having to train into t2 to get a good armarr ship is a utter fail. lasers and blasters are the only ones that have to deal with real draw backs, not theoretical ones like caldari/mins. Amarr so great its attack cruiser is the worst in the game. Brilliant. Fix Amarr, Fix Armor, Fix Blasters. Fix Gallente. One once for god sake.
Did you perhaps bother to check all the t1 cruisers though, or are you just cherry picking?
crappy ewars are slightly lower including the arby. The caracal/stabber/rupture/vexor and thorax are all way way higher. So yes, Amarr does infact suffer from the single bonuses. being able to shoot the gun isnt a bonus. its poor development. t1 amarr sucks ass plain and simple.
I think whatâs hard is TD gets the shaft because kiting is meta and most use missiles to kite cause easier.
Now an interesting fix to me would just be to make TD general weapon disruption and go from there.
TD is a pita without bonuses. its completely unneeded.
Oh and since you are basing your arguments on zkillâŚI guess we should all just fly in only pods. They are after all the 9th all time highest rank, unless ofc we can fly the great ships of Sabre, Loki, Steletto, Hurricane, Proteus, Malediction, Tengu, and the Drake. âOh you can fly a Legion? better just come in a pod! Oh you fly an AvatarâŚnah I rather you fly in a pod.â Or with your screenshotâŚRagnarok? Nah fly a Moa instead.
Just because something is popular, doesnât mean itâs better than the less popular ones.
this is a terrible argument. thats exactly what it means most of the time. Most players will never waste time on dog â â â â ships, thus amarr. its a waste of time and sp.
More kb stats the more its being used which means its actually good.
Caldari have historically been the most preferred race at character creation, Iâm sure that has something to do with ship picks. Gal/Min have been about the same with Amarr being the least popular. Iâm sure that has more to do with how the races are described that with any ship picks. Most players will train up the ships of their race, especially frigates, destroyers, and cruisers before they even learn about fleet combat.
Amarr capitals actually tend to be the more popular ones though, with Gallente being a close contenderâŚlargely due to available implants. Even with recentish changes adding shield slave implants, Ragnaroks and Leviathans donât rank nearly as high as Avatar and Erebus do.
Popularity of a ship on zkill is does not tell us how good a ship is. It only shows what is popular.
the game is old, its well understood missiles never miss and they are a great platform. Thats why Caldari is number 1. Gal/min is more even till you you realize you fly slow bricks, blasters are easly out projected by everything so move to min/cal/ with the drone sp. Then there is armarr, you get all the drawbacks of lasers and armor while being easily alphad off the field by microwarping capless guns.
lasers suck, armor sucks, blasters suck. this isnt new information. People have just stopped complaining because they have never done anything to address it.
There is zero real draw backs of shield, missiles and projectiles. From drakes and hurricanes to tengus and lokis to munnins and cerbs, Zero balance in over 10 years time. Properly bonuses missiles and projectiles has reined supreme. This is undebatable.
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Thatâs your opinion.
I happen to enjoy lasers and armor tanking.
Blasters a quite fun on anti-kiters.
Clearly a masochist.
Its funny people come to the aid of lasers on here while ignoring whats actually OP. Just because u use it for fun doesnt make it good.
Vagabond receiving a unneeded buff and the Sac getting a range nerf sums up CCP balancing amarr as a whole. trash.
All thats left here really are the trolls.
Just because I disagree with you, that makes me a troll?
I think I know what the problem is. You just suck at using those weapons and armor tanking isnât your forte.
Did you ever consider that? That the problem may lie with you and not the game itself?
No. Probably not. Itâs the games fault and Iâm just some troll because I see it differently from you. Oh well. Canât be helped.
zkill stats dont lie. if they are good, the stats would follow. looking at you disintegrators, missiles and projectiles.
Looking at the low kb stats and saying its the players who are wrong, defies basic logic.
Donât tell that to hecates, Nightmares, Phantasms, brutix, deimos, gnosis (fit primarily with blasters), Abaddons, Vexors, Damnation (heavy armor), Beam Legion, armor HAM legion, Confessor, Retribution, Slicer, tormentor, Maller, Navy Aug, Paladin, Revelation (arguably the tankiest dread and best projection with scorch), Avatar⌠man this is a long list, but not exhaustive. Its almost like They do get used a lot, just not in the very specific circumstances you are wanting.
Blanket statement for armor being bad is just wrong, there are tons of armor ships that are popular in the meta and armor is arguably a lot stronger for brawling than shield is for the sole reason of RAHâs, which hard counter most ships and missile systems unless someone splits launchers/turrets to mix damage types.
Lasers are good, the problem is that Amarr has some bad ships for lasers, specifically in their battleship line-up. Though this has slowly changed with Abaddon getting a buff awhile back and now the Navy Geddon.
