Bounty System Removal


(David Mikael Brenner) #1

After giving this some considerable thought, as well as browsing through the forums to read what others have had to say as well, I’ve come to the conclusion that perhaps this mechanic is better suited being completely removed from the game instead of modified or enhanced.

The general consensus among players is that this system no longer has a meaningful purpose, neither adding nor subtracting to the overall gameplay mechanics, other than mildly irritating some players while mildly entertaining others. In fact, because of this, the solution everyone has posted in response to this meaningless bounty system is to simply ignore it entirely.

Considering this nearly unanimous mentality, I’m curious as to why this function still remains in the game at all. CCP has decided to remove numerous features this game once had on the basis that it either no longer serves its original function or is simply underutilized entirely, such as the Captain’s Quarters, or the eventual removal of in-game voice comms. In fact, most game developers (as well as any other entertainment industry out there) would later remove valueless, exploitable mechanics that do not contribute to the overall theme or functionality to their product, as this is a standard practice.

I dare say that the bounty system is actually currently undermining the otherwise successfully executed theme of being in control of your character’s destiny and consequences therein. For example, if I were to jump into a low security system right after being warned by the game’s UI that I’m am no longer protected by Concord, and this action results in my ship immediately getting blown up by a gate camp, then this is a consequence of my own actions. I wouldn’t blame the lack of any security forces, nor would I blame the gate campers that blew my ship up. My decision. My consequence.

Same could be said if I were to fly into Jita solo with an industrial ship carrying cargo worth billions of ISK without any protection or support and my ship gets suicide ganked. Once again, this would be a consequence of my own actions, as 1) I turned myself into a rather lucrative and easy target and 2) couldn’t be bothered to have with me a proper escort (not that this would have guaranteed my safety in the first place). I could have flown something less obvious, or carried less loot per trip, or could have avoided purchasing such expensive modules/ships in the first place. My decision. My consequence.

The same can even be said of Jita local. It would be my fault and my fault alone if I fell victim to one of the many scams spammed there on a regular basis. I am not required at all to give my ISK away to a “doubler”, nor am I required to accept any contracts, especially without inspecting them thoroughly. It would be my decision to participate in that, and the resulting consequence is of my own volition.

This is where I feel that the bounty system does not reflect the theme of these examples. Anyone at anytime can give anyone else as many bounties as they wish, for whatever total of ISK they wish to “invest” in, for whatever reason they so deem. Not necessarily because they were wrong some how by the one receiving the bounty. Not necessarily because they were frustrated or pestered. More often than not, simply because they are capable of doing so.

Getting a bounty placed on oneself is no longer a matter of that individual’s decision making (save for those who wish to exploit the system), and thus, no longer a consequence of their own actions. There are no warnings issued to anyone saying that by merely playing the game in and of itself, one is subjected to random and inconsequential bounties (other than the general “no one is truly safe in Eve” mentality that is readily advertised by the gaming community). One can even go out of one’s way to avoid receiving any attention at all and can still be targeted, sometimes merely because they have yet to receive a bounty in the first place.

So, with the majority of this rant out of the way (or TL:DR), I wish to bring myself back to my original question: Why is the bounty system still even in this game, when it no longer adds any meaningful contributions to gameplay and is nearly unanimously ignored all together (or is at the very least heavily requested to be changed)?


(Donkyhotay) #2

You’re right that the bounty system is completely useless and irrelevant. It will be removed the same day they remove the equally useless and irrelevant autopilot.


(Dyver Phycad) #3

Autopilot is neither useless not irrelevant. It’s helpful tool in many situations to get you from place A to B when you cannot actively play but need to go somewhere.


(David Mikael Brenner) #4

Let’s stay on point here, folks. While I can appreciate the sentiments for or against the use of the game’s autopilot, let’s keep this thread open for discussion concerning the original topic if and whenever possible.


(Dyver Phycad) #5

The original goal of this iteration of the bounty system was to allow everyone to tag random people for whatever they want. The apparent pointlessness was introduced to remove the previous pointlessness of farming bounties with your alt.

