Amarr cruiser fit for PVE for alpha (also budget)

Guys I am trying to make a fit for speed running L2 missions, and saving money to possibly buy a battlecruiser for L3 missions. Here is my Omen fit, please give suggestions on how to make it better.

currently I dont like it at all because the tank is so bad and the cap is unstable. plz help me. also I might consider maller and arbitrator as well cuz for now this character is majored in drone skills.

I spent a lot of time researching online about omen fits but none of them look good enough to me, either because the tank is too weak or it uses buffer tank to make the ship very slow.

I also noticed how its very weird that pulse lasers are just inferior to beam lasers, both in damage and range. it is very strange, I don’t know why. Can anyone please explain it to me? Thanks.

and finally is my arbitrator fit which is suppose to be a kiter that is beyond enemy range, so no need for much tank.

The most annoying thing is that their capacitor are all not stable partially because my skill training sucks and I spent 2M skill points on drones only. So should I even train laser skills for medium and large laser turrets? I fear I won’t have enough skill points to make them good.

but on the other hand I think drones are too limited, and prophecy is not really a good drone ship after I simulated it. it’s damage is worse than harbinger. Oracle seems like a really OP sniper battlecruiser but I already have 3.6M skill points, so I am not sure if I can train into large energy turrets with only 1.4M SP.

I am poor and really need to make money to buy my dream ship (omen navy issue), what do I do please help!!

OK, firstly, just posting the screen shot isn’t terribly informative to those who will try to help you. If you save the fit (or just click on the name you gave it) then you’ll see a “copy to clipboard” option and you can post that text here. Then we can actually see what modules you have fitted rather than guessing which of the many modules that “icon of a battery” or whatever represents.

Right, so the meat of the plot.
Level 2 missions are not that challenging for a half competent cruiser fit - any of the three Amarrian cruisers you’ve looked at will do the job. But I suspect there are weaknesses in your understanding and appreciation of the various systems and options. But I can’t understand the fitting because I can’t see any detail there…

The ships all have damage related bonuses that are dependant on your “Amarr Cruiser” skill - the Omen fires faster and uses less capacitor per shot as skill improves, The Maller does more damage and has better armor resistances, the Arbitrator’s drones do more damage (and has better weapon disruption - it’s an e-war support ship really). The difference between Level 1 skill and, say, Level 4 skill is significant.
Likewise, the Medium Energy Turret skill and some of the other supporting turret skills help a lot.
The difference between “minimum to sit in the hull” and “reasonable skills” is a lot - 50% more capability sort of “lot”.

To give you an example: In the Omen below, a reasonable Alpha mission ship, with Multifrequency loaded I get 282dps at 15km compared to your 180dps at 13km. The figures are for firing all weapons - you group the weapons and fire them all together: you are trying to kill something not tickle it into submission.

[Omen, Omen - PVE L2]
Reactive Armor Hardener
Tracking Enhancer II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Medium ACM Compact Armor Repairer
Compact Multispectrum Energized Membrane

Medium Cap Battery II
Cap Recharger II
10MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner

Focused Anode Medium Particle Stream I
Focused Anode Medium Particle Stream I
Focused Anode Medium Particle Stream I
Focused Anode Medium Particle Stream I
Focused Anode Medium Particle Stream I

Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I

Hobgoblin I x5
Multifrequency M x5    Radio M x5    Standard M x5

Capacitor Stability is over rated, you aren’t going to be running two repairers all the time, indeed a lot of level 2 missions will only need a couple of cycles on one repairer during the whole mission if you fly wisely. Likewise, you will use the propulsion module to get to your engagement distance then turn it off. On the upside, cap stability at this point means you don’t spend time worrying about managing a capacitor that you don’t have the experience to not worry about. Hence the fitting above is a bit more cap stable than I’d normally go for in a personal fit.

Pulse lasers are short range weapons with better tracking and more able to hit small targets (frigates). Beam lasers will (unless you have good skills) not do as much damage reliably to small targets. Which is “better” depends on what you are shooting at and at what sort of range you want to engage the target.
Generally the damage from a pulse laser and a beam laser are roughly the same (the above fit with Pulse Lasers and MF gives me 278dps at 7.8km) the trade off is tracking for range.

Fittings: Generally, the Omen is fitted for mobility and range, the Maller is fitted to get in close and hurt people.

Level 3 missions: If you stay with drones, go for a Prophecy. If you focus on turrets go with the Harbinger (which I prefer). Don’t fixate on the Oracle - the large lasers will really struggle against smaller ships and you’ll get plenty of those in missions, and the Oracle has notoriously thin armour. The Oracle will feel like a disappointment and the skills invested will feel wasted.

Hopefully that helps and makes sense. Good luck!

