CCP Please Stop Destroying EVE

Communications Center General Discussion
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I have explained why it is not representative, please stop ignoring anything that is inconvenient for you.

I’ve already explained this many times: the fact that the cited numbers do not account for alts, login sessions by PvP players that do not include a successful engagement, etc. The only question is how much higher the real number is.

I used to jump around nullsec all the time on multiple characters with absolutely no interest in combat PvP.

Fine, but you were in a space where PvP is the default. Not all of those jumps were related to PvP, but it’s a safe bet that the majority of activity the space with the fewest PvP restrictions is by people who are at least open to participating in PvP.

The same would happen if PvE were to end. Both are vital components of EVE.

100% wrong. Missions, anomalies, etc, add nothing to EVE. Any minor disruptions caused by their removal would be easy to fix without changing any of the core gameplay concepts of EVE.

Not specifically, but I’ve seen her verbally attacking almost every pilots I’ve ever seen suggesting PvE needs a buff and calling them “farmer trash”.

Yes, because the only buff these “people” can imagine is making PvE easier and making their wallet numbers go up faster. Sorry, but PvE is already easy and profitable enough, the last thing we need is more AFK farming.

But I imagine like most situations it’s really that he’s just arguing for a higher bar for those wishing to engage in it, which is immediately misrepresented by people like yourself.

No, he literally expects 100% removal of all PvP from highsec. Perhaps you should read what he actually posts before defending him?

Why does the identity of the poster seem to matter more to you than the content of the posts?

Because the “just one more PvP nerf” whiners are often dishonest about their true goals. They’ll lobby in a particular thread for “just one more nerf” and insist that the discussion be limited to that one nerf, when in reality that one nerf would be followed immediately by demands for the next nerf on their list. If someone is saying “just one minor change” in one place and directly contradicting themselves with "remove all PvP’ elsewhere then it absolutely is relevant that they are not making a good faith effort to discuss a particular change.

It’s very easy and very low risk to aggress someone who is not interested in fighting back

Only because highsec is full of coddled perma-victims who make themselves easy targets. There are already plenty of tools for not being a target, and no reason PvP should be nerfed to make up for their failure to use them.

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That safe haven is WoW. Leave EVE and go play a game that gives you what you want. Safe havens go directly against everything that makes EVE unique and interesting and it is not going to happen.

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Hes saying the most important ones, so I’m guessing he is talking about the bigger losses which are going to be haulers.

Unless there is a way for players to know for sure that a gank target is new, I dont see a reason why CCP should step in at all. A 5 day old alt from a 5 year old veteran is indistinguishable from a brand new player, and a 5 year old veteran can always set It up to be indistinguishable even from the server side of things.

The bigger problem is the mackinaws and hulks that mine in 1.0 and starter systems, thinking they will be safe.

Because it’s something you need to deal with if you want to leave the safety of a station.

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Yes.

That is a part of a sandbox game.

If you dont like interacting with other players, then you shouldn’t be playing an MMO specifically designed around interaction. You should play a single player game. No other player will bother you there.

Then go play those games.

No, because the entire premise of the game is built around not being safe, at almost any time when you are undocked.

Again, you are playing the wrong game if you expect or want a place where you are 100% safe. There are other games for that. I hear x4 foundations allow you to save and load, which would solve your problems. What about Elite dangerous? You can play single player there too.

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Sure, and you could find a dozen people who say that drinking coca cola is good for your health. And yet the general consensus amongst actual doctors is that it’s bad for your health.

The fact that people argue for or against something, means nothing unless they are able to provide valid arguments to support their claims. The fact of the matter is, and this is supported and quoted by developers, eve is a game where you can be killed at almost any place as long as you are undocked.

If you want to change the status quo, then bring good arguments, or play a different game.

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Well now, I rejoined for a month after a while and noticed things are getting shittier by the year. A) Increase of use of bot software and multi-accos by single player. That’s not fleeting with other living people. Where’s the fun in that? If you put a computer to auto-target ppl and waste them, it’s not you who’s getting the kill. Like that Typhoon gank in Amarr. and last death I got was from a goon swarm pilot with almost 30 characters under same pilot flying same ships. Sure you get money from that one player a lot, but the rest of us, we just cancel subscription. I haven’t heard from a large fleet fight in any news? Since I bet nobody bothers anymore with big ships. What I read from chats is ppl like to fly t1 destroyers now, even experienced pilots. Since they’ve grown tired of grinding for the bigger ones and their fits. I mean get the social aspect and honest old school gankings back. This botting thing is a waste of everybody’s time. Might as well play solitaire than fly multi-accos by yourself.

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Nobody will stop you. Bye!

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So you don’t want the social aspect of fleeting with other people back? And you love playing solitaire?

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Learn to read.

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yeah, you too, I was being sarcastic.

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No, you weren’t.