The other âproblemâ with lasers, isnât even lasers themselves, its that the current meta has heavily favored T2 minmatar which hard counters lasers through the resist profile. Such as the fleet Meta with Muninns and tackle ships like the Jaguar. The loki is also popular, but it doesnât have full T2 resists.
Lasers work well in that you have high range and in the case of pulse lasers, can flip between brawling and kiting instantly. Its why the Nomen, Slicer, Retri have been staples of small gang for years. Even the zealot works well (If you go by zkill youâll say it doesnât, but its a sleeper ship that people underestimate, but it can throw out 800 dps pretty easy with heavy beams and still swat down tackle or pressure bigger ships)
Drakes arenât really meta. They get used because theyâre cheap and tanky. You can slap a new player in one and they end up surviving long enough to learn things. Tenguâs are also not really meta outside of PVE or BLOPs tackle. Loki got some significant nerfs to fitting which made the old 720 fit not really viable without a bunch of pimping/abyssal rolling. Most Lokiâs now are HAM fit and the 720 fits are typically double LSE and pretty flimsy.
Also, how can you see zero balance when literally the Cerb is losing all its range bonuses except to HAMs (with no application bonuses) and the Muninn is changing from projectiles to Missiles with no range bonuses. Neither of these ships are going to be favorable for RLML spam due to no range bonuses, and the Muninn will have no range unless HML fit.
The zealot probably saw the fewest nerfs in the HAC pass, minus some targeting range reductions just to bring it in line with all the other HACs.
If thats the case, then zkill shows you never do anything except do massive fleet fights in Muninns and Cerbs. You have two solo kills and otherwise just participate in big fleet fights (which is fine).
Your perspective is literally whatever your FC tells you to fly and youâve never ventured into even trying ships outside the fleet meta to find their strengths. Why do we need to listen to repeatedly wrong opinions from someone who doesnât even fly the ships theyâre complaining about?
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Omen navy Does not require t2 skills and is amazing.
Coercer Great
Augerer Great for fleets
Arbitrator Great
Slicer Great does not require t2 skills
Harbinger â â â â â â â amazing ship does not require t2 skills.
Harbinger navy again amazing ship does not require t2 skills.
Also look at that list closely Astarte is under omen 
and astarte is a â â â â â â â nice ship that list doesnât show how good a ship is that list shoes how good the avg pilot is inside that ship.
A ship can be amazingly good and be low on that list because its hard to fly (hard to fly becuase usually its cap life is terrible and if you get inside scram range you die), Amarr ships in generally require a lot more piloting skill than the other races, I can tell you right now that if a pro was forced to use a t1 omen they would easily beat 3 moaâs piloted by other players just becuase they would be mwd scram web blaster fit and the omen would be mwd cap booster point and have massive damage and would win that fight 1v3.
Amarr ships are â â â â â â â amazing just keep practicing bro I would suggest buying 50 slicers and going crazy with them solo just for the experience.
I went and searched under Imperial Navy Slicer and this is what I found:
One amarr ship taking out all of that solo , I would agree Z kill doesnât lie but you also need to look in the right places.
What statistical analysis have you done on the data?
Whatâs the representative population?
Have you taken account for outliers? What is your criteria for a Q test.
Zkillboard is not statistical. Itâs raw data. Donât conflate the two.
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Ruined my favorite ship the Armageddon navy issue is now to the point its border line useless please consider changing back!!! It is just a regular Armageddon now with just with a 10% damage increase and a little more armor. And on a aesthetic note does not look right without its full complement of guns on the sides.
Its to the point now I donât want to play with this ship at all now no matter how I fit it Iâm not happy with it. Now in PVE level 4 missions take twice as long to complete them because the damage of the platform is nurffed so bad!! I feel like it takes forever to destroy one battleship and the extra drone space really doesnât help.
I made an Amarr character and put a lot of time into it just to use this ship I feel like all this work was for nothing, and no longer want to play this character. And the thought of building another character and putting a year in to it is sickening.
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Well you should be able to use the other Amarr Battleships still and eventually get the Paladin. I know itâs not the geddon hull, but the other Amarr Battleships are solid ships.
The Navy Apocâs an excellent mission runner but yes ultimately the Paladin will be your âI winâ button for lvl 4âs.
Sell it, their prices have spiked because other people want them. Then use your newfound isk to buy a Paladin, which is far superior to the old Navy Geddon and will blitz level4âs even faster.
The dps between the new and old navy geddon is nearly the same, its just your dps is now split between drones and lasers. The drones give you better damage selection as well. The extra mid gives you the option of a cap battery to offset the cap reduction loss.
Otherwise though, if it no longer satisfies your uses, then like mentioned, use a Paladin and be happy. Even if you canât currently fly a Paladin, it will be a shorter train into a Paladin, than it will be to make a whole new character.
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