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Oracle isn’t that bad and kills small targets fast…

WHAT YOU NEED is a microwarpdrive/jump drive and stay at 40+km range to have zero issues hitting small targets as they will fly towards you increasing accuracy. it’s about anything closer then 30km where you will start missing to much on frigs

(note in pvp you will never hit frigs alone cause good players know how to traversal)

Oracle is basically a mobile Artillery…great at killing things at a distance with large beam lasers and faster then a big ass battleship, but very vulnerable if caught, scorch pulse might do decent also, but i think beams are better for how the ship is designed (aka distance tanking/sniping)

Pulses have less range and DPS but they make up for it in tracking (meaning they can rotate faster) I would not recommend using an oracle for anything unless you know what you are doing.

If you have 2m in drones then I think going with drones as your main weapon could be a good idea!

And prophecy is great. With drone skills, it can really take a beating while your drones do all the work. But keep an eye on them and call them back if they are getting focused.

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Being unused to non-caldari ships (with the exception maybe of minmatar ones) I’d commit some passive shield tank heretism like

[Arbitrator, Heretism]

Damage Control II
AE-K Compact Drone Damage Amplifier
AE-K Compact Drone Damage Amplifier
AE-K Compact Drone Damage Amplifier
Mark I Compact Power Diagnostic System

Large F-S9 Regolith Compact Shield Extender
Large F-S9 Regolith Compact Shield Extender
Enduring Multispectrum Shield Hardener
100MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner

Arbalest Compact Light Missile Launcher, Scourge Light Missile
Arbalest Compact Light Missile Launcher, Scourge Light Missile
Arbalest Compact Light Missile Launcher, Scourge Light Missile
Drone Link Augmentor I

Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I


Vespa I x5

Has more then 200dps to me with the T1 medium drones, passive repairs 65ehp/s and can go more then 1km/s with the oversized afterburner. The way to use that ship would be to engage the afterburner and then fly semi-uncontrolled [^1] with the rats being unable to catch up on you while your drones kill them. The missile launchers are basically just for the show, all DPS comes from the drones.

If you want to try that, but can’t fit it, try swapping a low slot drone damage thingy for a second power diagnostic, which as a side effect also provides more shield ehp and regeneration on top of powergrid and capacitor, at the expense of losing some drone damage, or try using a ‘compact’ afterburner instead of the ‘enduring’ one [^2]

[^1] it’s extremely unmanouverable when moving fast due to the oversized afterburner, but it’s cap stable and doesn’t bloom your signature or mass like a microwarp would, so the rats have trouble applying damage on you.

[^2] ‘compact’ variants always need less fitting resources, while ‘enduring’ variants need less capacitor when used and ‘restrained’ variants have less negative side effects

Don’t be embarrassed: Shield Arbitrators are definitely a thing. As are Shield Coercers. The Curse can be shield fitted as well. They often aren’t optimal - there are better ships to shield fit, but they do rationally exist. The Coercer is the oddity since it only has the two mid-slots you really would think it was a poor shield ship: but medium extenders can give it a good tank and keep the low slots free for Heat Sinks.

for pve sheild arbitrator is better then armor imo unless you specifically hiting em/therm rats only ever

as it fits drone damage easier i believe.

can’t say for pvp but i imagine armor is better

but if it;s what you fly in a shield fleet then shields?

woah this fit looks just like my fit but almost better in every way… also, should I consider using faction ammo? like imperial navy multifrequency? I think if I go fight faction war, I can buy them from LP shops. but I heard they also randomly break when I use them.

okay got it, I am just worried if I get out of cap, I cant speed run the mission. because right now I am running L2 in a dragoon and just gets bored after it takes 20 min to finish a single mission.

if beam lasers are so good, and does similar dps, why would anyone use pulse? also I heard the tech 2 beam aurora is OP and slicers can shoot up to 40-50km with it. if the tracking is so bad, can a tracking enhancer/computer thing help?

okay I will switch to a harbinger because it looks nicer. thx for your help!

I thought only battleships can fit MJD.

that also sounds great, so as long as I keep range, I dont need to worry about getting hit right?

I simulated the prophecy, but the DPS is similar to what I get on arbitrator, kind of a disappointment.

oh my god an oversized shield tank arbitrator?? I will suffer from no shield skills.

oh ya I know, thank you.

are reactor control better? they do the same thing but I see people use reactor control more on big ships.

can I fit remote armor repairers on the prophecy to heal my drones?

Small hint: most common mistake players make is using multifrequency crystals.

my damage will be trash if I dont use multifrequency, if the dmg is worse than a dragoon then I rather use dragoon.

Not quoting because it’ll become a horribly long post if I do.

However, I’m feeling smug so I’ll make that one quote. Thank-you - that’s experience for you. Skills, yes they are important, but knowledge and experience is something that will also come to you with time.

