Changes to the fleet fight notification system!


(Sgt Ocker) #1

We have changed the logic of this procedure. The notification tool now performs three checks, in this order:

Your start time may not be in the past.
Your finish time must be after your start time.
Your start time may not be within 25 hours of the 10:00 UTC that preceded the last downtime.
To put the third point another way: you must file a request at least one hour before the downtime prior to your anticipated battle.

While this change does clear up one issue the coming changes to structure reinforcement create the possibility for a large fight to occur on a node that is not ideal for the encounter.

EG;
Keepstar gets shield reinforced straight after downtime, attacker chose this time because the structures next vulnerability time is in 22 hours. FC’s on both sides know the timer will draw a large crowd but are left with no way to ensure the node is reinforced.

Maybe the minimum time for the first timer needs to be 24 hours to ensure large encounters can be prepared for both by players and CCP…
Having potentially thousands of players sitting around in a system for up to 4 hours waiting for a timer will be bad enough. Having to do it on a node that is not reinforced, well…


(Steve Ronuken) #2

iirc, with a high power structure, the first timer is always at least 24 hours away.


(mkint) #3

that less-convoluted phrasing of the 3rd point is still convoluted. Assuming my gibberish skills are correct, it’s saying that as long as there’s a downtime+1h before the fight, it’s good to go? So in theory, the minimum time is now a 1h notification?


(Steve Ronuken) #4

yeppers


(Sgt Ocker) #5

Sorry Steve but maybe you should go read the blog. 24 hours + - 2 hours either way.
A full power structure can come out in 22 hours. OR at least 2 hours BEFORE the node can be reinforced if it is initially hit straight after DT…

From the blog…

First reinforcement cycles last for between 22 and 50 hours, depending on when the attack takes place relative to the structure’s reinforcement time and on a random element. When a structure enters this first reinforced mode it determines when to become vulnerable again by looking forward to the next reinforcement time that takes place at least 24 hours after it entered reinforced mode and randomly adding or subtracting some amount time up to two hours in either direction.

My understanding of this would be - Timer is set by structure owners straight after DT (EG; 11.15 as soon as the sever is accepting connections) Attacker attacks shield at 11.16 (as soon as the server is accepting connections)- The armour timer could “depending on a random element” come out BEFORE DT the next day…
OR simply - You won’t have 25 hours until the next timer so the improved fleet fight notification system will automatically reject the form.


(Sgt Ocker) #6

Exactly, so if for some reason the time chosen by the random element is 22 hours, you may not have time to get the node reinforced.
Of course you won’t know this until it is too late anyway because the random element isn’t known to the players before it happens. 24 + - 2.

You may not even have time have time to notify Devs there will be a fight according to the 3rd point. If the shield is RF’d Straight after DT and the next invul timer is 24 hours later - You don’t have 25 hours till the next timer.


(mkint) #7

So… put in the notification before you attack the first time? Are there consequences to putting in a notification and then not having a fight? Are big takedowns so spontaneous that it’s like ‘oh, I guess we’re going to take down a structure right this minute, one that we’re willing to rally 3,000 of our closest friends to complete, everyone form up.’? Legitimate questions, I’ve never organized a structure takedown, much less for a big bloc. edit: and how fast do shields come down on the kind of structure that would lead to a bloc fight? Including fleeting up, getting to the location, and knocking out the shields? Less than 3 hours?


(Sgt Ocker) #8

Lol - That could be interesting, though it wouldn’t help a great deal as in the scenario I am using - The fight could be either before OR after DT…
So you would have to notify Devs you plan on having a fight that could cover 2 DT’s due to the system mapping being done at DT and the timer coming out at a random time 2 hours either side of DT. I don’t think keeping nodes RF’d for days at a time is the intended role of the notification system…

I imagine anyone with timers around DT will be requesting systems be RF’d for 2 days (going by DT server remapping) at a time as there is now a random element to when a timer can exit.

NB; It is surprising how a simple structure RF can turn into a massive brawl - The nature of coalitions and 3rd parties ruling TQ guarantee, anything worth fighting for will be blobbed to death by anyone who can get there. TIDI is wonderful for this, you can have hours to form up and travel and still be in time for the fight.


(mkint) #9

Well, it sounds like given the requirements of the notification system, that’s the best option… notify early. It’s not like the reinforced nodes are getting used for anything else, are they? And forgive my ignorance, but how many of the big bloc fights happen right at downtime? This strikes me as an unlikely scenario, one that can be adapted for in advance. Some quick (bad) math makes it look like it only has a 2% chance of any bloc fight being this kind of fight.


(Sgt Ocker) #10

Doesn’t have to be a “bloc” fight to get TIDI happening - As tidi can kick in at anything over a few hundred in system (and gets worse as more enter) having nodes RF’d is the best option…

A lot of groups use the AU TZ (when DT happens) as their vulnerability time for structures, it is usually the quietest TZ but this can quickly change with a few well placed pings. People will login at a moments notice if there is potential for a big fight regardless of where they live.

Notify early only works for the attacker. If the attacker feels they have the advantage with TIDI (sometimes TIDI works in your favour) they won’t put in a notification. The defender may not have the required 25 hours to put one in.
I also believe that if CCP starts getting too many early requests that don’t generate content they will make the requirements stricter.

NB; IMO these changes make no difference to the blocs, they are pretty much immune to any sort of attack that will cause them to lose anything they don’t want to lose (just as they are now). The affects of this change will only have an impact on smaller groups, who don’t have bloc numbers to protect them.


(system) #11

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