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You are way overblowing this.
There are only a very few people running any kind of significant sized multi account fleets… outside of mining that is. I’m seriously calling BS on someone running 30 PvP ships for example. Kusion manages 20 in 0.5 system ganks and that’s legendary.

And botting is a constant fight, and per stats one of the big areas is Null anom farming. Where you aren’t going to see fleets but a single bot.

If you want to fleet with people though, do so. There are still loads out there wanting fleets.
Complaining about a handful of big multi accounts while not bothering to interact with all the other players?

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Meta items are not essential at all. They’re occasionally useful for certain fits but are an extremely minor part of the game and could easily be put into the normal manufacturing system.

Mining is not PvE. And even if you classify a certain subset of miners who just passively obtain resources and sell them to the nearest open buy order (IOW, who avoid all of the PvP elements of industry as much as possible) as mostly-PvE there will still be plenty of PvP players who view mining as part of the game of competitive capitalism and will continue production.

Again though, first off that’s complete rubbish and secondly, it does not justify you attacking people. If your argument hinges on you attackign people then you have a weak argument.

{citation needed}

What improvements to PvE have I opposed with “farmer trash” that would be genuine improvements to the gameplay experience and not just “make AFK farming easier and make the numbers in my wallet go up faster”?

And no, my argument doesn’t hinge on attacking people. Attacking them is something I do in parallel with explaining why their ideas are stupid.

You want this game turned into nothing more than a PvP arena

Well that’s certainly a stupid claim to make given how many times I have argued against arena-style PvP.

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And yet, for all your concern over “think of the newbies”, when I proposed a system where newbies are 100% exempt from PvP for their first 30 days (or until they do things that only alts of veteran players do, like using injectors, lighting cynos, etc) in exchange for less protection for older players you rejected the idea entirely. It’s almost as if the newbies are just an excuse to protect established farmers from anything that could disrupt their farming…

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Weirdly calling someone by their main character name isn’t an attack. It’s just identifying the player.
While I’m not going to speak for Merin, please go through my posts and find somewhere where I declared something invalid because of who posted it… this may even exist as at some point I may have said it to the 1000th time someone said the same flawed thing. But that’s how hard you will have to look, and that’s what Merin is basically saying.

It’s very clear that PvP is an important part of EVE and is required in all areas of space to balance things. CCP clearly agree, see scarcity era right now as an attempt to balance production and destruction closer.

And remember that these “other MMOs without PvP” don’t have functional economies usually. they have ever escalating gold farms and male old content redundant every expansion and level raise. Something EVE can’t do.

Citation required because I’m pretty sure that would actually be a rule break anyway. Since constant eliberate targeting of newbies is a rule break no matter the system.

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Dude, how could you!

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This is a joke, right? Are you seriously comparing PvP, the primary driving force behind the entire EVE economy, with meta items that are just slight variations of other modules and could have been omitted entirely without any major gameplay effect?

So why is mining not PvE, but mission running is? If I run 40 AFK orcas is belts all day farming ore, that’s PvP is it?

Because the thing that determines the success or failure of mining is interaction with other players. The single specific act of activating a mining module on an asteroid doesn’t, but unless you’re just mindlessly dumping your minerals on the market to the nearest open buy order you’re engaging in PvP to get those minerals sold at the highest possible price and/or use them in other industry activities in competition with other players.

Contrast this with missions, where you get paid directly by the game and never have to compete with other players.

It clearly does though, which is why it’s all you ever bring to a discussion.

Only if you ignore all of the other criticism of stupid ideas that I post, explaining exactly why they are stupid. And if you think that the things I’ve said are so horrible then JFC you’ve lived a sheltered life.

Except of course that you’re always arguing for it.

{citation needed}

Please stop making up blatantly false claims. I have never argued for arena-style PvP, and have consistently argued against the concept ever being implemented in EVE.

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And, again, even if you classify certain miners as being close enough to PvE that the PvP elements don’t matter there are still plenty of PvP-focused industry players who would continue production and keep EVE running. Remove PvP, on the other hand, and the entire economy collapses and the game dies.

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Ok…
So your best example of right outside is 3 jumps from the nearest rookie system. Half of highsec is going to be that.
And I think you need to reread the rules. There is a catchall clause in there about deliberately targeting newbies in general. Specifically for people who want to abuse it.

Citation required. It’s at nearly 38k on server right now. There has been a slow but steady upwards trend over the last 3 months visible on EVE offline graphs.

Ah ok. So you know what I mean better than I know what I mean. Got it. Thanks for clarifying for myself what I was thinking…

  1. When referring to the economy the destruction of combat is the important part. So talking about other kinds of PvP is mostly a red herring.
  2. Who cares if PvE is important. This discussion lately hasn’t had much to do with PvE at all. It’s about PvP. So stop bringing up irrelevant things to distract. “What about me!!!”.
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You literally just replied to a bunch of valid points in the same post you are trying to claim this in. Simply because you disagree does not make a point invalid on its own.

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