As long as EVE relies on alts, I don’t think there will be a bounty system that resembles something you understand by these words from movies or other games because most of the other proposed forms of a bounty system can usually be abused by alts. Long words short: I agree that we just could get rid of it, or just leave it and rename it to something like Gag Tag system.


(David Mikael Brenner) #6

Or at the very least get rid of that red “WANTED” label that is obnoxiously plastered across the bottom of your character’s face in bold text when your info is pulled up. While some of us may wish to take great pride in being associated as a wanted criminal, there are those of us that aren’t particularly thrilled at the notion.


(Qia Kare) #7

I believe the reason behind the removal of the above two services is because the development effort to modernize them going forward was greater than what they were worth.

CCP Falcon had this to say about the captain’s quarters:

And when voice was retired:

At present, EVE Voice is used by just 0.4% of our active pilots and it’s currently one of several more things holding us back from developing a 64-bit EVE client after the retirement of Captain’s Quarters last summer.
Source:
https://www.eveonline.com/article/p4g5k3/preparing-for-the-future-retirement-of-eve-voice

Removal of the bounty system would take development time and provide little benefit. People who ignore it would continue to do so. People who use it will continue to do so to relatively little effect.

I’m not advocating for the removal or retention of the feature, but only trying to answer your curiosity as a courtesy.


(David Mikael Brenner) #8

A fair and appropriate assessment. Perhaps the examples of changes CCP has made before in my original post is not the most cohesive argument for the removal of the bounty system.

Regardless though, I still find that the benefit of removing said system to be substantial enough to warrant the time and effort required to do so, as getting rid of it entirely merely saves the time, energy and effort required further re-evaluating and adjusting it in the future, while simultaneously streamlining their own product by “trimming the fat” (so to speak). After all, why have a mechanic in the game that serves no purpose and should be ignored entirely?

Of course, this is said without knowing the amount of time, money or assets available to CCP to enact such a change. I’m merely a player offering a player’s perspective.


(Do Little) #9

I’ll add a vote for simply eliminating the bounty system - anyone who has been playing the game for a while realizes that bounties are totally meaningless but new players can be discouraged by the “wanted” poster. The last thing the game needs is to discourage new players!


(David Mikael Brenner) #10

Exactly my sentiment.


(Uriel the Flame) #11

If they decide to implement this then make it optional because as you yourself notice the fact, some of us wear our Wanted signs with pride, and same goes for our bounties. :sunglasses:


So my man play this game
(David Mikael Brenner) #12

Yep. If we were to keep the bounty system in place, perhaps we could have some kind of toggle for the WANTED sign on our profiles. This would help keep character personification much more manageable. Those that received random bounties can at the very least keep their profile picture clear of the stigma, the criminals that love to be represented as such can proudly wear the sign, and those that wish to keep their criminal elements from being blatantly obvious can have the same option to clear or keep it.

For myself, as well as the kind of corporation I would like to one day have fully up and running, I believe that having the appropriate personification will be paramount in maintaining an identity as well as purpose, motivation and even morale to a degree. Even if the bounty mechanic is largely considered useless and ignored, it makes it at the very least a little bit harder to convince a potential client that we are both forthright and loyal when the very first impression they get of our character/corporation is “WANTED”.


(Uriel the Flame) #13

As for proper personification, just some fun fact: None of my characters, not even my thief alt, were ever convicted of criminal offense, not once was any of them CONCORDOKKEN, still I wear those signs and bounties with pride as they are a sign of fun social interactions and their end results, may them be random bounties or actual reactions to my actions.

Taking over an event site, stealing event loot, tackling and killing other thieves, baiting people and destroying them solo or by the help of others, laughing at someone in local chat, failed suicide gankers or people who got triggered into being CONCORDOKKEN for one of the earlier mentioned reasons, are all fun in-game interactions that can result in being bountied without being an actual criminal (at least according to the crimewatch definition) just to name a few, so bounty can be a fun thing even for non-criminals as well.


