Are you taking the plunge on PvE? Then allow PvE corps! (Like NPC corps, just for high sec)

(Marcus Luttrell Khan) #21

Short and simple: You consent to PVP when you undock your ship. If you don’t like it, this isn’t the game for you.

(Merin Ryskin) #22

Yes, and nothing about this proposal changes that fact. You gain no additional PvP immunity that you don’t already have by using the option to stay in an NPC corp.

(Lugh Crow-Slave) #23

what are you talking about? there are loads of ganking groups that love this. no way you haven’t heard of CODE. hell I used to be a part of one a few years back.

tbh if you want to have a “flag” so to speak you should become a target for it. the idea that small corps are at risk of a war dec let alone constant decks is a myth anyway. When something like that does happen you can bet they asked for it in some way

(Cade Windstalker) #24

It’s a myth that all small corps are constantly dec’d, but it’s not a myth that small corps get randomly dec’d for little to no reason.

I’ve been dec’d for the atrocious crime of being on the same grid as a Fortizar bash in an Ishtar. The dec lasted all of a week and expired. I’ve also known people with small corps of 10 or less people who got dec’d completely at random, because one of their members runs Incursions, and because someone was offended by something they said over fleet coms that was in no way directed at the person who made the war dec.

If gankers want to take advantage of something like this then… so what? Gankers get to have community too, that’s not something that should be denied to any group in Eve, the only thing I’m taking exception with here is the idea that this will mainly benefit gankers. Most of the dedicated ones are perma -10 anyway or are part of groups like CODE. who don’t even give a sliver of a #@#% about wars.

(Lugh Crow-Slave) #25

all valid reasons and the odds of actually seeing a WT are low unless you did something that makes it worth their time to come after you

(Cade Windstalker) #26

This is kinda contradicting your earlier point. These ‘valid reasons’ basically boil down to being in a corp that can be war dec’d and undocking.

Sure experienced players can mostly shrug off a war without adjusting their play much, but to newer and less experienced players (the groups that pseudo-NPC corps would be aimed at) wars are kinda scary because most of these people have gotten into Eve hearing what a scary and unforgiving place it is.

For context I’ve literally seen, in NPC corp chat (on alts, obviously), people advocating that leaving the NPC corps is a ‘scam’ and you should never do it. Citing reasons ranging from scam corps to wars, and other people have seen similar things. It’s not a ubiquitous viewpoint but that it exists at all should be a little worrying to anyone who cares about new players and player retention.

(Lugh Crow-Slave) #27

and the only way to get over that is to be in a war dec and see they are not scary. with this WD are not the problem incompetent and unqualified CEOs are.
worst case these social corps just cause an extension of the problem we see with ppl not leaving HS in the first few months almost never leaving hs

(Cade Windstalker) #28

I disagree with your basic premise here. You can get over this simply by learning more about the game and hearing about it from other experienced players, but first you need to retain the player long enough for them to learn no matter how they go about doing it.

Creating psudo-NPC corps would create a stepping stone from NPC corps to “real” player corps. This would allow players to self-organize or get recruited out of an NPC corp and into a community with little change in gameplay, and then if their community gets bigger or the player starts to get interesting in more things they can either transition the corp to a “real” corp or the player can leave and join a real corp.

For example a small group of players from an NPC corp may decide to start a pseudo-corp to more easily play together. Then as they progress in the game they have reason to want to purchase and own a structure, so they decide to transition to a real corp so they can buy and anchor one.

I’m curious where the stats about players not leaving High Sec comes from. I don’t think I’ve seen stats on that presented by CCP and I’m a little skeptical of what metrics might have gone into stats like that, since things like mission, industry, hauling, or market alts will very intentionally never leave High Sec but that doesn’t mean the player behind them is never going to leave.

It also kind of assumes that the core problem with player retention is in people not leaving High Sec, when the main metric behind player retention in Eve is interaction with others and making friends in the game, same as with every other MMO.

