I apologize because I am not familiar. Capsuleers are augmented entities. It makes sense. But how can we satisfy singleton format? There should only be one singleton instance, isn’t it true?
Cybernetic adaptation eh? That could be potentially promising.
Also, assuming these exploratory operations are the same operations where they “failed to establish active locus” of the Drifters, we might have an interesting development.
Unless these singleton format ranges are used to identify capsuleers that have "proven themselves within the flow of Vyraj’. My initial assumption when seeing “singleton format” was the mathematical use of the term “singleton”, but that probably can’t be right.
1 Like
the key word there is “singleton format ranges” IE a range of discreet unique entities. I assume this is to differentiate us from the sansha, who are also augmented human entities, but do not conform to a singleton format.
3 Likes
That makes sense, given the text in the Svarog log.
Naruhodo. Thank you for explaining. Singleton class is data manager for collection of augmented human. The entities are not singleton. Interesting to acquire the interface for the data manager, yes?
I see, yes. I only scrolled passed the section titles. There is one list which distinguishes capsuleers. Then there is everything else, and everything else includes other augmented entities and hivemind.
A few hours late to the party here, but my initial thoughts on what each of these mean are below. We’ve noticed that the Triglavians use archaic and odd words in place of common ones, but their sentences are usually sensible apart from that. Figuring out what words they’re trying to use can help pick apart the meaning of the message. Cross-referencing with known historical records and chronicled stories should help us figure out what they’re talking about.
“exploration operations have failed to establish active locus for Jove Empire of the Chamber of Tyrant”
They’ve been unable to find the wormhole system that the Drifters are basing out of. We know the Drifters (and by extension the Sleepers) are Jove-descended and their use of Tyrannos in their names indicate they’re from the Second Jove Empire united under one of the Tyrants. I think this confirms what I thought before, that the Sleepers are descended from one of the Jove cryo-motherships that packed up and left Curse, marking the end of the Second Jove Empire.
stability of local spatio-temporal environment diverges from archive reference data pertaining to !query++encode|Jovian expansionist polity iter.4.? ?recode++process!
The stability of the wormhole network doesn’t correspond to the archive reference they have from the last Jovian empire they had contact with. This hints again that the Triglavians had dealings with the Sleeper empire in Anoikis, and confirms that the wormhole network used to be stable. But we know that, the Seylinn disaster knocked the wormhole system off whack and that’s why we even found Anoikis to begin with.
procedures for continued exploration and surveillance under contemplation
They’re devising new plans for finding the Drifter base systems. It’s possible that observing capsuleers will lead them there as we have found those systems, or they could find the Jove listening posts and unidentified wormholes in those systems if they enter New Eden. I think when they eventually find the Drifter systems, they’ll head in to kick their asses and this will be the moment that capsuleers will have to “prove the direction of their flow” (i.e. pick a side).
augmented human entities within singleton format ranges have demonstrated highly variable motivational imperatives
Capsuleers entering abyssal deadspace in solo ships (cruisers) have shown highly variable motivational imperitives for exploring the area. This is likely an observation that some of us head to the Proving Ground arena they’ve presented, some destroy structures in the abyss for materials, and some are hunting for mutaplasmids and blueprints. It may also be an observation about the huge variety of ships and strategies we employ in abyssal deadspace.
cybernetic adaptation for personality-level command identity submergence should be analyzed for conformity
This is most likely referring specifically to transcranial microcontrollers, the technology that Sansha’s Nation uses to take control of people’s bodies (submerge the personality-level command identity). They could be either be saying that they should be analysed to see if they can be made to conform (similar to the message about the Rogue Drones from the billboard hack video), or they could be saying that they should analyse Sansha to see if they’re all the same or if someone is in charge.
