Capitals and Low-Sec: An abusive relationship

It kinda is a cop out answer.
Finding more friends is not always the answer. Nor should it be.

Se what happens on the Chinese server. That exact philosophy has brought them to a state where one group, basically, owns half of the game.

And it isn’t like these capital dropping groups are ‘that’ big. Some are only 20 man strong.
They just have the isk to field them, and it is to little or no risk to them. That does not sound like eve to me.
Risk free capital deployment.
Low-sec should be lawless, yes, but reserved for capital wielding groups? Really?
In my mind, that is more a Null-sec thing.
In Low-sec it just excludes a ton of people and a plethora of different engagement types, when the tactic and deployment philosophy is so widespread as it is.

If i wanted to fly with a hundred or thousands of friends, I would move to Null.
I can. I just don’t have any interest in that type of PVP.

I remember when Low-sec was the place to go for roams and interesting engagements. It isn’t any more. Haven’t been for some time.
Null-sec offers more of that content these days, but also involves a lot of politics… Meh…
And to be clear, My suggestion to fix this, is just that… A suggestion.
Capitals would still be insanely dangerous to dance with. But they would also be subject to the same risks as any other ship in low-sec. Seems fair to me.

Once upon a time we were the guys that were outgunned - We have more guns now. :thinking:

The idea of limiting cap jumping to null is silly and will never happen.

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Might be… Might be…

But I am not the only player that are tired of capitals ubiquitous nature in low. I meet many experienced players that have become apathetic to PVP in low. Still hoping to get good engagements… They are slowly drifting out of the game though. I don’t blame them.

I have also been playing 10 years or so.

Low-sec used to be fun for a much wider spectrum of groups. Small, big, same same, different day.

I feel you are misinterpreting what i’m saying. All I’m saying is that, right now, capitals are OP in low.
Not the amount of guns, nor the size of groups. I would not care if i met sub-cap gangs 5x my fleet size while roaming. That would still be more fun, as there would be a chance to kill something. Even if my entire fleet was lost.
Even meeting a cap fleet on the move would be almost certain death for the groups i fly with.
But meeting them on the move would be fun.

If not limiting Cynos in low for capitals, then what? Please enlighten me?
Rebalance capitals themselves? I would rather the Null-seccers be about that. Their tool for war, really.
Change the engagement philosophy of risk-averse low-sec cap droppers? Yeah… Not going to happen.

The risk of fielding capitals in low should be higher, because it is not really in balance with what capitals are capable of.

And don’t tell me being hot-dropped by a carrier while in a lone procurer, or gate-camping Titans isn’t totally ridiculous. Come on…

Remove cynos period imo

LoL Seems legit. :smiley:
But why?

maybe u should support this [Proposal.] Make Low sec a place PVP for All

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So people can’t just power project everywhere on the map. Carriers used to have low scan res but now not only are they able to jump in on top of a fight they can also lock your interceptors instantly. Remove the stupid scan res buff and reduce jump range vastly or remove it all together.

That or give battleships interceptor align times with nullification because that’s pretty much the equivalent of this super mobile cap proliferation.

Never mind it doesn’t matter. Small gang is dead and bots are rampant. This game is gonna die just like l2 since the bots can just skill inject their replacements. Great idea btw ccp, buying sp that is.

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You do have a point. I mean it’s one thing to bring in too much stuff for a simple mining barge, but just dropping caps ‘because you can’ for something so small would be something I’d look at on a killboard for a potential recruit when I was in the role in an alliance and go, no threat, didn’t look like it escalated, yeah I’m gonna pass on him, cap pilot or not. Sure I can do the same thing in something much less expensive but I’ll just take my insert expensive high performance car here to the store to buy that gallon milk from the store a block away in perfect weather.

Small gang is not dead: https://zkillboard.com/corporation/1678182457/

Severely nerf cynos, problem solved. Globally.

  1. Make ships jumping through cyno to be combat inoperational for few minutes (cannot activate anything that would give weapon aggression timer - no weapons, remote reps, ECM bursts and whatnot).

Possibly in addition to:

  1. Make ships unable to cloak, dock or tether for that duration. Makes mainly logistics riskier.

This eliminates hotdrops, but you would be still able to deploy capitals - open cyno in a SS, have them warp to another SS and wait until they are ready to fight, then warp in action.

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I would have said remove jump drives for normal caps and go back to blocking gate jumps for supers and titans.
The old arguments surrounding capitals being especially rare or expensive are manifestly untrue. With Haw dreads how are these not just glorified battleships with even more of the good stuff and mitigated drawbacks via jumpdrive?

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IMHO capitals belong to null sec soverenity warfare. So I am for the certain limits for them in low sec. Like you can not drop carrier on me if I am in novice plex. Wait… oh, you already can’t… never mind.
Low sec should stay as cool place for small gang or solo PvP. Where you do not need to roam for hours to find someone who agree to fight you. And if that someone will expect you to drop capitals on him, you chances to get the fight get lower.

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Your problem isn’t actually caps. It’s their application to subcaps.

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Well, 9 vs 4 isn’t being outgunned. How many more people do you need to counter a few with deeper wallets?
The next time, there might be 20 battleships. Either no-risk no fight, or perhaps the response might be 3 titans.

The big problem is that the only viable counter for a hotdrop is a counterdrop.

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I think i must fall in line with the peoples that think CAP dont have any “home” in LOW SEC
as combattants. Remove their ability to use fighters, or top slot modules (all caps.) in Low sec EMPIRE space…

Can always write it up as CONCORD taking measures to ensure the degree of lawlessness in low sec
space dosnt plumit of to a place they cant controle, and one wich the empires can stand aside to watch.

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Pffff… Well… I wouldn’t call piracy against industrialists, small-gang PVP.
Nor would I define small gang PVP as fielding capitals on capitals. Even if it only 2-7 people in the km.
And seeing how you have large capital groups/known hot-droppers on speed-dial, well… Resistance would be suicidal for most sub-cap fleets anyway.
Exactly my point with this post. I know, I know, you haven’t really dropped caps since august, but you haven’t really dropped much of anything in September, so yeah…

Interesting … :thinking:

I see what you are saying, but I would not like to see insta-warping battleships though… Nasty…

I like the suggestions! :smiley:
Would make capital ship deployment require more tactics to deploy at all.
Good compromise to Low-sec cap cyno ban.

But is it enough for lowsec? I mean… It would be pretty awesome hunting capital ships travelling in low…
I digress.

Thanks for the input, I’ll write it down together with the other stuff I’ve discussed as solutions.

I am very happy to see people are seeing the same problems as me. Keep up the debate!
And thanks for chiming in!

Possibly people would black ops more, which can’t be a bad thing.

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