I wrote up a proposal of an idea for CCP that adds a twist to the cat and mouse aspects of gate camping. I believe the post is too long to post as a forum post, so I posted on a blog, hopefully this is not too taboo. Feel free to comment here (or the blog), I’ll try to pay attention to both.
Do enjoy. I figure some people will find the idea offensive… while others might really like. I am a developer so I tried to layout a solid concept of what I was asking for, and how it “could” work (not how it has too). But I am not a developer for CCP (nor am I looking to be at this time), so I do not know about how practical or achievable it would be. I understand eve is a huge game and even small changes can drastically change the balance, so… this is nothing more than idea that I would love to see implemented in some form or fashion. And I’m bringing it here for discussion and thoughts and hopefully expose the idea to other players and CCP.
I think your idea is a fresh breath of air. Not only that, I like how you break out the already-prominent tools and methods players have concoted to fight the gatecamp.
I’d be honored if you’d read my reddit post that suggests something of the same, wrapped up in a greater dialogue that is my New Player story. You can find it here
I think this universe has great promise… but to me, it feels so small and with no mystery left. People may say EVE isn’t dying, but the data proves otherwise… there’s a fantastical flight away from New Eden and it appears only the hardcore jaded don’t mind.
Well that is part of the picture… Yes you should have alts and teams, I do not want to undo that. However sometimes you want to know what is on the other side of a gate.
Either in a fleet with lots of mixed intel… is there a bubble? 600 ships? dead space?
As a hauler or explorer in dangerous space… when you are alone.
If this happened in real life… say with people hauling tractor trailers… do you think corporations would just throw more people at it? maybe… or do you think they would find ways to outsmart them first? Get better intel and if that didn’t work they would then throw more people… and still try to get better information. It is a level of risk a real corp would not typically accept without an advantage. I think they would take All the advantages they could get including banding together, working with collection, getting more people, and… if possible trying to see if where they were going was safe in real time…
It is just an idea, and like I said some people won’t like it… you don’t have to. And I’m not saying it is a brilliant idea, but If I were in space… and had to move stuff (with real lives, and valuable goods) I would expend fortunes making sure there were safer ways to move in hostile situations, and have good teams, and equipment, etc. But… given these are “space pixels” the logic is a bit different… so.
I love to gate camp, and I think this could change the dynamic of how that works. And I think we will still have TONS of people who will blindly jump anywhere.
Anyway, it was just an idea… if it s a bad one, that’s ok. Just figured I’d see if we could change something that has been unchanged… and maybe add some interest or strategy to it.
Perhaps that game mechanic has remained unchanged because ccp does not see being able to haul / fly around in almost 100% safety as something desireable for their game? It would seem the current situation is not an oversight but an intentional aspect of the game. I suspect what you see as a problem might not be seen as a problem by ccp.
Like your story, I agree the game does feel kinda hopeless and many of the long timers have “mapped” things out and done all the calculations and it is for many a story of follow the formula… wash rinse repeat.
Shaking things up would be good. The people who have done all the calculations and made the formulas will be the most resistant and think that it is stupid and bad because it means either they lose the edge, just like mega corporations in real life that fight a new technology because either they don’t have it or they are scared of it.
In either case, I don’t know as my idea would do anything good. But I would love to see things completely break many of the “calculations” and patterns of thought to get the old timers back on their heals a bit so they have to think, or at the very least adapt and recalculate like everyone else.
Perhaps, and I acknowledge that is probably the case. However that doesn’t mean we should look at new things or consider possibilities, if we don’t change things just because we never have or needed to… well I’m sure you can think of a parallel that follows that story. The changes most certainly would not introduce 100% safety, in fact it would only provided a small measure there of, and take time and resources in the doing. Both sides could use it, and it’s use would reveal details to the observers. It would simply be a source of information. You would have to sit at the gate in either case… and you would announce your presence on the other side… they could do the same thing to you.
Again, this may not be a great idea. It was just an idea, thank you for reading and considering it, and even for responding to it. You are probably right though it has stayed the same, probably for some plan or just because. I think that changing things like that can some times introduce new facets of thought, or even considering ways to change things can help add some fresh perspective. One of the others earlier (Koa Skoomasha) posted and I have to agree much of this game is calculated out by a few… and there really isn’t mystery. This is the ONLY game I’ve ever been in where players have to try to generate “content”… They don’t typically do that in other games, they play it and explore and figure out and have fun. But because everything is mapped and calculated to the nth degree… we have to “make” content because it isn’t fun when you just follow a formula day after day. Mathematical wars of attrition are rarely fun.