Yes, I think Navy Crystals are generally worth it - always for combat against another player, sometimes in missions. You’ll get several thousand shots out a crystal before it breaks - there is a “percentage damage” figure that tells you how the crystal is degrading in use. It’s a 15% uplift in damage.
Of course, my opinion is coloured by my relative wealth - 300k per crystal (so 1.5m ISK for a set of five) isn’t a consideration to me, but to a new player that’s a fair wedge of ISK - it may not be worth the investment. A personal decision.

Yes, MF are the “high damage” crystals - though the pulse specialist Conflagration crystals are even more damage (another reason for pulse lasers). Standard are a middling damage, but the lowest capacitor usage - sometimes that is important in a mission to keep you in and killing while needing a lot of other services running.
There’s a phrase around Amarr: Scorch OP. the long range Pulse Laser specialist crystal is exceptionally good for damage at range.

As has been said: Pulse lasers apply damage to smaller faster targets better than Beam lasers do. It’s not all about damage, you have to actually be hitting the target to do damage. This is why ships with big guns have drone bays: they carry light drones to kill frigates that the large weapons struggle against - your drone skills aren’t wasted.
The following compares the “what you see in the fitting window DPS” with the “reality of trying to hit a small ship spiralling in” - same Omen fitting as I’ve already shared, only one is pulse fitted with the comparable pulse lasers. Both are using T1 MF crystals. As you can see - the pulse lasers are hitting the smaller fast moving ship much better.

PYFA is a very useful application for designing and exploring ship fittings.
The “Autocannon Punisher” is a thing. I’m using it as a stand-in for an NPC mission rat to make a point.

Yes, Tracking enhancers - and more effectively, tracking computers - do help significantly. The computer can be scripted for tracking or range or left as a balance of the two.

Oracle and fighting at range: yes, it can be done but remember you are trading range for damage.
A battlecruiser can fit a Medium MJD.

If you are flying Amarrian ships then you’ll not suffer much from poor shield skills - concentrate on armour skills they will give you the best benefit. Shield fitted Amarr hulls are a niche thing that is used when needs must - when that need is comes with experience, but it’s a rare thing. If you are flying an Arbitrator in a fleet it’s because you are doing an e-war role and you’ll want the mid-slots for performing your magic so you’ll be armour fitted and part of an armour fleet (such as a golden fleet doctrine). Doing that support role is huge fun - you’ll know you are getting it right when everyone starts trying to kill you, then things get exciting.

Yes, you can use remote repairers on drones. You aren’t optimised for it and they take a high slot that could be fitted with a weapon. Remember: killing the target also reduces the damage you are taking from that target!
Drones are repaired along with the rest of your ship if you tether to a citadel (free repairs!!).

Yes, as you know, you can run a level 2 mission in a low skill Dragoon but it’ll be slow. An Omen with good skills will be a lot quicker. You need to train skills that increase the damage (and tracking for application) to be able to blat small ships off the field in one or two shots. Ideally before they close range and become a problem - but that’s why that fitting has five light drones.

Good luck and happy hunting.

2 Likes

standard crystals are underrated imo
(plus the yellow lasers matches the golden fleet of the amarr empire! we love golden and yellow stuff!)

although I do love Kador skins + gamma!

wtb laser beam skins

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[Omen, *lvl 2 sansha rats]
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Medium Armor Repairer II
Reactive Armor Hardener
Compact EM Energized Membrane
Compact Thermal Energized Membrane

10MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner
Large Compact Pb-Acid Cap Battery
Cap Recharger II

Focused Modulated Medium Energy Beam I
Focused Modulated Medium Energy Beam I
Focused Modulated Medium Energy Beam I
Focused Modulated Medium Energy Beam I
Focused Modulated Medium Energy Beam I

Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Semiconductor Memory Cell I

Imperial Navy Gamma M x10

beams track worse than pulse, use them until you get T2 and can use scorch. otherwise you’ll have to run down the npc to get in range. mission rats deal two primary damage types so using correct resists is very helpful to tanking. you can omni tank so you don’t have to change your fit, but probably need better skills before you can do that. navy crystals are expensive but one set of gamma will give you better range, cap-use, and damage over T1 multi-specs.
with my alpha skills this fit is stable while coasting, and over 8 minutes with everything running. good luck

Okay got it, super super informative post, literally answered all my questions! thank you so much! :+1:

but their dps is really like so bad. like 50% less than multifrequency. I can do that much dps with drones in dragoon while having longer range.

OMG how do u have enough fitting to oversize a cap battery?!! and you are usingg beam lasers which uses even more fitting.

okay I will buy those then, thanks.

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Applied dps > raw simulation dps

blasters can get some of the highest dps in the game…but require you to be on top of your target and if a small target WEBED.

other factors also matter like cap as maybe you can and want to run multifreq for awhile but swap to standard as you recharge cap so you don’t go empty repping

Just wanna say, thanks to everyone who’s posted on this thread. thanks so much! Now I feel settled and I can begin to make some isk. I hope one day I can in some way repay all these kindness.

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