There’s a huge knowledge gap here about what Sansha has been up to in the background all these years and who or what is directing their actions now. The last big thing I think we heard was when footage was recorded of Sansha forces capturing the Prosper Vault station in the Jove home regions. It seems the Triglavians have had some contact with Sansha’s Nation, and I personally think it may have been Sansha that found their way into Abyssal Deadspace in the first place using Jove tech. Hopefully we get more clarity on this in future messages, we need fresh intel on Sansha’s Nation badly.
exploratory operations planning will incorporate contingencies for sampling and analysis of augmented human entities
So they’re going to start sampling and analysing capsuleers. Their exploratory operations planning is likely reference back (same wording) to the plan to find the Drifter systems. The way this is worded makes me think they’re talking about analysing us to see if we will interfere with their plans to attack the Drifters. This may be entirely what the Triglavian Proving Ground is all about, setting out a prize like a trap to force us to duke it out so they can see if we might pose a threat to their plans.
human augmented entities in non-singleton formats have met diagnostic threshold in multi-variate
dimensions triggering countervailing imperatives
The number of capsuleers entering Abyssal Deadspace in groups (the three-frigate configuration) has hit a certain threshold where it’s become a problem, and they will now begin countering the threat with equal force. The “multi-variate dimensions” may just be referring to the wide variety of different setups and co-operative strategies that are being used.
I think they’re basically saying here that they’ve observed us co-operating in groups of frigates and are now working on counteracting that with their own equal strategies. We should keep a close eye on the Triglavian ships in the near future to see if they start using our own strategies against us.
archived comparison profile !query++encode|Jovian-Triglavian satellite polity ident:JT(N?)BZx12t(7?) cat:hybrid subcat:hivemind iter.1.2.? |recode++process!
Fascinating! Jovian-Triglavian satellite polity would likely mean a small secondary (satellite) government (polity), so I would guess it’s referring to some form of co-operative organisational body that existed between the Jovian and Triglavian nations at one time.
I think this lends credibility to my theory that the Triglavian Collective could be the remnants of the Talocan empire, who had extensive dealings with the Sleepers in Anoikis but evacuated at one point. They’re known to have been masters of spatial manipulation technology, and may have used that to flee from either some impending disaster or conflict with the Sleepers themselves.
Given the next message, this one would seem to be about Rogue Drones as they are part of a hive mind. That’s bloody interesting, because it hints the Rogue Drones were known to the Jovian empire at some point. We always thought that they were a Gallente experiment gone wrong, but they (we) may not have been the first to make that mistake. We know the Sleepers use AI-control in their ships so it’s not a stretch to think Rogue Drones are a recurring emergent intelligence in any advanced enough society.
effective action for elimination of hivemind corruption should not be hindered by imperative for further sampling
So the Triglavians are trying to eliminate some kind of corruption from the Rogue Drone hive mind, which makes sense based on their billboard message that they “must conform” and hints that the Triglavian Collective is still split on this issue and pursuing two avenues: Sampling rogue drones for study, while at the same time trying to eliminate the “hivemind corruption” and get them under control.
This is interesting. I think there are still questions about whether there’s a single emergent intelligence controlling the rogue drone hive mind, and we know some rogue drones have been collecting Isogen-5 in caches for some reason. The corruption referred to could be an unknown entity in control of the rogue drone hive mind, we just don’t have enough information at this point except to know that the Triglavian Collective sees them as a problem.
.
Just some thoughts as I read through those. It still largely fits the theories I’ve written about before, and I think the overriding message here is that the massive Triglavian ship under construction is going to be used to go to war with the Drifters, who have similarly impressive sizes of structures in their home systems. If a battle of this kind does take place, I imagine that some capsuleers would choose to side with the Triglavian Collective over the Drifter menace and some may just try to interfere for personal profit. It seems the collective is concerned about these possibilities.
4 Likes
Your analysis was diligent, I myself cling to some irrational hope that the Triglavians are the Talocan because after all “T” and come on just how many bloody precursor nemesis civlizations can there be?