(David Mikael Brenner) #14

Right. And the majority of those actions I feel do in fact warrant at the very least the chance of getting a bounty placed upon you. After all, your actions and decisions earned you the appropriate consequence. As mentioned in my original post, I’m all for that mentality, as it makes sense. It’s the random, unwarranted ones that underhand the theme of “your action, your consequence” though. Even resolving a bounty through traditional means does not prevent the same player from once again placing another unwarranted bounty on you. Such a system that possesses no meaning or purpose beyond “the lulz”, is largely considered useless and ignored by most, and is entirely unregulated truly misses the mark as far as what a proper gameplay mechanic is.


(Do Little) #15

If it goes, I suspect it goes completely - a bit less legacy code to maintain.

I doubt many will miss it but, for those who do, perhaps CCP can sell wanted labels in the NES :slightly_smiling_face:


(David Mikael Brenner) #16

That is something I’m all for. :laughing:

And it would even generate a little more income for CCP in the process, so I see that as a win, win.


(Uriel the Flame) #17

This is a game, so I think doing things just for the lols is a perfectly justified reason to do things. It can be fun thus fulfill the goal of playing a game.

Like when I shoot miners with fireballs & snowballs I do it so give them some adrenaline rush without actually ganking them, thus some fun times without any real harm and they can even learn afk mining can be dangerous. From an ISK perspective it is a waste of time, it is just for the lols and is fun and most cases the miners also laugh at it when they realize there was never any real danger involved. Just one example.

I think putting a bounty on a new player is the same thing. Everyone knows it is meaningless and soon enough they will learn too as they ask around what they should do that they got a bounty for “no reason”. I think it is just a fun exaltation for new player. For example I even included a screenshot about my first ever bounty in my public screenshot library on Steam community. I think such things are part of the game and the EVE culture and shouldn’t be taken more seriously than what it is, a joke.

There are jokes and “just for the lols” actions with far worse consequences than random bounties so I think it is pointless to want them to go away. Though I also don’t see any harm if it is made optional, I don’t see it necessary but don’t have anything against it either.

You keep giving them such ideas and eventually will bite you in the behind. :stuck_out_tongue:


(Uriel the Flame) #18

While that was a joke and at the same time is a possibility, the true meaning of being bountied is based upon the fact that someone reacted to your actions in that way, while buying a Wanted sign is just sad and meaningless, just as if you put bounty on yourself is the same sad and meaningless thing, thus it sounds fun as a joke, I think it would be sad and meaningless if Wanted signs purchasable in the NES was actually implemented, even more so if this replaced the current system.


(David Mikael Brenner) #19

Again, I’m all for having some fun. A game can and should be lighthearted and fun at times. After all, this is the very reason we play games (unless you are chinese and trying to earn a paycheck).

Perhaps we need to remember though that one person’s vision of “fun” may deviate if not slightly from another’s.

And what a perfect example of this! The “fireballs and snowballs” serve a primary purpose: nice little festive aesthetic additions used in a celebratory fashion. A (perhaps unintentional) side purpose? Scaring the !@#$ out of miners thinking they are being attacked when they aren’t. Great, wholesome fun. Sign me up, in fact.

But what of the bounty system? What’s the primary purpose currently for it? Slapping “WANTED” signs on newer players that don’t know any better can be an unintentional side purpose that most can consider “fun” and harmless, sure. I’ll give you that all day. But the key word is this: “unintentional”. I’m fairly confident that CCP didn’t implement the changes to bounties for this reason. This is the point I’m trying to get across here. Beyond trying to minimize others from being able to exploit their bounty system to a certain degree, there is no longer a primary purpose behind the system itself.

This right here is honestly the only real issue that I see with the system, as more often than not, nowadays, it isn’t at all based on someone reacting to your own actions. People are simply doing so without any provocation whatsoever. Via your provided definition, the bounty system is still currently devoid of meaning.


(Sean Roach) #20

I get bountied because a character named “Bounty Bumper” is logged in and watching corp chat.
Or parked in a station when I fly through local.
What interaction did I have with him?