Guys, can I borrow 5 ISK? I need it for a parking meter
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I’ve postulated that they use some kind of Sleeper Construct VR environment. That would allow them to simulate and earlier, or possible future outcomes of decisions. Which could account for their time-sense.
I’m interested in this bit. Seems like Veles and Svarog may be at odds over the rogue drones, with Perun sitting on the fence.
The reverse-time entreaties of Svarog Clade of poshlost vila and Veles Clade of sobornost vila stand balanced in now-time with the indeterminate-consent of Perun Clade.
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While taking a shower I realized sth. We know the Data clearly encompasses Military logs and a certain thing is missing from the over all data dump: Names. Not a single individual is named through the logs. For military logs I’d say its customary to have any kind of commanding officer to be actually listed. Overall these logs read a lot like the Trigralvian Collective itself would be a hivemind? That’s maybe why they fear other hiveminds as those could possibly “take over” through “infection” due to the inter connectivity inherent to hiveminds. Individuals are way less dangerous as they do not have the perspective nor the ability to do so. This would also explain the conflict with the drifters/sleepers: it’s biological rivalry.
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It is a possibility, though names are kind of irrelevant when everything is cut into precise hierarchy, as it seem to be the case.
in our culture, we use names because we are very individualistic, when in war for exemple, it is the whole effort that is awarded and then we do not use names either, we use things like “the 3rd squad of the 2 wind of the 5th fleet”, it sound familiar no?
I would add that it is possible (likely even) that those “logs” are what the collective want us to read.
Given their likeness for enigma and “proving” it would not surprise me at all.
Remember that it was inside drifter ships that we first learned their existence.
Ships that were transporting messages from the collective to us (how else could the triglavian oriented enigmas could be interpreted?
The collective seem to have much more advance in their study of US than our study of THEM.
So yes, it IS possible that they are a using some kind of hive mind tech. But first, it would be a very different kind of hive mind, not one were their a “queen” (or kind or whatever) but a hove mind where every part can vote in the consensus. the recurrence of the concept of metaxy prove this point.
Second, we simply do not know enough about them.
But as much of the other theories, it could be right and I would personally love to see a true hive mind like this, not a mockery based on enslavement of minds.
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I think I would maybe describe it as a compartmentalized hive mind? Maybe an multi cellular organism? With for example the different drone hive minds beeing single cell entities?
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No, just a hierarchy. When discussing official matters within the Alliance’s power structure, I never say things like ‘Well, I thought X, but [person] wanted Y’, I say ‘The fitting team is recommending…’.
Because it’s not just me. It’s my decision what to recommend, ultimately, but that decision isn’t made in a vacuum. My whole team weighs in, presents options, explains things to me and one another, and we hash it out and come to a consensus about what I’m deciding.
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could be.
As long as we do not learn more about their biology, we will never know for sure (well of course, except if is written black on white somewhere).
after giving the uninteresting answer, my thoughts on your theory ^^
it is actually pretty close of what I initially thought too, given their supposed use of infomorph tech, it is very possible that for them the body and the mind are two very separate things and that they could risk multiple bodies at once without risking their “true” self.
maybe they are even a entire civilisation of clones, it would explain their need of separation in neat boxes.
The thing about compartmentalized hive mind is that it would make it impermeable to the corruption they seem to avoid (in the same way a compartmentalized ship would not sink if a breach appear, or more “naturally”, the lizard’s tail .
I think the use of “hive mind” is wrong in what you try to describe because a hive mind, it would need a better word but I can’t think of one.
this talk remind me of an old game of my youth were their was a faction of robots that had actually this exact problem.
being all linked one with another (per server at least) some of them would be hive mind in the common sens (a leader, all other are servants) and some other would actually keep a form of individuality, and seeking a consensus before making a decision.
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Now imagine you would protocol/log the meeting where you present the fitting teams recommendation. Within such a transcript it would be customary to put down the individual who presents the recommendation.
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No, it’s not. In our meeting minutes, it would show it as ‘The fitting team recommends X’. ‘GSOL indicates ABC capabilities right now.’ ‘The FC team reports this many Skirmish Commanders may be ready for promotion to Operations-level and battleship keys.’ etc.
