Looking at studies of volcanic activity and the use nuclear weapons the temperature effects would be obvious within a week or so. A summer temperature drop of 20 degrees C on average. It will depend on how much energy is being absorbed by the transmutation process.
But planets don’t have summers, only hemispheres do. And isn’t heat retention also impacted by the strength of the stellar wind? Less incoming energy, less complete enveloping of the planet’s magnetic field, more radiation of heat at the points where it’s not coming in.
Sadly my simulations are not that exact, they are meant to simulate millions of years at a solar system scale, where volcanic activities is not really important.
I know those limits, but I also wanted to see in which ways the solar manipulations of the triglavians could impact the various planets.
Because if I do believe that a “simple” drop in luminosity is not a long term problem (after all, if we can colonize barren, ice, lava or even gas planets, it’s not impossible to adapt a planet in a few months.
If the triglavian transmuter change the mass of the stars, then we could face system wide catastrophic events.
THAT is calculated in my simulation tho.
(on a side note, the “seasons” are hemisphere-bound only when there is a significant inclination of the planet’s axis)
While my simulations clearly have their limits, hence why I don’t already have posted some results, they also seem good enough to be a good starting point to evaluate the consequences of the possible manipulations the triglavians are doing to the stars.
And planets like Vale VI who get most of their energy from tidal tension, the dimming of the stars seem to impact within months, not days.
I also want to point out that if we speak of local climats, then yes, indeed, changes would happen in a few weeks, but if we are speaking about life supporting capability of a planets, a few degree don’t change much, after all, on my home planets there is some days where there is more than 20°C of difference between a day and the next one, without killing everyone.
I personally, am focused on the life support of the planet, not local biome.
I’m no climatologist, so I stick to my own field and do make warnings when getting out of it.
EDIT:: or at least try to do so…
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A consideration from the other side of the line here; a possibility that I have been entertaining is that each of these systems is effectively being administrated by different Clades. We know, generally speaking, the preferred areas of expertise of the Clades so it may make a degree of sense to conclude that high population worlds would fall under the realm of the Veles, while industrial planets could be under the direction of Perun or Svarog.
Additionally, I think that the point regarding slavery is a rather fascinating one that I hadn’t considered. It may attribute to the reason why Amarr space seems to hold the majority of interest. The Collective appears to have both vast archives of knowledge and a highly sophisticated understanding of human social/civilization scale development, given their comments in the past when they were first learning about the Empires in New Eden.
The tricky part about the Collective is the notion that it has only one or two primary objectives. Why not three? Everything in the culture is based on three, from their ships, to their identities. In light of that hypothesis, it could be argued that their capture of both mining worlds and populated worlds folds into the notion of them freeing slaves (dominance arrangement, though ‘freedom’ may well look quite different to a Triglavian than what is commonly understood), and finally embarks into what I suspect is the final objective: the formation of a new domain within our spatial dimension.
To do this would require local resources, local population, and local support. Vale’s people have been unhindered from all my studying of the system thus far since the occupation by the Collective. If the slaves are indeed being liberated by the Collective, that could be another piece of this ideological puzzle. Conversion is -always- a superior way to wage war than direct confrontation, and if their objectives are limited to the establishment of key strongholds, then their battleplan makes sense.
Add to this, they don’t even need stargates as we understand them to travel. They could choose to dismantle or disable the existing stargates and form their own bastion using their portals, and no one outside of a fully fledged Capital fleet could ever hope to reach them in any appreciable amount of time.
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We can colonize them with very small populations, sure. We can’t introduce the full-scale planet-wide biosphere of quadrillions of organisms that the temperate worlds in question currently host.
‘Could’?
System-wide gravitational interactions would change. At the very least, planets would move outward, resulting in even more reduction in temperature. Asteroid belts would shift in response to the changing gravitational pattern of the system. Cometary orbits would be impacted. And on and on, with each of those changes impacting each of the others.
Right, but that planet’s population is already set up for surviving that kind of variation. A daily 20 kelvin difference isn’t exactly ‘let’s all run around outside in shorts all the time’ levels of comfortable (and I kind of don’t think that’s a 20 kelvin fluctuation in planetary average temp, either). What kind of world are you talking about? What population size does it support?
These planets are temperate worlds, supporting billions of human beings on each of them. Any temperate world with that level of population is relying largely on local food production, which means local ecosystems that have to remain relatively stable. When they destabilize, food production quickly breaks down, and generally speaking, planets don’t maintain food stockpiles that will keep their entire population alive for months on end.
I’m not casting aspersions on your research, I’m sure you’ve done your due diligence on the modeling. However, other people will draw conclusions about the total ecological, economic, and public health impact of the situation based solely on your research. And they’ll be incredibly wrong to do so. I’m simply pointing that out, and illustrating why, in advance… in the hopes that maybe it will keep them from pushing their erroneous, pollyannaesque image of how wonderful everything will be and why nobody living on those worlds should fear a doomsday scenario.
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oh I agree and didn’t said otherwise, but again, there is a major difference between a dozen years span for a planet to leave the habitable zone and a span of one or two that could endup in planet collision.
Sorry If if that “could” seemed out of place… I’m not trying to increase or decrease the impact of said changes, I personally think the dimming in itself is a traumatic enough event.
I’ll elaborate on temperatures tomorrow, right now I’m afraid that I’m too tired to make sense.
I agree that my example was a local one, not global, I just wanted to point that local changes can sustain a “large” change for a few weeks.
And again, I’m not trying to tell that “everything will be fine”, I simply try to be as objective as I can be.
And I completely agree that they should not base their whole theory on only one source.
On that, I’m off to bed, my wife will otherwise again be mad at me…
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Obviously its on the hemisphere that is receiving summer at the time, but that would factor across the planet. It could be worse, in the case of planetary conditions its normally dust that obscures sunlight. That also retains some heat. If the cause is solar output then heat would also be radiated off the planet.
Amazing how we’re discussing here if there’s even a problem to be worried about. There’s no need to entertain the bloody triangle apologists. Spits. I may not be a scientist but wake up! The stars are black! Stars are not supposed to be black! The problems are clear as day, as clear as days can still be in the affected systems.
While we’re trying to figure out whether 20 or 21 kelvin is the borderline for having a problem or not and the definition of summers, they are out there, making sweet love to our stars and getting away with it. I could take the next week off to clean the fedo crap off the collective hulls of my armada and still spend my time more meaningfully. How does it even get on there, anyway? I don’t have any fedos.
If at all possible I’d like to get back on topic of whatever the hell motivates the thrice-damned heathens and figure out a way to hit them where it hurts, thank you all very much.
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By knowing how long it will take to see effects is important, it can tell you what forces you can deploy, what to expect, where the civilians would take refuge, etc etc.
And to know how things evolve help us prepare the after
Can you call it a victory if the system you liberated are flooded ? get the climates wrecked ?
And if the triglavian already have changed the mass of the stars to alter their gravity, it’s even MORE important to know how much.
Space warfare is urgent, but in the end, if your planets start going wonky, there is no doubt on the end result…
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We need to learn how to prevent more occurrences, not learn how to mitigate an utter disaster when it occurs.
I call it a victory when a star maintains its chastity, not when it is cleaned up after being defiled.
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