You should not be able to obtain intel so easily, IMO. As @Rosov_Aulmais indicates getting players to interact is a good thing. Introducing something that discourages such interaction is a bad thing.
So get a buddy in a travel ceptor. He can do that for you and you are interacting with others. Know what happens when people start interacting and even better working together…they stay with the game longer.
We are playing a game, not RL. For crying out loud our spaceships move like they are submarines, not spaceships. Of course lots of things make no sense in the game relative to RL, but they are there to either foster interaction or for game balance purposes or both.
First off we are immortal capsuleers in game. The notion of death has little to no meaning for us…so much so that we are feared by non-capsuleers. And there are safer ways to move stuff and avoid gate camps. Jump freighters for one by pass such problems.
Thank you for your points. I disagree on a few, but that is okay differing opinions are allowed, and hopefully this will get positive conversations going towards change. Best of luck to you. o7.
This might be good, if its a new ship, with very limited use, defense and offense and it takes time. Say 60+ secs.
You should not get the information instantly, the probe/drone has to send information over many light years, to you.
If the current probes and drones doesnt work at LY range, then the new ones needs to be beefy, big, expenssive and gimped in so many ways, to make up for it. It would basically be a giant transmitter, to be able to send information over that distance. Im thinking destroyer/cruiser size.
If you want free intel, on the other side of the gate, it has to have a counter aswell. Like a set time, before the scan is returned, so gate campers could shoot the probe/drone before it actually gets to send intel.
Its not a bad idea, it just needs balance, so its not overpowered, and so that an alt with actual eyes is way better then this, to encourage teamwork and not solo play.
Actually it is a pretty bad idea. It removes an incentive to cooperate with others, it lets a person gather intel with minimal to no risk, and I don’t see much room for counter play.
The interceptor is an ideal ship for a scout. With the immunity to bubbles you jump in and if travel fit, zoom, off you go before anyone can land a lock. You can check the gate, check local, and even check the out gate. Of course, you need an alt or a buddy.
The goal should be to encourage interactions…even interactions like getting caught in a gate camp, not trying to reduce such interactions. The former makes the game interesting and challenging, the latter just makes it boring. And people quite boring games.
You should really read the rest of my post where i write exactly the same as you state here…
It has to have a counter! It has to be slow to encourage other ways, like teamplay and coorporation and it has to be harder to use then using friends as scouts. Hence why i suggested a specific ship for it, with no other usses and a timer on the probe/drone that would be used for scan, so gate camps could counter it and still remain “unseen” by the guy trying to probe them.
But it could be a tool for solo players, if they have no other options, which is a perfectly viable way of playing eve to begin with.
But it does not encourage team play. It discourages it. Even if slow…how would it encourage cooperation? Sending in a buddy in a ceptor while waiting for the intel renders the entire idea moot. My buddy is in there and can look at local, hit d-scan and move around system.
Then what is the point? It is in a fairly useless ship that…nobody is going to be inclined to use…or using in very limited circumstances.
BTW, gate camps…they usually have a guy 1-2 systems out cloaked up off the gate. You won’t remain “unseen”.
What is the actual problem you’re trying to solve with this idea?
I’ve read through most of the post. it’s not nice to read, tbh, but not because of your writing, but the rather bad layout and white on black text. not complaining about you, though. you’re a programmer. i’ve seen coder colours that could give eye cancer.
Its a tool for solo players, but given that it has to be alot slower and alot more cumbersome then just throwing an alt into the system, it doesnt discourage teamwork at all. It encourages teamplay, over using this method, but at the same time it gives a tool to solo players, to use or not.
We have plenty of niche ships, for very specific purposes that rarely gets used, so that cant really be an excuse…
The unseen part refers to the gatecamp being able to destroy the probe before it sends information back to the ship which launched it, effectively still making the gate camp unseen by the guy using the probes.
Solo players is just as viable a gamestyle as anything else in eve, thats the very nature of this game. Do what ever you want.
It doesnt discourage interaction, it provides another level of interaction, if implemented correctly.
All im saying is, if something like this is to be implemented, it has to be gimped enough to encourage teamwork over using it.
Thank you for your points. I disagree on a few, but that is okay differing opinions are allowed, and hopefully this will get positive conversations going towards change. Best of luck to you. o7.