But there is no evidence of the connection, while our encounters with Talocan remnants in wormhole space provides a fair bit of evidence that it is not true.
The Triglavians are very conspicuously all about three. Three three three. They go so far as to call themselves the Three Glaives. While the Talocan Disruption Tower does bear some resemblance to Triglavian towers, it very prominently does not adhere to the rule of three:
Neither do:
Talocan Reactor Spire
Talocan Extraction Silo
Talocan Exchange Depot
If the Talocan have numerology, the static gate suggests that it is about Four:
I am reminded by the image storage facility that I took these pictures eight years ago, which is a bit of a shock. Shock aside, yes, the Triglavians could be a splinter cell of Talocan, but in that scenario there should be some discussion of the Talocan who refused to embrace the Truth Of Three.
1 Like
But there is no evidence of the connection, while our encounters with Talocan remnants in wormhole space provides a fair bit of evidence that it is not true.
The thing I like to keep in mind here is that there has been a literal abyss of time between the evacuation of Anoikis and present day. The Sleepers were wired into their structures and left to rot for so long that their bodies were withered away even in suspended animation, and they needed to harvest our corpses and use unfathomable biotechnology to escape.
The Talocan may have been active for this entire time, so who knows what bizarre changes may have occurred in their society by now. All we know of them comes from ancient remnants in Anoikis and some relics across New Eden, and those are all incredibly old.
1 Like
Yes, we know there were multiple Jovian splinter cells, so the same can certainly be true for the Talocan. However, the fact remains that the archaeological record precludes an (ancient) Talocan numerology of Three.
I know I have a picture of a Talocan frigate somewhere… as I recall it looked a bit like an elongated pod. I believe it was also damaged. From that, we-of-the-time concluded the Sleepers and Talocan were at war. So that is a potential link. However, it is also very much at risk of being confirmation bias.
Quick historical recap:
Thousands of years ago, Amarr experienced a so called “War In Heaven.” The Amarrians witnesses were of no importance to the war. Apologies, ancestors. Eventually, “angels” came down and gave the Amarrians two relics. These relics were of a sufficiently advanced technology that a splinter learned how to travel through the stars after stealing them. This splinter cell then splintered into ancestors of the Blood Raiders and ancestors of the Gallente. No, really.
So… documented history with physical artifacts gives us a “War In Heaven” between space-traveling civilizations thousands of years ago. Wormhole ruins give us physical evidence of Jovian/Sleeper and Talocan civilizations “sharing” space in a time frame consistent with this war.
Today, we have a continuation of hostilities.
The parties are Jovian/Sleeper, yes, yes, good and… Triglavian. Of course. This may indicate that the Triglavians are a splinter cell of the Talocan continuing the ancient hostilities. It may also indicate that the Sleeper/Talocan civilizations were fighting together against the Triglavians.
I suppose if it weren’t ambiguous, that would just be terribly dull.
But despite being a nemesis precursor civilization with planet-shattering kaboom technology, I have to agree that the Triglavians really don’t seem to be that concerned with eradicating us. I’m not sure why we attacked them.
Why have we attacked them?
I was still crushed between diamond dust and metallic hydrogen for that part. Is it the usual pod brain ■■■■■■■■? Duh, I see something, duh, I will blinky light it, duh, poke button? That sort of thing?
Anyway, I look forward to meeting a Jungian splinter cell in a few years. I’ve been meaning to go in for analysis, but have never gotten around to it…
1 Like
I’m very confident that the Talocan are not who we’re encountering in the Abyss - given the Epicenter sites and the fact that all of what happened with Caroline’s Star (and seyllin by extension) seem to relate to them & the talocan, I don’t think we’ve seen any similar levels of capability in anything we’ve seen with the Triglavians yet.
