is usually Amarrian stuff mostly. in addition, they are a contrary to SoCT which is a Jovian group and as such looked closely by Amarr intelligence too so having some kind of contact with the space nuns even if their beliefs differ a bit from the main Amarrian religion is logical. besides they also dive in R&D so it may be beneficial to the empire to get any discovery first before all the other factions.

but im gonna say it again, lore =/= gameplay mechanics 90% of the time.

(Lugh Crow-Slave) #20


and a lot of caldari ships favor ABs at least in the past because they didn’t have the PG to run good tank and MWD.

amarr still helps SOE because it puts them on moral high ground. iirc SOE was also started by amarr