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Just because you developed countermeasures against sth. does not mean you no longer fear it. It could very well be that compartmentalization was developed in order to contain any intrusion on a hive mind level.
Also regarding definition, if we go with for example the Navka hive mind being a single cell organism and the Triglavian Collective being a multi cellular organism in its structure the TC would a be “hive-cluster”, an entity made up of hiveminds.
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well, to be honest, it is yet to see in wich way the “navka” drone faction work:
- it is simply monitored by the collective ? (and the drone only took the name of their chief)
- is actually part of the collective ? (and the TC are in new eden since much time)
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So let me get this straight.
The TDLR on these things should be…
They are absolutely useless unless you want to become a code breaker and learn some game lore???.
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can someone piece each of the lore together?
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@Adam_Parvi There is multiple sources trying to do it, for exemple there is some wikis on the various things to know of in our cluster.
If it is the triglavian that interest you, you can always refer to this thread.
Of course I think you would have no problem finding what you want to know and never hesitate to ask questions (in appropriate fashion and the right places of course ^^
Knowledge is made to be shared, not withhold.
((Out of character help))
((but bear in mind that the Intergalactic Summit part of the forum is a “Inside of character” one. Meaning that it is “you” as a character that speak, not the “you” as a player.
For exemple, OOC, it is likely that the ancient enemy the triglavian speak of are “the other” that we, as players, know through books, chronicles, etc but that probably very few character know of (if any).
Of course, if you need help, don’t hesitate to ask questions, the lore can be intimidating and it can be hard to get into, but it is really cool ^^
PS:: Please, to others, do not flag this post this time, yes I know, it is kind of “off topic” but if we want to see the RP community grow, we must tolerate this kind of small digression, other wise it only give an elitist appearance, at least based on my experiences. ))
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Because we are the Dead,
Cast into the void to purify Tenebrae,
Because we are the Undead,
For the Chosen one, allowed, brought Light from Heaven.
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I’m trying to piece stuff together, some of us have a pretty good picture of how it all hangs together, pieced from snippets here and there. I even something else to examine more closely today.
Hive mind and Hive linked are sort of a misnomer, although accurate in their own ways. A Sleeper, or Drifter Hive, is a place with bodies or minds in cryostasis, like cells in a beehive. Its not a group mind, in an Iain M. Banks sense, but close to it. They are all individuals, with freedom to act as they want, but with instant access to a cultural repository of knowledge which basically contains the status quo for their culture. That information is disseminated to everybody at once, like the way information is communicated by a queen in a beehive.
With the Drifters and Sleepers there may be more to it. As in I’m pretty sure there is only one of each Tyrant, so one Cassandra, one Apollo, and they multi-box from a specific ship. Hit that ship and and they lose AI, until the controlling Tyrant takes full control of one of the rest. That is precisely what happens when fighting Deathballs.
Triglavians use the same kind of technology, Overminds with drones, and the way a noema is posted for discussion. Both Uriel and myself are in agreement that Navka are some form of ethereal Triglavian entities, they don’t have bodies. That gives us a number of interesting possibilities.
Navka as literal souls of the dead, as in the ghost of Grious from Templar One; ‘The Jove imprinted on the memory stack of this AI no longer exists.’
Navka as synthetic sentient AI personalities. Perhaps those born just after the Other.
They could be Sleeper minds rescued from the attack of the Other, which I am becoming doubtful of, or simply dead Triglavians with no clone to return to. That goes against the ‘One mind, one body’ rule but circumstances may dictate a need to adapt. Its possible that they use drone bodies.
We really don’t have enough information to be totally sure. They seem to act as advisors and lore keepers, perhaps guardians of the cultural data bank. I get that impression; the Koschoi put the point of view of the Capsuleers, the Narodnya the point of view of the people and the Navka weigh the choices in the balance. Then say ‘Well from an analytical and historical perspective this option makes most sense.’
I’m certain the corruption referred to is the trace of the Other, as in the overlaid infomorph signature detected in Empress Jamyl.
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