That, and they not only have a seemingly intimate knowledge of the Second Jove Empire, their damage module also needs Sleeper encryption methods in order to produce a tech II version of, meaning their tech in that area is closest to Sleeper and, resultedly, Jove tech -making me very certain that we’re dealing with yet another Jove splinter faction, which has been separated from New Eden since at most the Second Empire era around two thousand years ago.
4 Likes
We haven’t. We’ve entered into a testing grounds they designed, using a method they appear to have handed CONCORD. Once within their testing grounds, we’re being tested… by them.
We have not attacked them. We have only put ourselves into their maze, hunting the cheese they’ve set out for our rodent butts.
2 Likes
I hadn’t considered the Triglavians as a Jove faction.
That completely eliminates my complaint about just how many of these civilizations there can really be.
It also eliminates the problem of not-base-three Talocan ruins, while remaining perfectly consistent with Amarr’s observation of a “War In Heaven” thousands of years ago. Under this scenario, the Talocan may have been neutral third parties caught in the crossfire.
Unless the war literally happened in the skies over Athra, they’d have observed nothing. If it had, they’d have observed nothing more definitive than a meteor shower.
1 Like
“It” (or a skirmish thereof) happened in the skies over Athra. Insert scriptural descriptions of plagues and calamities. The “Sefrim” then descended from “Heaven” and lived with the Emperor for a hundred years until the relics were stolen.
Looking back through this remarkable tome:
Remarkable Tome
(a document compiled I believe during the Arek-Jaaah-something initiative)
page 53, reminds that the faces of the Sefrim were covered.
I had completely forgotten that. It’s been eight years. I retract my earlier pooh-poohing of the Triglavian masks and identify this as an additional connection between the Triglavians and Amarr.
Furthermore, the behavior of the “Sefrim” is consistent with a civilization interested in “testing” those it encounters.
Consequently, I have been wrong to express exasperation at just how many of these precursor civilizations there seem to be - the Triglavians are not a new one. I’m just going to state that Uriel is right, the Triglavians are a Jovian faction, they date to the Second Empire, and furthermore they are the Sefrim. No, really.
3 Likes
Alternatively, it’s a fanciful tale and nothing more.
(( As a point, that’s an OOC document. ))
1 Like
Lol. Your agreement is hardly important. The dots align beautifully.
I’m edging towards the hivemind being Sansha. They are one of the primary groups seen in the billboard video. Makes sense to see Triglavians commenting on them. I can understand the corruption in that it’s a dictatorship with everyone under control of their implants, and, as I understand it a modified version of Jove tech. As to the Triglavians, I think the names we have are misleading, maybe some of them are interpretations or even derogatory terms, but they are certainly some form of precursor group. We don’t know when they left the cluster, as Uriel has said the info they have seems to point towards around the rise of the second empire perhaps.
3 Likes
By the way, the pieces fit - from the output of the semiosis conduits, that is:
This shows further construction on the vessel, showing the right wing to extend far beyond the current stage as it nears completion - meaning that, should the other side grow to meet it, the vessel will be in excess of 56.000m wide across its forward wings.
It’s apparent to me by now that we’re receiving info meant to be given to other Triglavian Collective members through these consoles, which we seem to have plundered from the construction site - I might imagine this isn’t supposed to be a part of our Proving.
5 Likes
its also possible that it is yet another step in the proving, not only do we need to best one of their fleets to attain them, a more robust one than generally encountered at that. but then the “reward” for doing so, is snippets of information distributed (presumably) only to those who had successfully managed to pass that particular “proving”. those fragments themselves may be yet another layer of testing.
The trigs are obviously a martial culture, but also one that seems to value intellect and encryptions, its possible that the information we are receiving is intentionally fragmented, to see if we manage to crack the code.
it may be worth going back through their messages, to see if there is another pattern that might be more evident as we collect more pieces.
It also looks, from the video you uploaded, that there are only 3 more pieces missing, if the pattern of messages coming out at the end of each week continues, we may well have a complete image by the end of next week.
1 Like