(Lugh Crow-Slave) #29

NPC corps do this already. hell the newb NPC corps are probably THE best place for a new player to be in if anything we should NOT be further encouraging them to join up into a corp led by a CEO that cant even manage a standard corp.

(Lugh Crow-Slave) #30

I didn’t say they quit playing I said they don’t often leave HS

(Cade Windstalker) #31

They’re really not though… there are people there sure, but there’s no incentive to interact and it’s easy to feel lost in the crowd so to speak. There’s also little chance of running into the same people and very little culture of asking for help with things or actually acting as a community in the newbie NPC corps.

If you compare how things work in Eve Uni vs the NPC corps it’s a complete change in culture and activity level despite the NPC corps having, on paper, far more people than a group like Eve Uni which is already quite large.

I also feel like you’re focusing overly much on the leadership aspect of things here. Yes, good leadership is important to a corp, but if you think about the general MMO structure and flow most small groups don’t have much in terms of leadership and in other games there’s no real requirement for it. In something like WoW stuff like raid points is a thing for larger guilds that are into end-game content, and that’s most of the management that needs to be done. In Eve if you get war-dec’d you need to actually organize and lead a response, which is a pretty big step up in people skills and organizational ability.

Having a “baby’s first corp” would provide that “let’s go have fun with friends” experience without the risk and added management cost.

Seriously roll an alpha or an alt or something and go spend a few days in an NPC corp and watch the chat. If there’s anything going on at all it’s little to nothing of the “players playing with each other” experience and a whole lot of the help-chat vibe to it.

In comparison in my first month in Eve Uni way back in the day I got invited to do group missions, had people chatting with me about my longer term plans and what I wanted to do in the game, and had a group of people pay to replace a Drake I lost due to stupidity and overconfidence in one of the aforementioned mission fleets.

Basically what I’m saying here is pseudo-corps and maybe mechanisms for pushing players towards them would help newer players find people to actually play with without the worries about scams and wars that push them away from joining a “real” corp. Nothing to do with the leadership, just the player perception and how newbies tend to talk about Eve and corp life.

(Lugh Crow-Slave) #32

have you spent any amount of time in the newbie NPC corps? what you discrabed sounds like the standard NPC corps the newbie ones have a much stronger identity. Coming from the characters in them have always been in them since their creation. The last two years this has exploded with many of the newbie corps competing with each other to be the “best” corp.

(Cade Windstalker) #33

I’ve got two alts still in the newbie NPC corps, that’s literally what I’m going off of and I’ve seen exactly none of what you’re describing.

(Abyss Azizora) #34

Unless the idea at least removes the 11% npc tax, I’ll just be using 1 man corps for all my money making alts, wardec spam to your hearts content, it costs me 10 sec to make a new corp. The idea has to be better than 1 man corps (Or just disposable corps where everyone moves to a new corp soon as wardec spam starts.) or the npc corp. Otherwise this is pointless.

For the record though, I 100% support some form of social mini-corp that is immune to the plague to wardec spammers. They just need to be somewhat limited to not obsolete normal corps.

(yellow parasol) #35

That’s a new one for me. Thank you for sharing. it belongs on the list already containing “rush to lvl4s”, “lowsec is an instant death trap”, “trust no one out there” and “go mining if you want to make money”.

(Daichi Yamato) #36

Recently got a mail from someone trying to make a hi-sec community through chat windows. He was telling everyone that joining any corp that had a corp tax was a scam.

Couldn’t believe it.

(Cade Windstalker) #37

I’m honestly surprised your list is that short…

Case and point:

(Lugh Crow-Slave) #38

To be fair most of them are.

Three amount of players who set up “pve corps” then just mass recruit new players into them is ridiculous. But it’s some of the highest passive income you can make. Knew one guy who tricked some one else into organizing and running his corp for him even.

(yellow parasol) #39

Report them in Crime & Punishment, when you see it happening.

(system) #40

This topic was automatically closed 90 days after the last reply. New replies are no longer allowed.